Ranger's training thread

[ranger]

All anybody wants is to see the above changed to..."I DID a 500 at 14 SPI. 42 spm and 1:23" with a screenshot accompanying the sentence.

Hey, me, too.

But that moment is a couple of months off.

I need to build the rate up to 42 spm.

For quite a while, I have been rowing with the rate in the 20s.

I am now getting ready to row a lot at 32 spm.

After I am done with this work at 32 spm, I will raise the rate to 36 spm.

After I am done with this work at 36 spm, I will be ready to raise the rate into the 40s and try 500s trials.

There is no reason whatsoever to change this natural progression.

ranger

[aharmer]

So the multiple claims of "I am now sharpening" and "I have been sharpening for x weeks" and "My sharpening is going well" and "sharpening is coming along nicely" and "I am now fully sharpened"......

those were just you getting excited to sharpen some time in the future? Oh, now I get it.

As a reminder, instead of "I will do 8x500 in 1:32/r34", it would be refreshing to see "I DID 8x500 in 1:32/r34 this morning" with an accompanying screenshot.

Mike reminded you that your machine has a monitor with a memory. Unfortunately that memory doesn't lie, maybe that's why you have a difficult time relating to it.

[ranger]

You make hundreds of claims of what you WILL do, but never ever post anything you DID do.

Really?

What's this?

Last year, no one my age and weight came within 20 seconds of my 2K, even though I pulled my 2Ks at max drag and didn't even prepare to race.

RANKING RESULTS 2010

Indoor Rower | Individual and Race Results | 2000m | Men's | Lightweight | Custom Age Range (59–70) | 2010 Season

You are number 1 of 172

1 Rich Cureton 59 Ann Arbor MI USA 6:41.4 RACE
2 Hugh Pite 65 Victoria BC CAN 7:02.7 RACE
3 Robert Lakin 61 Wichita KS USA 7:03.6 RACE
4 Gregory Brock 62 santa cruz ca USA 7:03.9 IND
5 Rolf Meek 59 Oslo NOR 7:05.4 IND
6 Jerry Lawson 62 USA 7:06.0 RACE
6 Gerald Lawson 62 Winona MN USA 7:06.0 IND
8 Leif Petersen 64 DEN 7:08.5 RACE
9 Peter Francis 61 Denver CO USA 7:09.3 RACE
10 Roger Prowse 65 Isle of Wight GBR 7:10.3 RACE

This year, I suspect no one my age and weight (or older) will come within 40 seconds of my 2K.

That's the sort of "performance" you are looking for, no?

The problem is: "performances" like this are wretched training.

They don't have anything to do with taking advantage of an opportunity for getting better.

ranger

[bellboy]

Well that is definitive proof that you are a bare faced liar then. If you type "i am sharpening hard" or "i am sharpening for the next six months" then people tend to think that is exactly what your doing. Avid readers of this postulating wank know deep down that the truth is a concept with which you have fairly loose association but dont take us for idiots(i confess to being one because i tune in twice a week). Dont forget this is a Training thread not a "when", "if" or "i will" thread. All your erging has ever proved is that you are an incredibly fit man for your age. Your "stroke" has been disected by Nav on numerous occasions and even you must realise that when the clock is ticking down you will haul anchor.Its what you do.Nothing wrong with that. BIRC will prove the naysayers correct. Of that iv no doubt

[ausrwr]

You make claims about your training.

No, I haven't "made claims" about the training itself. I've just lied about what I can do.

I have just described it, for instance, so that you could do it, too. I don't do it, so you can not do it as well

In my training, since 2003, I have both lowered the drag (from max to 145 df.) and increased my stroking power 3 SPI (from 10 SPI to 13 SPI) by improving my technique. I've also dropped the drag to minimum, increased it to maximum, decreased it again, gone back up, put it to 118, and then back to 145 and if I say my technique's got better, I'll believe it.

Sure, I have speculated on how this will affect my 2K (and my sharpening, etc.), but I guess we'll just have to wait and see whether I am right about that. I think if everything goes right I'll pull something, I might even finish, but I can't hit a single target that would give any solid proof of what I'm talking about (let alone what I say I'm trying to do) so I'll just keep obfuscating...

ranger

Now, how accurate is my rangerspeak translator? Time will tell. Like it has the last couple of seasons.

[aharmer]

We all know you have that 6:41 under your belt. Great time, no question. Quit falling back on that because nobody disputes that. If all you claimed were a capacity to pull 6:40 nobody would question you. When you claim to be ready for 6:16 or better by WIRC, and 6:20 at the very least at BIRC, why would anybody believe you? These are two completely different universes. I've pulled sub 6:40 as well, it doesn't mean anybody should believe I'm ready for 6:16 unless I SHOW something proving otherwise.

People claiming you cannot pull 6:40 could be classified as naysayers. People questioning your ability to pull 6:16, without seeing a shred of proof, are called sane and rational. You're now doing the sharpening workouts, time to show the proof all the sane and rational people are looking for.

[Bob S.]

You're now doing the sharpening workouts, time to show the proof all the sane and rational people are looking for.

Sane and rational people would never post messages to this thread. Nor would they read it more than once. I believe that the proper word for those of us that follow it is "co-dependents."

Bob S.

[bellboy]

You're now doing the sharpening workouts, time to show the proof all the sane and rational people are looking for.

Sane and rational people would never post messages to this thread. Nor would they read it more than once. I believe that the proper word for those of us that follow it is "co-dependents."

Bob S.

Spot on Bob. If there is a life out there i must get one. This all very entertaining but not at all healthy

[mikvan52]

point of information:

free rate ... means: Rate of one's choosing...
As soon as an erger passes 500 continuous meters he has done a "free rate" 500.

ranger's 1:30.x r.30 is free rate... he chose 30... that's his choice..

An intermediate split at WIRC for ranger was done at a much higher "free rate"
Nav posted a screen shot where ranger bailed on a free rate 500m... he got to 457 or 465 or something like that and stopped. This stopping is known as "handling down"... a ranger specialty.

ranger tries to wriggle out of weak erg performances by saying that he hasn't sharpened...
In the years where he goes to venues and rows 2ks, he is, by definition, sharpening.... by virtue of the fact that he is doing 2ks at above AT..

I KNOW he is above AT because he handles down ... he's in oxygen debt... No one gets into oxygen debt at UT. The claim that he does all his 2ks at UT is false.

IF ranger wants to redefine all commonly accepted meanings in exercise physiology, that is his choice. However, to engage in meaningful exchanges here he might want to consider agreeing to use of the English Language...

Pontification will get him nowhere.

[whp4]

You make hundreds of claims of what you WILL do, but never ever post anything you DID do.

Really?

What's this?

Last year, no one my age and weight came within 20 seconds of my 2K, even though I pulled my 2Ks at max drag and didn't even prepare to race.

Be that as it may, it speaks mostly to the general lack of competitors in that bracket, not that you are some incredible specimen. You still didn't manage to come anywhere near your PB, break the "soft" WR you keep claiming you'll demolish, make it to a major competition, or fulfill a single prediction you made. Come May 1st, we'll be able to say the same about this season, in all likelihood, and that WR will be forever out of your reach.

[mikvan52]

point of information:
I do not claim to be sane or rational.
It's quite simple, really:
I am curious to know what amount of time would elapse if ranger erged any firm 500m this week.

I am (also) curious to know what his heart rate was (along with his time) for the 5k he may have turned in for the Concept 2 Indoor Rowing Development Squad in 2007. (He and I went back and forth on that one

I am curious to know how his heart rate reacts to sustained erging at 13 spi (more than 5k). The monitor could easily be set up for 500m intervals for illustration of his cardiovascular fitness.

If ranger doesn't wish to provide this information, that is just fine with me.
Perhaps he'd like to tell us again why he won't comply with my calm inquisitiveness?

These repetitive requests by me are tedious for many to read over and over.
If such people don't like to read them, that's fine too.
I have an ulterior motive:
I wish to compete against ranger someday...... I have been waiting for 3 years... He hasn't showed up at Crash-B, the world indoor rowing championship.... and he always says he's coming... and doesn't.
Does behavior like this diminish his credibility? Does it relate to his inability to erg 500m at home and report it here...ever?



For me, my exchanges with Cureton are a simple psychological game of cat and mouse.
I am the cat who stays downwind of the mouse and can stay still for a long time.

In the meantime, I will take cheap shots at what is clearly (IMO) seriously flawed and inconsequential training advice.... After all.. again in my opinion...We have to be able to "lighten up" in the crazy world in which someone like me is fated to inhabit. Do you feel you live in such a world too?

Thank you for your attention to this post.

Maybe you'd like to watch a tired old video clip instead:

Inches⇒ Pacino

[ranger]

All your erging has ever proved is that you are an incredibly fit man for your age.

I am not sure what you mean by this.

What else could it mean?

You get "incredibly fit" by training.

That's what we are chatting about here.

ranger

[ranger]

I wish to compete against ranger someday...... I have been waiting for 3 years...

Then come on over to BIRC.

Simple as that.

I have already entered and have booked flights and hotel.

Stay at the Crowne Plaza.

We can hang out and chat.

At WIRC 2011, we won't be in the same division.

You are younger than I am.

I will row at a 60s lwt (and set the WR at a level that you folks will have to become superman to beat ).

ranger

[ranger]

Be that as it may, it speaks mostly to the general lack of competitors in that bracket, not that you are some incredible specimen. You still didn't manage to come anywhere near your PB, break the "soft" WR you keep claiming you'll demolish, make it to a major competition, or fulfill a single prediction you made. Come May 1st, we'll be able to say the same about this season, in all likelihood, and that WR will be forever out of your reach.

This could be, but I don't know why you would want to discourage someone from trying.

General nastiness?

Fear of failure on your part?

Fear that I will succeed?

Fear of everything?

Truth is, only one rower of any weight my age (or older) has ever pulled sub-6:30, Paul Hendershott.

And he pulled 6:23.8.

Paul is, what, 6'4, 230 lbs.?

Given my stroking power now, I have a good chance of rowing faster for 2K than Paul did when he was 60.

So, considering my size (5'11", 165 lbs., when I am race ready), what I am training myself to do is not trivial, I think, or just an accident of lack of competition.

It also isn't easy.

Or done in a minute.

My training for it has taken eight years.

As I sharpen up to race over the next six months, I need to be careful with it if I am going to succeed.

No one has ever done anything like what I am trying to do.

There are no precedents.

As I mentioned a while ago, I think it is reasonable to claim that no 60s lwt has ever pulled a 2K at better than 10 SPI.

I am now pulling 13 SPI.

No 60s lwt has ever pulled better than 6:42.

I think I have I have a chance of pulling 6:16.

Basically, being fast at rowing means having a high stroking power.

If you have a high stroking power, you can send the wheel/boat a long way on each stroke.

For mechanical reasons, everyone the same age and weight races at pretty much the same rate, given some distance.

The one with the higher natural stroking power wins.

I am now a 60s lwt who strokes like a 30s hwt.

Someone like Pete Marston rows at 13 SPI, not Rick Bayko.

13 SPI is perfect rowing for a lightweight of any age.

If he rates 37 spm or so in the center of his 2Ks, going along at 1:30 pace, Henrik Stephansen, the lwt Open WR-holder, pulls 13 SPI.

1:30 @ 37 spm is 13 SPI.

ranger

[ranger]

I've pulled sub 6:40 as well, it doesn't mean anybody should believe I'm ready for 6:16 unless I SHOW something proving otherwise.

I have pulled a lwt 6:28--four seconds under the WR in my age and weight division at the time.

I have also pulled 6:27.5, 6:28.5, 6:29, 6:29.7, 6:30, etc.

You might show you can do that, first.

And then try to figure out how to get to 6:16, as I have.

Goals come in stages.

What is your age?

What is your height and weight?

You don't include these in your signature.

ranger