Ranger's training thread

General discussion on Training. How to get better on your erg, how to use your erg to get better at another sport, or anything else about improving your abilities.
ranger
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Re: Ranger's training thread

Post by ranger » February 1st, 2011, 3:55 pm

rjw wrote:
ranger wrote:
macroth wrote:When does the WP have you do a HM trial? Did the USIRT coaches ask you to do a 10k, a 60', and a 30' TT before doing your 5K and 2k TT?
Well, in his level 3 rowing, Mike C. built up to 30K @ 1:48 just before he raced.

That's a pretty tough slog, wouldn't you say?

Something like a 3/4 Marathon trial.

ranger
Again, if you understood the WP, you would realize that this in not a trial, it is L3 rowing which Mike has designed for a specific purpose.
Sure, but...

30K @ 1:48 predicts a 6:22 2K.

Yea, Mike did a _bit_ better than that, but not much, and not often.

Sure.

3/4 Marathon trials are _very_ useful--and relevant.

They are 2K predictors.

ranger
Rich Cureton M 72 5'11" 165 lbs. 2K pbs: 6:27.5 (hwt), 6:28 (lwt)

ben990
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Re: Ranger's training thread

Post by ben990 » February 1st, 2011, 3:57 pm

You row well (according to you). You do not race well.

Time to start racing your training!

Father Time is calling, and he is saying that you are sloooooooowwwwwwwwwing down.

When are you racing next?
Rich Cureton M 60 hwt 5'11" 180 lbs. 7:02.3 (lwt) 2K

rjw
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Re: Ranger's training thread

Post by rjw » February 1st, 2011, 4:03 pm

ranger wrote:
rjw wrote:
ranger wrote: Well, in his level 3 rowing, Mike C. built up to 30K @ 1:48 just before he raced.

That's a pretty tough slog, wouldn't you say?

Something like a 3/4 Marathon trial.

ranger
Again, if you understood the WP, you would realize that this in not a trial, it is L3 rowing which Mike has designed for a specific purpose.
Sure, but...

30K @ 1:48 predicts a 6:22 2K.

Yea, Mike did a _bit_ better than that, but not much, and not often.

Sure.

3/4 Marathon trials are _very_ useful--and relevant.

They are 2K predictors.

ranger
I'll try once again Rich, L3 training of the WP is not a trial. It is done with specific purposes in mind, not as a trial. Just like the L4, L2 and L1 - capiche?
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macroth
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Re: Ranger's training thread

Post by macroth » February 1st, 2011, 5:49 pm

ranger wrote:
macroth wrote:you could bust out a FM tomorrow
Indeed I could.

ranger
You could, if... so many ifs.

As it stands, you can''t even row a continuous 10K at 13spi. But hey, since you're less than two weeks from your last chance to qualify for WIRC, maybe you should get going on those all important distance trials?! Feel free to skip right on to the HM. :wink:
43/m/183cm/HW
All time PBs: 100m 14.0 | 500m 1:18.1 | 1k 2:55.7 | 2k 6:15.4 | 5k 16:59.3 | 6k 20:46.5 | 10k 35:46.0
40+ PBs: 100m 14.7 | 500m 1:20.5 | 1k 2:59.6 | 2k 6:21.9 | 5k 17:29.6 | HM 1:19:33.1| FM 2:51:58.5 | 100k 7:35:09 | 24h 250,706m

ranger
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Re: Ranger's training thread

Post by ranger » February 1st, 2011, 6:01 pm

macroth wrote:As it stands, you can''t even row a continuous 10K at 13spi.
Yea, but I am not too worried about it.

I will just keep working on my "Save a Horse, Ride a Cowboy" rows at 26 spm in a 3.4-to-1 ratio.

When I get to 10K, it will predict a 6:16 2K.

And all my rowing dreams come true.

ranger
Rich Cureton M 72 5'11" 165 lbs. 2K pbs: 6:27.5 (hwt), 6:28 (lwt)

ranger
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Re: Ranger's training thread

Post by ranger » February 1st, 2011, 6:04 pm

rjw wrote:I'll try once again Rich, L3 training of the WP is not a trial.
But my response is this:

Mike C.'s 30K @ 1:48 was indistinguishable from a trial.

As a trial, it predicts a 6:22 2K.

ranger
Rich Cureton M 72 5'11" 165 lbs. 2K pbs: 6:27.5 (hwt), 6:28 (lwt)

ranger
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Re: Ranger's training thread

Post by ranger » February 1st, 2011, 6:06 pm

ben990 wrote:You do not race well.
On the contrary.

You must not know my history.

When I am fully prepared to race, I race better than anyone--flat splits just above, at, and below WR pace.

In 2003, in consecutive lightweight rows, when I was 52, I pulled 6:36, 6:33, 6:30, 6:32, 6:29, 6;28, 6:32--all at race venues.

At that time, the 50s lwt WR was 6:31.6.

The issue is this:

No WR holder, 40-70, has ever gotten better.

So, given this record of racing in 2003, I have been trying to get better.

Race preparation never made anyone better.

So I haven't been preparing to race.

I have been improving my technique and stroking power.

I have been getting better at rowing.

This will pay _huge_ dividends.

When I am again fully prepared to race, I now will be quite a bit faster than I as a decade ago.

I now row well (13 SPI) at low drag (119 df.).

At 32 spm, I will pull 1:34/6:16 for 2K.

ranger
Rich Cureton M 72 5'11" 165 lbs. 2K pbs: 6:27.5 (hwt), 6:28 (lwt)

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mikvan52
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Re: Ranger's training thread

Post by mikvan52 » February 1st, 2011, 9:55 pm

Some one please help:
I've looked everywhere for ranger's name as an entry at CRASH-B this month... Where is it?
Will he be erging in the
LTA (AK) (Lwt, above the neck amputee) Adaptive Men ?

It's so confusing.
What does he weigh these days; head or no head?

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Tinpusher
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Re: Ranger's training thread

Post by Tinpusher » February 1st, 2011, 11:17 pm

Maybe he's waiting until he does the qualifying time in Toronto this weekend? :!:
Wait a minute...he's not entered there either. :lol:
So much for 6 races on consecutive weekends. :roll: I just don't know what to believe anymore. :lol:
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M 58 6ft 4in/1.94m 230lb/105kg
Team Oarsome

ranger
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Re: Ranger's training thread

Post by ranger » February 2nd, 2011, 2:08 am

The training bands are separated by 5 seconds per 500m.

The standard profile of paces for the best 60s lightweights comes out to be something like the following, which is 10 SPI, when done at 22, 26, 29, 33, and 38 spm.

UT2 1:57
UT1 1:52
AT 1:47
TR 1:42
AN 1:37

Trials at FM, 60min, 5K, 2K, and 1K just verify these numbers.

Lightweight and heavyweight rowers of the same age differ by four seconds per 500m.

So, the best heavyweight 60s rowers have a profile of paces that comes out something like this, which is 11 SPI, when done at 23, 26, 29, 33, and 38 spm.

UT2 1:53
UT1 1:48
AT 1:43
TR 1:38
AN 1:33

Trials at FM, 60min, 5K, 2K, and 1K just verify these numbers.

My targets are these, which is 12.7 SPI, when done at 22, 26, 29, 33, and 38 spm.

UT2 1:48
UT1 1:44
AT 1:39
TR 1:34
AN 1:29

These targets are eight seconds per 500m better than the best 60s lwts, four seconds per 500m better than the best 60s hwts.

The purpose of doing trials at FM, 60min, 5K, 2K, and 1K will just be to to verify these numbers.

In the end, how fast you are in rowing depends on how well you row.

12.7 SPI is rowing pretty darn well for a lightweight of any age.

My targets are just about the profile of the 37-year-old Eskild E., the most accomplished and decorated rower of our time, both OTW and OTErg, who is now training for his fourth (?) Olympics.

This guy:

Image
By null at 2010-09-21

ranger
Rich Cureton M 72 5'11" 165 lbs. 2K pbs: 6:27.5 (hwt), 6:28 (lwt)

ranger
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Re: Ranger's training thread

Post by ranger » February 2nd, 2011, 4:03 am

Greetings from the great blizzard of 2011.

It's coming down here in sheets. A foot or two of snow is supposed to fall in Ann Arbor over the next 24 hours.

Oh well.

Lots of digging to do tomorrow.

_Gorgeous_ "Steamroller" rowing now, right at 13 SPI (1:46 @ 22, 1:45 @ 23 spm, etc.), HR in the middle 150s, steady state.

This is perfect rowing for a lightweight of any age.

No skeletal-muscular or technical stress at all, just normal stroking.

I can do this sort of rowing for a FM, perhaps longer.

If I do, I will pb over 42K by eight seconds per 500m and equal, or better, the Open lwt FM WR.

The music is great.

It keeps me right on the beat.

The four big beats come on the leg drive, arm pull, prep position, and then the final descent to the catch.

I do the downbeats in the 4-beat measures on the arm pull, with the leg drive and back swing as accelerating, anticipatory upbeats.

The triple pulse (6/8 meter) that rides under the four big beats is right on the first three major gestures in the drive (quads, hams, abs) before the downbeat on the arm pull (delts and lats).

I am now learning little tricks to keep completely relaxed--occasional sweep-stroking, short-sliding, etc.

The variety helps.

This "Steamroller" rowing at 22 spm, together with my "Save a Horse, Ride a Cowboy" rowing at 26 spm, fixes the majority of my training for the rest of my life.

This is UT training, UT2 at 22 spm, UT1 at 26 spm.

119 df.

Amazingly, given my short little lightweight legs, at 13 SPI and 119 df., my drive time is only .5 seconds.

So I do this "Steamroller" rowing in a 4.4-to-1 ratio.

You can't get much more relaxed than that!

Between the (brief!) drives, there is plenty of time for lunch and a snooze.

When I do a FM trial, rowing to "Steamroller," I'll need to pack some sandwiches and grab a pillow.

:D :D

During the 2.5 hour FM row, I'll only be working for a half hour.

I'll be resting for the other two hours.

ranger
Last edited by ranger on February 2nd, 2011, 4:33 am, edited 2 times in total.
Rich Cureton M 72 5'11" 165 lbs. 2K pbs: 6:27.5 (hwt), 6:28 (lwt)

ranger
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Re: Ranger's training thread

Post by ranger » February 2nd, 2011, 4:29 am

BTW, 1:46 @ 22 spm, etc., 13 SPI, is exactly the level 4 pace and rate combination in the Wolverine Plan for a 1:34/6:16 2K.

22 spm is a maximal level 4 sequence in the Wolverine Plan.

A "220."

220 strokes in 10 minutes.

22 spm

ranger
Rich Cureton M 72 5'11" 165 lbs. 2K pbs: 6:27.5 (hwt), 6:28 (lwt)

ranger
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Re: Ranger's training thread

Post by ranger » February 2nd, 2011, 7:33 am

My registration form is now in for the "Record Challenge" at the Chicago venue on Feb. 26th.

So I have a month to continue to sharpen, get to weight, and try to beat Brian Bailey's 60s lwt WR of 6:42.

Then, I will also race at Detroit as a lightweight the weekend after that.

ranger
Rich Cureton M 72 5'11" 165 lbs. 2K pbs: 6:27.5 (hwt), 6:28 (lwt)

ranger
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Re: Ranger's training thread

Post by ranger » February 2nd, 2011, 7:51 am

According to the IP plan, 1:52 @ 22 spm (11.35 SPI) is UT2 rowing for my 2K pb, 1:37/6:28.

ranger
Rich Cureton M 72 5'11" 165 lbs. 2K pbs: 6:27.5 (hwt), 6:28 (lwt)

ranger
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Re: Ranger's training thread

Post by ranger » February 2nd, 2011, 8:26 am

BTW, it is not at all bad to listen to "Steamroller"--over and over.

The King could really belt it.

In this performance, he is really having fun.

Hit it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9VXr6U-B ... re=related

ranger
Rich Cureton M 72 5'11" 165 lbs. 2K pbs: 6:27.5 (hwt), 6:28 (lwt)

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