Ranger's training thread

[aharmer]

May 5, 2009: I am doing trials at the other distances this spring and summer.
If I can't reach my goals in those trials, then I'll pay up for the bet I lost.

Nov 17, 2010: I'll pay the bet when I lose it. I haven't lost the bet.

Byron, please quit distracting The Great One with these facts. He has an elaborate web of lies to weave in the next 24 hours.

[mikvan52]

Byron, please quit distracting The Great One with these facts. He has an elaborate web of lies to weave in the next 24 hours.

And if you think that's bad, just wait until 'excuse time' comes after TSO blows up in Birmingham:
There'll be more sputtering 'buts' than in all the brothels in Borneo.

[Byron Drachman]

And if you think that's bad, just wait until 'excuse time' comes after TSO blows up in Birmingham:

Hi Mike,
I came across a couple of good quotes submitted by pmacaula at rowing illustrated (quote of the day):

An athlete...afraid of performing poorly...will often go out much too hard...sabotaging his/her own test. The results will fall short of expectations, but at least he/she can say Hey, I went for it!" This attitude is unacceptable.

True mental toughness means having the discipline to not be overcome by adrenaline at the start, and holding back just enough to settle into a pace that, if held, will end up challenging your will to live by the end.

[mikvan52]

Byron:
What I will forever cherish will be ranger's explanation for the undoubtably weird splits that will be forthcoming from BIRC..
"the air was too dry"
"the hotel's (x) was too (y)"
... It will be true ranger genius! TSO eclipsing all prior efforts at the apogee of his troll-obloquy.
We will all need dark glasses and ear muffs to be able to bear his brilliance!

[jliddil]

Byron:
What I will forever cherish will be ranger's explanation for the undoubtably weird splits that will be forthcoming from BIRC..
"the air was too dry"
"the hotel's (x) was too (y)"
... It will be true ranger genius! TSO eclipsing all prior efforts at the apogee of his troll-obloquy.
We will all need dark glasses and ear muffs to be able to bear his brilliance!

And the odd thing is I know you will be proven right and the saga will continue

[ranger]

To hit my 2K target for WIRC 2011, and row to the limits of my potential, I will have to get comfortable with repeating 2Ks at 30 spm, all the way out to (at least) 4 x 2K.

I don't see why this can't be done.

If you do are rowing in a 3-to-1 ratio at low drag (120 df.), as I am, 30 spm can be a pretty comfortable affair, once you get used to it.

Most of the good singles at the Head of the Charles rate 30 spm for 5K.

Especially for a little lightweight, 30 spm is more of a 5K rate than a 2K rate.

When someone like Mike VB repeats 2Ks @ 1:45/7:00, he rates (at least) 30 spm.

I suspect that Brian Bailey rated (at least) 30 spm when he rowed the 60s lwt WR for 5K, which is just under 1:45 pace.

I suspect that Rod Freed rated (at least) 30 spm in all of his great distance rows, right out to a HM, which he also did at right around 1:45 pace.

Obviously, the problem with 55s/60s lwts pulling 1:37 @ 30 spm (13 SPI), as I will do at BIRC 2010, is stroking power.

The last time they squared off at WIRC, Rocket Roy and Mike VB both pulled 9.5 SPI, not 13 SPI.

So they missed 13 SPI by 3.5 watts per stroke, or what would be 105 watts in all, if they had been rating 30 spm.

105 watts is right around 10 seconds per 500m.

When they are racing, rating 30+ for 2K, stroking naturally, as you really have to in a 2K, Mike and Roy pull 1:47 @ 30 spm, not 1:37.

Over 2K, even 1:40 @ 30 spm (11.7 SPI) is _waaaay_ too stiff a stroking power for them, much less 1:37 @ 30 spm.

If they could even do 1:42 @ 30 spm (11 SPI) in a natural way, they would probably row 17:00 for 5K, but they miss it by almost a minute.

Historically, for a 55s/60s lwt, 1:45 @ 30 spm (10 SPI) is about it, as far as stroking power is concerned.

10 SPI

This also translates to 55s/60s heavyweights.

A big heavyweight will usually pull right around 3 SPI more than a little lightweight of the same age.

And sure enough, that what we have right now, too.

Nav pulls 13 SPI.

ranger

[luckylindy]

To hit my 2K target for WIRC 2011, and row to the limits of my potential, I will have to get comfortable with repeating 2Ks at 30 spm, all the way out to (at least) 4 x 2K.

I don't see why this can't be done.

If you do are rowing in a 3-to-1 ratio at low drag (120 df.), as I am, 30 spm can be a pretty comfortable affair, once you get used to it.

Except for the fact that performance has more to do with your aerobic capacity and body's energy pathways, not what is "comfortable". A 1:35 at 120df feels rather comfortable for me for a few hundred meters, but there's no way my body can sustain the wattage for longer than ~500m.

[ranger]

A 1:35 at 120df feels rather comfortable for me for a few hundred meters, but there's no way my body can sustain the wattage for longer than ~500m.

Do you row all of your UT work at 13 SPI, and therefore, do you row the 1:35, just naturally, at 31-32 spm?

If not, to do what I am suggesting for 2K, you need to return to your UT work and keep training.

Sharpening has nothing to do with training.

Sharpening never made anyone any better at rowing.

Training is an opportunity to improve.

It is not a race.

And all improvement comes at UT levels first, not in sharpening and racing.

You need to develop a certain level of stroking power with your training before you can use it for racing.

ranger

[ranger]

except for the fact that performance has more to do with your aerobic capacity and body's energy pathways, not what is "comfortable".

How much of your aerobic capacity you are using, and therefore how"'comfortable" you feel with a certain stroking power, depends on your technical/mechanical effectiveness and efficiency.

If you row like shit, everything feels hard.

Nothing is "comfortable," regardless of your aerobic capacity.

ranger

[ranger]

[removed]

[ranger]

Except for the fact that performance has more to do with your aerobic capacity and body's energy pathways, not what is "comfortable". A 1:35 at 120df feels rather comfortable for me for a few hundred meters, but there's no way my body can sustain the wattage for longer than ~500m.

Post a video of your rowing, just stroking naturally.

Let's see what you are doing technically and mechanically.

Post a force curve, too, just rowing naturally, so we can see what you do in terms of effectiveness.

I don't know about you, but to pull 13 SPI @ 120 df., I need a pretty instantaneous catch and then about 125 kgF of peak force on my stroke, in a left-leaning haystack contour.

ranger

[ranger]

luckylindy--

13 SPI is 1:44 @ 24 spm.

So, row at low rates until you can do 1:44 @ 24 spm (13 SPI) for a HM, that is, at top-end UT1.

Then, you will have no problem doing 2K, 1:35 @ 31-32 spm (13 SPI), once you are sharpened up, and can push your HR easily to AT, TR, and AN.

There are no short-cuts.

All improvement comes at UT levels.

UT2 work is primarily work on technical and mechanical/skeletal-motor effectiveness.

UT1 work is primarily work on technical and mechanical/skeletal-motor efficiency.

IMHO, until you reach your UT goals, there is no reason to row over 24 spm.

Absolutely the worst thing you can do is waste your training time trying to make pbs, racing as fast as you can, rowing like shit.

If you do that, you won't have a hope in hell of ever rowing to your full potential.

ranger

[ginster]

So, row at low rates until you can do 1:44 @ 24 spm (13 SPI) for a HM, that is, at top-end UT1.
...
IMHO, until you reach your UT goals, there is no reason to row over 24 spm.

so given that you haven't done a UT1 1:44@24 spm HM, are we to assume that you haven't done any rowing over 24 spm yet? BIRC is gonna be amusing....

why do you spout such complete and utter b**locks?

[Citroen]

I suspect that Brian Bailey rated (at least) 30 spm when he rowed the 60s lwt WR for 5K, which is just under 1:45 pace.

I suspect that Rod Freed rated (at least) 30 spm in all of his great distance rows, right out to a HM, which he also did at right around 1:45 pace.

You can write "I suspect" all you like, it doesn't hide the fact that you haven't a clue about Brian Bailey's or Roger Fraud's performances for the 5K or "all of his great distance rows".

Why do you spout such complete and utter b**locks?

[hjs]

A man should pay his debts the more so as he boasts of being easily able to do so.

I'll pay the bet when I lose it.

I haven't lost the bet.


ranger

When does that bet with Henry expire?

At the end of the month, the end of the 2009 indoor rowing season.
ranger

YOU WONT

No, this time, I certainly will.
I have to.
The possibility of losing $1000 is a good motivator.

It's twisting my arm!
True.
If I hadn't bet $1000 on my 2009 2K time, I wouldn't sharpen and race again.
But I _did_ bet on my 2009 2K time.
So...
Time to sharpen up (a bit) to prepare for a 2K.
I usually get a dozen seconds or so over 2K from a month or so of hard sharpening.
ranger