Playing with technique tonite I noticed that really fast hands at the release can cause my split times to improve by 2-3 seconds! By this I mean hands very fast away from the body, but creep the butt up the slide. Just another way to fool the erg into thinking I'm rowing harder than I am. However, this would generally translate into more speed in the boat because a quick clean release creates less drag. A fast sloppy release can however result in a crab and often an oarsperson injured or tossed out of the boat, catapulted by his oar. A crab is when the blade is feathered while still in the water.
Did anyone notice that our teammate ANDREA has won the coveted weekly prize of C2 sox??? Congratulations!!!
Gina
LUNA-TICS TEAM ROOM: Year-round "Looney" fun.
Re: Red Zone
OMG!!!!!!! Say ainj't so. You and Barbara, Red Sox fan. Jaysus, I'm surrounded by 'em.just27 wrote:We moved to California from Boston in 1986 after dying through that infamous Bill Buckner play in the '86 world series. Enjoy your Sox-watching!bg wrote: tomorrow..i'm planning to get up early ... and go to the y and row while watching the sox play....barbara
And, a late-breaking UPS delivery just brought me my heart monitor ... now to hook it up and cast a jaundiced eye over those formulas ... someone may be getting a PM!
Chris
My the Bambino live forever. I hope this new revelation doesn't rip apart our cyber friendship.
dc
Re: Red Zone
OMG!!!!!!! Say ainj't so. You and Barbara, Red Sox fan. Jaysus, I'm surrounded by 'em.
My the Bambino live forever. I hope this new revelation doesn't rip apart our cyber friendship.
dc
[/quote]
this will make rowing or erging together more fun....
[color=darkred]go sox.....[/color]
and welcome back to all the luna-tics who have been sick and/injured...
barbara
My the Bambino live forever. I hope this new revelation doesn't rip apart our cyber friendship.
dc
[/quote]this will make rowing or erging together more fun....
[color=darkred]go sox.....[/color]
and welcome back to all the luna-tics who have been sick and/injured...
barbara
Re: Red Zone
bg wrote:OMG!!!!!!! Say ainj't so. You and Barbara, Red Sox fan. Jaysus, I'm surrounded by 'em.
My the Bambino live forever. I hope this new revelation doesn't rip apart our cyber friendship.
dc
this will make rowing or erging together more fun....
Barbara,
Up early today get those meters done and goals accomplished. GO!!!
Dan
[color=darkred]go sox.....[/color]
and welcome back to all the luna-tics who have been sick and/injured...
barbara[/quote]
First of all you didn't mention age, resting HR, whether you use a heart monitor or what you are trying to accomplish.
For a little background: I am 63, 5'10' and weigh 200 lbs. I row for general fitness but mostly cardio and weight lose. With a resting HR of 58. In case you don't know the math:
220 - your age = Max HR = MHR
Ex. 220-63=157 MHR
Max HR - Resting HR = Heart Rate Reserve = HRR
157-58=109 HRR
Your aerobic training heart rate range will be between 50-75% of your HRR added back to your resting Heart rate.
Low end would be 109 x .5 = 54.5 + 58 = 112.5 Low THRR
High end would be 109 x.75 = 81.75 + 58 = 139.75 High THRR
If you go above 80% and below 85% you are in the range between aerobic and anaerobic.
Above 85% and you are in the anaerobic range.
Knowing these ranges is why a heart monitor is necessary. Without it you are flying blind and the older you get the more serious the trouble you can get into.
Anyway, what I do is row at a SPM count of between 18 and 24 varying up and down to keep the HR at about 120. You make up the slower pace by pulling harder in the finishing part of the stroke, i.e. lowering your average 500m/split times. Using my example my split times are between 2:25 and 2:40 depending on the heart rate at the time.
Hope this wasn't too boring for you. With your times and spm you sound like a young strapping lad.
From another old, fat bald guy
Dan C (toothdoc)
Dan,
I will be 50 in May, as for strapping, don't know. I am 5' 11" 200#, got my erg last April to row for fittness and have the ability too get a hard workout with limited time. Have lost a few pounds since Thanksgiving when I increased the number of workouts per week. I base the quality of my workouts on total meters in a given time. As for heart rates, don't have a HR monitor but I do check my pulse at the end of the workout. Typically I am working out between 75 to 80% of MAXHR. Guess my question is, are you able to keep up the total number of meters with a lower SPM by pulling harder? Sounds like you are more concerned with heartrate and SPM than total meters. By the way thanks for the formula had not seen the resting heart rate version before.
Tim
For a little background: I am 63, 5'10' and weigh 200 lbs. I row for general fitness but mostly cardio and weight lose. With a resting HR of 58. In case you don't know the math:
220 - your age = Max HR = MHR
Ex. 220-63=157 MHR
Max HR - Resting HR = Heart Rate Reserve = HRR
157-58=109 HRR
Your aerobic training heart rate range will be between 50-75% of your HRR added back to your resting Heart rate.
Low end would be 109 x .5 = 54.5 + 58 = 112.5 Low THRR
High end would be 109 x.75 = 81.75 + 58 = 139.75 High THRR
If you go above 80% and below 85% you are in the range between aerobic and anaerobic.
Above 85% and you are in the anaerobic range.
Knowing these ranges is why a heart monitor is necessary. Without it you are flying blind and the older you get the more serious the trouble you can get into.
Anyway, what I do is row at a SPM count of between 18 and 24 varying up and down to keep the HR at about 120. You make up the slower pace by pulling harder in the finishing part of the stroke, i.e. lowering your average 500m/split times. Using my example my split times are between 2:25 and 2:40 depending on the heart rate at the time.
Hope this wasn't too boring for you. With your times and spm you sound like a young strapping lad.
From another old, fat bald guy
Dan C (toothdoc)
Dan,
I will be 50 in May, as for strapping, don't know. I am 5' 11" 200#, got my erg last April to row for fittness and have the ability too get a hard workout with limited time. Have lost a few pounds since Thanksgiving when I increased the number of workouts per week. I base the quality of my workouts on total meters in a given time. As for heart rates, don't have a HR monitor but I do check my pulse at the end of the workout. Typically I am working out between 75 to 80% of MAXHR. Guess my question is, are you able to keep up the total number of meters with a lower SPM by pulling harder? Sounds like you are more concerned with heartrate and SPM than total meters. By the way thanks for the formula had not seen the resting heart rate version before.
Tim
Hi Tim..
I have to put my 2 cents in here as a Personal Trainer.These numbers Doc gave you are a great tool.We all need these heart rate stats to get the most benefit from our workouts.Each of us are individuals with different ways that we want to reach a goal, be it fitness level improvement or weight loss.As you can see here at the forum there are a multitude of ways to row.Some row fast and furious and others very slow and deliberate.Changes in damper settings, drag factors, spm and the such.You really do need a heart rate monitor if you want accuracy and safety in your workouts.You also need to decide what you are basing your workouts on..number of meters..or effort placed in doing so.Any of us can row mega meters and have poor form or just be doing it to be doing it.taking your own heart rate is good but can be at best tricky.If you are beginning to improve your heart rate..your heart beats will begin to recover fast when you stop and you won't get an accurate rate at your best effort.You need to know what your heart rate is when you are peaking etc.I have been rowing for over 10 years on my erg..I am no expert and have never rowed in the water or have any of the experience that many of these rowers here have.But I do know my own rate of fitness and what works for me as an individual.That is what is key in my opinion.I can tell when my heart rate is at max..and when I recover what it will be from just knowing my heart & body.I do have a heart rate monitor and it is a really excellent tool.You can be confused with alot of numbers but by at least knowing that maximum number..you will know when you are in a danger zone and when to cut back a notch.
I row fast and furious..can't row slow no matter what I do.I also row at a fairly low damper setting but that is MYstyle.
Take a look at what you want to accomplish in your rowing..know what you have to do to get there and don't get too wrapped up in numbers when you are starting..but good form, safe performance and your own style.It is great to have alot of information from everyone..how else would we learn??
Read..there are lots of web sites ..google what you want to know.But you need to know your body, your goals, your reaction to your workouts and then put into practice what other tidbits you learn.
This is just my opinion..and my 2 cents.I tend to ramble because I love what I do and I like to share my experience as a trainer.
Happy rowing!!
Pat
Timbuk2/TimbukTOO
I have to put my 2 cents in here as a Personal Trainer.These numbers Doc gave you are a great tool.We all need these heart rate stats to get the most benefit from our workouts.Each of us are individuals with different ways that we want to reach a goal, be it fitness level improvement or weight loss.As you can see here at the forum there are a multitude of ways to row.Some row fast and furious and others very slow and deliberate.Changes in damper settings, drag factors, spm and the such.You really do need a heart rate monitor if you want accuracy and safety in your workouts.You also need to decide what you are basing your workouts on..number of meters..or effort placed in doing so.Any of us can row mega meters and have poor form or just be doing it to be doing it.taking your own heart rate is good but can be at best tricky.If you are beginning to improve your heart rate..your heart beats will begin to recover fast when you stop and you won't get an accurate rate at your best effort.You need to know what your heart rate is when you are peaking etc.I have been rowing for over 10 years on my erg..I am no expert and have never rowed in the water or have any of the experience that many of these rowers here have.But I do know my own rate of fitness and what works for me as an individual.That is what is key in my opinion.I can tell when my heart rate is at max..and when I recover what it will be from just knowing my heart & body.I do have a heart rate monitor and it is a really excellent tool.You can be confused with alot of numbers but by at least knowing that maximum number..you will know when you are in a danger zone and when to cut back a notch.
I row fast and furious..can't row slow no matter what I do.I also row at a fairly low damper setting but that is MYstyle.
Take a look at what you want to accomplish in your rowing..know what you have to do to get there and don't get too wrapped up in numbers when you are starting..but good form, safe performance and your own style.It is great to have alot of information from everyone..how else would we learn??
Read..there are lots of web sites ..google what you want to know.But you need to know your body, your goals, your reaction to your workouts and then put into practice what other tidbits you learn.
This is just my opinion..and my 2 cents.I tend to ramble because I love what I do and I like to share my experience as a trainer.
Happy rowing!!
Pat
Timbuk2/TimbukTOO
[img]http://i88.photobucket.com/albums/k195/lockaroundmyheart/Not%20Real%20Pictures/Animations/diddle-1.gif[/img]
All In A Day's ERG: Team Progress for 3.24.08
I'm sure that Chris' jaundiced eye is friendlier looking, but this was best graphic I could find at O-dark-thirty!
Good info on heart monitors and resting rates, etc.; the discussion is quite interesting.
Way to row, Luna-Tics! We were in fine form yesterday!
Season meters to date = 39,534,796 m
Total meters on the day = 235,352 m
We had 39 percent of the oars in the water...and some new reports from sick bay indicating others will soon be returning to the water! Good deal! (Haven't heard from Noelle - hope she is okay!)
Milestones!
100K Sorin S.
ONE Million Meter Watch:
Barbara with (2,216 m) to go! I am sure that she's crossed the finish line at this time! I will cheer her on even though she is a sox fan! And the Sox beat the Rockies...
Tom with (82,203 m) to go!
Kristine with (95,895 m) to go!
TWO Million Meter Watch:
Angelo with (148,699 m) to go!
Dan with (227,782 m) to go!
Tim with (284,623 m) to go!
March Madness Challenge: I made a mistake in yesterday's posting as I thought yesterday was 3.25.08....fortunately only for a short while. Today is 3.25 and it is the first day that the honor boards will start to appear for the folks who have rowed at least 5K for 25 days.
5K = 9
10K = 9
And the Pot of Gold goes to:
Lisa 34,355 m - posted multiple days
Dan 25,208 m
Jane 20,416 m
Chris 19,535 m
Darryl 17,479 m
Barbara 16,625 m
Tim 14,402 m
Mitch 11,546 m
Rodrigo 11,296 m
Andrea 8,224 m
our sock winner! Congrats!Mary 7,242 m
Keith 6,588 m
Gina 6,218 m
Pat 6,013 m
Rowin 6,000 m
Jan 6,000 m
AJ 5,000 m
Dan T 5,000 m
Sorin 4,105 m
Helen 3,000 m
Rae 1,000 m
Orion 100 m
Re: All In A Day's ERG: Team Progress for 3.24.08
No, that eye looked pretty much like mine - non-friendly - having to get up for work this AM after a 5-day break!Kona2 wrote:I'm sure that Chris' jaundiced eye is friendlier looking, but this was best graphic I could find at O-dark-thirty! Good info on heart monitors and resting rates, etc.; the discussion is quite interesting.
I hooked up the much anticipated heart monitor and took all of the above information under consideration ... and came up with warm-up, work-out, and cool-down HR target times. In a 6,000 trial run, I couldn't get to within 15 of my upper (danger-danger Will Robinson) rate. I'll do a 10K tonight and see if I can break 120. What with the heart monitor, the rowing gloves, and the iPod ... I feel like cyber-woman.
Chris
In calculating your resting heart rate..be sure to check it before you get out of bed..do this for 3 days.That will indicate your true resting heart rate.Just walking to the bathroom will raise your heart rate.
And..if you have been rowing for a while you may already be getting your heart muscle "in shape".So to get your heart rate up may take a bit more effort.People who are really "heart" fit will need to work out harder to reach their desired heart rate amount.Longer or harder.Be sure when you check your heart rate at the end of a workout to wait a minute..then take it to see what recovery rate you are at.The faster you recover to your pre workout rate..the better you are doing.I take my heart rate pre row,during row , immediate after and then one minute after.You will get so good at this that you will tell without the monitor.I can literally feel my heart rate decrease.
Pat
And..if you have been rowing for a while you may already be getting your heart muscle "in shape".So to get your heart rate up may take a bit more effort.People who are really "heart" fit will need to work out harder to reach their desired heart rate amount.Longer or harder.Be sure when you check your heart rate at the end of a workout to wait a minute..then take it to see what recovery rate you are at.The faster you recover to your pre workout rate..the better you are doing.I take my heart rate pre row,during row , immediate after and then one minute after.You will get so good at this that you will tell without the monitor.I can literally feel my heart rate decrease.
Pat
[img]http://i88.photobucket.com/albums/k195/lockaroundmyheart/Not%20Real%20Pictures/Animations/diddle-1.gif[/img]
PJM wrote:In calculating your resting heart rate..be sure to check it before you get out of bed..do this for 3 days.That will indicate your true resting heart rate.Just walking to the bathroom will raise your heart rate.
And..if you have been rowing for a while you may already be getting your heart muscle "in shape".So to get your heart rate up may take a bit more effort.People who are really "heart" fit will need to work out harder to reach their desired heart rate amount.Longer or harder.
Pat
10-4 and thx, Pat. (I'll wait until my heart calms down from the alarm clock blast.)
Cyber Chris
Thanks for the insight, may have to ask for a HR monitor for my birthday. I will throw one more piece out there for thought I live at 9200 ft. Sometime I should go down to Denver and row just to see how the altitude is really affecting me. When I first moved up here it did take almost a year before I could really go all out and not be winded after a short time. I tend to row like you "fast and furious"PJM wrote:In calculating your resting heart rate..be sure to check it before you get out of bed..do this for 3 days.That will indicate your true resting heart rate.Just walking to the bathroom will raise your heart rate.
And..if you have been rowing for a while you may already be getting your heart muscle "in shape".So to get your heart rate up may take a bit more effort.People who are really "heart" fit will need to work out harder to reach their desired heart rate amount.Longer or harder.Be sure when you check your heart rate at the end of a workout to wait a minute..then take it to see what recovery rate you are at.The faster you recover to your pre workout rate..the better you are doing.I take my heart rate pre row,during row , immediate after and then one minute after.You will get so good at this that you will tell without the monitor.I can literally feel my heart rate decrease.
Pat
Tim
Thanks...good to be back rowing.Toothdoc wrote:Welcome backkalmjorg wrote:Ok crew, this is the last time. Those other avatars were just for practice. Now it is my very own kitty and mountain. And...btw toothdoc. I LOVE your avatar!
I know I have been gone a while but I have been rowing as I could and I am back up to 10k a day so I just went in and entered all my meters for the last two weeks. So in case anyone thinks I rowed this enormous amount of meters just remember it was done over a period of two weeks. I am done with the pt and have the green light to row with the only restriction being my own body.
dc
LJ
-
kgallagher
- 2k Poster
- Posts: 241
- Joined: January 15th, 2008, 9:11 pm
strokes per minute
Tim,I am looking for some feedback regarding strokes per minute. Since I just started rowing last April I am not sure if I should change things up more often. Predominantly my rows are 45 to 60 minute averaging 29 to 30 SPM. The quality of any particular row is based on the avg/500 meters. A good workout is around 1:59 to 2:00 minutes versus 2:03 to 2:04 for an average row to 2:05 to 2:06 for a" just get through it". What do the rest of you do?
I have to chime in as well. I don't have a heart monitor, but have been rowing for 20+ years, so I know how my body reacts to rowing (and erging). Stroke rates vary amongst competetive rowers. When I am racing a head race (boats start one at a time in 10 second intervals and generally race about 3 miles) my stroke rate is around 28-31. When I race a sprint race (for masters rowers 1000m with all boats starting at the same time) the stroke rate is usually up a little 30-34. Men's boats tend to race higher.
Now, for training, I mix it up. You don't want to row at your max all the time. Plus, I'd get bored if all I did was row at one steady pace. Some days, I sit around a 24 spm for a firm steady state piece (where I'm holding the same rate for the whole piece). On other days, I like to do pyramids where you start with a lower rate such as 18 for 5', go to a 21 for 4', 24 for 3', 27 for 2', and a 30 for 1' and then come back down in the reverse. Another workout I do is interval work where I sprint for a shorter time (between 45 sec. to 2' depending on my mood) and take at least double the time off between sprints. When I do these my rate is up around a 30. When I am not strictly focusing on my strokes per minute, I also change what I focus on between 500m splits and watts.
It is okay to row at a high rating, but you don't want to be "spinning your wheels". This means you don't want to be zooming up and down the slide. As you come forward up the slide and the blades are out of the water (if you were in a boat), this is called the recovery. The point of the recovery is to rest and prepare for the next stroke. If you are a little slower and more controlled on the slide then you should be able to apply more power during the drive. You can get your heart rate up by zooming up and down the slide, but you won't be effective in moving a boat.
My suggestion is to play around with the rating a little bit and have fun.
Karyn
-
kgallagher
- 2k Poster
- Posts: 241
- Joined: January 15th, 2008, 9:11 pm
Re: Red Zone
The friendly rivalry begins. I happened to be on the other side of the infamous Bill Buckner play in '86 that helped my Mets succeed. I have an autographed photo of that moment in my room. Hurray for Mookie! Let's go Mets!We moved to California from Boston in 1986 after dying through that infamous Bill Buckner play in the '86 world series. Enjoy your Sox-watching!
Happy Erging!
Karyn
Re: strokes per minute
kgallagher wrote:Tim,I am looking for some feedback regarding strokes per minute. Since I just started rowing last April I am not sure if I should change things up more often. Predominantly my rows are 45 to 60 minute averaging 29 to 30 SPM. The quality of any particular row is based on the avg/500 meters. A good workout is around 1:59 to 2:00 minutes versus 2:03 to 2:04 for an average row to 2:05 to 2:06 for a" just get through it". What do the rest of you do?
I have to chime in as well. I don't have a heart monitor, but have been rowing for 20+ years, so I know how my body reacts to rowing (and erging). Stroke rates vary amongst competetive rowers. When I am racing a head race (boats start one at a time in 10 second intervals and generally race about 3 miles) my stroke rate is around 28-31. When I race a sprint race (for masters rowers 1000m with all boats starting at the same time) the stroke rate is usually up a little 30-34. Men's boats tend to race higher.
Now, for training, I mix it up. You don't want to row at your max all the time. Plus, I'd get bored if all I did was row at one steady pace. Some days, I sit around a 24 spm for a firm steady state piece (where I'm holding the same rate for the whole piece). On other days, I like to do pyramids where you start with a lower rate such as 18 for 5', go to a 21 for 4', 24 for 3', 27 for 2', and a 30 for 1' and then come back down in the reverse. Another workout I do is interval work where I sprint for a shorter time (between 45 sec. to 2' depending on my mood) and take at least double the time off between sprints. When I do these my rate is up around a 30. When I am not strictly focusing on my strokes per minute, I also change what I focus on between 500m splits and watts.
It is okay to row at a high rating, but you don't want to be "spinning your wheels". This means you don't want to be zooming up and down the slide. As you come forward up the slide and the blades are out of the water (if you were in a boat), this is called the recovery. The point of the recovery is to rest and prepare for the next stroke. If you are a little slower and more controlled on the slide then you should be able to apply more power during the drive. You can get your heart rate up by zooming up and down the slide, but you won't be effective in moving a boat.
My suggestion is to play around with the rating a little bit and have fun.
Karyn
Thanks for all the good insight from everyone. Guess I'll get through the NARC then start mixing it up.
Tim P.