Are slides an advantage?

[Ninjaitus]

Is rowing on slides an advantage? If so why, does it have anything to do with the inertia of the rower?

[jamesg]

Inertia is involved, because we move the erg (30kg) rather than ourselves (maybe a bit more than 30kg). From here on, refer to Sir Isaac. He offers us an "advantage", but it ain't free.

[tbartman]

Sorry for the late reply, and the bump in the thread.

As jamesg said, I think there is a slight advantage to being on the slides. When you row on the stationary erg, you are doing two types of work: a) putting effort into the flywheel, and b) moving your body up and down the slide. On the slides, you are still doing two types of work: a) putting effort into the flywheel, and b) sliding the erg underneath you both directions (well, you move a tiny too, because the center of mass of the whole system stays in one place). So, if you weigh more than the erg, moving yourself back and forth a few feet requires more energy than sliding the erg back and forth the same amount. The heavier you are, the more advantage (because you're not moving yourself, and the little amount your body does move on the slides decreases).

I haven't tested this precisely, but I'm thinking there might be a 1s/500m difference, maybe? What would be interesting is to test my 8-year-old son who weighs about the same as the erg (test him for low pull or something like that)

[Citroen]

Is rowing on slides an advantage? If so why, does it have anything to do with the inertia of the rower?

I had a go on an ergo on slides (and with a core-perform seat) at BIRC in October. It was fantastic, there's no stress on the lower back. I was able to pull a 1:23 split with little effort (wearing jeans/tshirt not even sports kit).

I'd recommend that anyone who has their own erg and has the room gets a pair of slides. If I ever pursuade my wife that I need my own erg then RowPro (for online racing), slides and a core perform seat will all be on my shopping list.

As Tim and James said your moving a lower mass since you're mostly stationary while the erg moves under you (which also makes it more like the simulation of a boat).

[Nosmo]

Didn't PaulS state that the data indicated the times were the same for grounded vs slides (except for maybe short distances?).

I view the advantages as less stress on the body and it being more like OTW rowing. (Avoiding an injury is a huge advantage)

[ausrwr]

Maybe he did, but there was some research done which indicated that the advantage over 2k was 1 to 1.2 seconds per 500.

Hasn't been released as far as I know, but I'll see if I can get some more confirmation.

But it does make some people slower...

[romad63]

I've found when doing the exact same splits it is much easier on the slides. In fact to me it seemed effortless almost to maintain the splits where as it was "work" when grounded. I've tried it when slerging, at mid tempo and full speed and for me seems to be consistant and I'm no lightweight (260lbs).

What I do find useful though is doing slides with others. When training at our boathouse we often create "quads" and are hoping to do an eight. That is great work for timing purposes which will pay off big time on the water

[jamesg]

Years ago I did a series of 100m flat out pulls on and off a home made slide. Results interesting and entirely Newtonian. The slide removed an obstacle to higher ratings that the fixed erg imposes, and let me pull full length at 60 rather than 40. So unsurprisingly I went a lot faster on the slide; and equally unsurprisingly it didn't last long.

At low ratings, my output is limited by myself, not the machine, if I use the right drag.

However it is possible that using slides can alter our technique somewhat, and there are shuttle losses at high ratings. Both could affect performance. Improving Power in either direction is not without cost of course, better technique by definition lets us work harder, it doesn't give us a free lunch. Any power reduction in one set of muscles, to show up on screen would need to be expressed by another set pulling the handle - again more work.

[Yankeerunner]

I'm in agreement with jamesg.

I'd used slides quite a bit and liked them, although I've not used them for a couple of years because the races are on grounded ergs and I train mainly for the races.

When I was using them and I kept variables the same, for example using Paul Smith's S10MPS (Strapless 10 Meters Per Stroke), the results seemed to be the same. Equal heart rate for equal workouts at equal stroke rates. The feel was a bit different, and pleasant, but the work was essentially the same.

As james says though, the slides make higher stroke rates possible, especially for sprints. That 'advantage' diminishes rapidly as the distance increases. Even on slides it's difficult to keep up 50spm for even a 2km, let alone a 5km or marathon. Once your aerobic capacity runs out of the ability to keep up the high stroke rate the 'advantage' runs out with it.

[bsharp5utk]

I actually find that my times are slightly slower on slides over long distances. It seems like I am losing some transfer power at the beginning of the catch on the slides whereas the fixed erg i can get every bit of power I need at the catch