The Road To Boston 2008

General discussion on Training. How to get better on your erg, how to use your erg to get better at another sport, or anything else about improving your abilities.
Post Reply
Rowmaniac
1k Poster
Posts: 125
Joined: November 22nd, 2007, 5:51 pm
Location: California

Post by Rowmaniac » December 7th, 2007, 4:56 pm

Today was 2 x 8' AT. I see the 3 x 7' AT is up day after tomorrow, so I figured I'd just go for it and stop thinking about the bands today. Or my HR for that matter. It just gets inside my head and distracts my row.

4021m warmup at 22 spm

2 x 8' AT

Target 2:00 /27

Actual:

156.7 / 27spm 2056m

157.2 / 27 spm 2047m

c/d 4026m at 19

This workout felt like good, hard work. However, sometimes when the monitor says 156 or even 155, I let myself get distracted wondering how I ever held 151 or 152 or how I will hold lower splits (if and when, that is) for 2000 meters without wanting to let go of the handle and say screw it--this is too hard and why did I want to do this in the first place? I start to get tired and have to remind myself that I'm basically doing two 2Ks back to back for this workout so stop thinking so much. A certain amount of self doubt creeps in even though I know I'm never going to expect myself to row two 2Ks in one workout at race pace. I find it challenging to shut out those thoughts and just focus.

I continue to be amazed at how much of this training is mental.

We'll see how I do with the 3 x 7' AT. I expected more lactic acid ouchies today on the 2nd interval, but it was really not noticeable. I'll bet it's harder on that 3rd interval. I'm not exactly excited about going there.

Carla, nice work with a bad foot. Did you unstrap b/c of your foot or to work on feet out rowing? I'm just curious. I don't know if I can get a 1:59 split without foot straps. I once fell off the erg, but that is another story. And yes, I had an audience at the boathouse. What a sight that was :roll:
Last edited by Rowmaniac on December 7th, 2007, 9:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Deborah - F 45 HWT

seat5
2k Poster
Posts: 467
Joined: March 16th, 2006, 8:28 pm

Post by seat5 » December 7th, 2007, 7:53 pm

Hi Deb,

I almost always row unstrapped. It is better for your technique. I was advised--not personally but from forum posts-- to do so by Paul Smith (PaulS on the forum) who is a highly esteemed coach. I can't even really remember the reasons behind it but you can find them if you look around on the forum threads.

The only time I row with straps is if the pace is going to be around 2K or faster--for regular workouts or races. Or, if it's a longer piece with a pace around 2:00, I would strap in if it was for some sort of on line competition. I would never strap in for a 10K (I don't think I have, anyway) or longer piece even when it is for ranking or competition.


I didn't ace my foot today and maybe should have. The weekend off should help it.

Nice 8 min pieces. Now I wonder why your 3 x 7 is coming up so soon when I thought we were a week apart. hmmmm I really have to check the calendar!
Carla Stein--F 47 HWT

[img]http://www.c2ctc.com/sigs/img1193870739.png[/img]

TomR
6k Poster
Posts: 782
Joined: March 16th, 2006, 10:48 am

Post by TomR » December 7th, 2007, 8:27 pm

6x500, 2 min recovery. 20 min/4,400 mtr warm-up.

avg 1.49.2
final HR 168.

1.49.7
1.49.5
1.49.4
1.49.2
1.48.9
1.48.9

Judging by HR the last 2 nights, I think I lost a bit of fitness as a result of dawdling since Thanksgiving.

Rowmaniac
1k Poster
Posts: 125
Joined: November 22nd, 2007, 5:51 pm
Location: California

Post by Rowmaniac » December 7th, 2007, 9:49 pm

Carla, I just checked my IP schedule sheet and I am finishing week 5 and I was wrong-- I do 2 x 10'AT on Sunday. The 3 x 7' AT is next Sunday--end of week 6. I'm finishing week 5 of a 16 week plan, and according to my printout, race day is Sunday, February 24, 2008 which is literally the last day of my plan at the end of week 16. The last week of the plan does include the proper taper days. Are you finishing week 6 of a 16 week plan?

That said, if you are a week ahead then maybe you have some built in time in case you get sick or something. Just a thought. I am budgeted down to the wire.

Yes, the benefits of feet out rowing have been drilled into my head by my OTW coach, but it seems harder on my back to row feet out on the erg, so I don't like it. You are doing the better thing, no doubt anyone would agree. I wonder if I can get brave enough to go there even 1/2 time. Something to ponder.

Tom, are you feeling like Boston is in the cards? I don't know what you did last year, but if those times are your 2K race pace then they look pretty good to me! I am envious :shock:
Deborah - F 45 HWT

TomR
6k Poster
Posts: 782
Joined: March 16th, 2006, 10:48 am

Post by TomR » December 7th, 2007, 10:12 pm

Deborah--

Not sure about Boston this year. Last year I snuck under 7.15, a 1.48++ pace. A 6x50 at 1.49 would not yield a 1.49 2k, alas. Perhaps in two months.

By the way, I don't row strapless. I know many recommend it, but there are limits to my interest in self-improvement.

Good luck quieting the distracting internal chatter when you erg. Focus on each stroke. Give yourself some mental rituals to keep your mind from undermining you. Last year there was a thread about mantras people use when rowing

http://www.c2forum.com/viewtopic.php?t= ... ht=mantras

User avatar
coggs
2k Poster
Posts: 206
Joined: September 19th, 2006, 12:18 pm
Location: Westminster, Ma.

Post by coggs » December 7th, 2007, 11:57 pm

It's been a while since I posted. Not sure if this should go under Road to Boston or just General Training. Took most of October and November off after a long summer of OTW rowing with little erging. Did a bit of cycling in the fall but once the NE weather turned cold I got back on the erg. Very slow! Most steady state were well over 2:00 pace to start. Surprising how far my fitness had slipped and was pretty discouraged, but the Holiday challenge inspired me. Set a goal of 200,000 despite a vacation meaning the 15th will be my last row. And then I missed the first three days. Quite a hole but I'm on track to reach the goal on with a couple of days to spare. The base seemed to help as I was feeling good yesterday and did a 10K at a 1:56 pace which is only 9 seconds off my PB. Maybe I'll be ready for Boston after all. Guess after I get back from my Holiday it's time for intervals and pyramids. Oh joy!!
If you don't try, you will never know how bad you suck.

Master D (54) / 208#
500M/1:38, 2K/7:02.3, 6K/22:17, 10K/38:31, 30'/7,700M, 60'/15,331M, HM /1hr 23:03 (all done back in 2007)

seat5
2k Poster
Posts: 467
Joined: March 16th, 2006, 8:28 pm

Post by seat5 » December 8th, 2007, 11:53 am

Tom, that's a nice set of 500s. I have stuff like that coming up soon and I'm scared of it!

You should come to Boston. It sounds like if you committed yourself you would do well, and committing yourself would probably feel better than being undecided.

Hey coggs! good to hear from you. It is hard to make a come back after taking time off the erg but it feels great to get back into it. Just be patient with yourself until you have some endurance base built up and then are ready for more intensity. Keep us posted!
Last edited by seat5 on December 8th, 2007, 11:58 am, edited 1 time in total.
Carla Stein--F 47 HWT

[img]http://www.c2ctc.com/sigs/img1193870739.png[/img]

seat5
2k Poster
Posts: 467
Joined: March 16th, 2006, 8:28 pm

Post by seat5 » December 8th, 2007, 11:54 am

Deborah: boy am I confused. The CrashB is 2/24. That is 11 weeks from now. On my chart, I just finished week 6 of an 18 week program that I got this year off the IP page (the only thing I'm using from last year is the pace/spm chart for the bands). That leaves 12 weeks on my chart, which is too many, so I have to skip a week. That would put me in week 8 next week:2 x 8 AT, 3 x 15 UT1, 3 x 3 TR, 2 x 10 AT.

How many weeks do you have left on your chart? you should have 11 left.

I am not sure I'm ready to do TR yet! I was thinking I would back up a week to be on the same one you are. But if I do that I will have 13 weeks left, which would be even more off. I am going to print out the chart you are on and see how different it is from mine--maybe I'll switch charts so we are on the same workouts.

I have had pretty significant back problems in the past and have not found feet out to have any impact on that. I have found that improving core strength with ab work on a swiss ball and lots of stretching have virtually eliminated serious pain.
Carla Stein--F 47 HWT

[img]http://www.c2ctc.com/sigs/img1193870739.png[/img]

Rowmaniac
1k Poster
Posts: 125
Joined: November 22nd, 2007, 5:51 pm
Location: California

Post by Rowmaniac » December 8th, 2007, 12:36 pm

Hi, Carla

Now I think I see what the problem is with our timing differences. I am on a 16 week plan, you are on an 18 week plan. I am just finishing week 5, with 11 weeks to go. Your Feb 24 race date is correct. The race is 11 weeks from tomorrow. Now some of the differences make sense.

I wasn't sure if my test 2K was going to put me anywhere close enough to actually consider going to the race, and when I finally tested before Thanksgiving, I had to choose the shortest plan the IP offers and jump in. Luckily I had not missed any AT work and had been rowing lots of good paced meters, so I jumped into the 3rd week and did 3 of the workouts. So I guess effectively I skipped the first 2 weeks of their plan, but I am adhering to the 16 week plan with the last day of my plan on race day.

It seems to me you could just reprint the 16 week plan and begin week 6, but then you already did week 6 so I don't know!

The one thing that still puzzles me is that for your race pace, last year's bands have you targeting lower times than this year's plan does for me. I wish I could see what you have for last year to compare. My AT band is 2:00- 2:06; TR is 1:50- 2:00 (seems awfully broad to me); and the AN is 1:47-1:50. Does your TR work have you targeting under 1:50? Ditto for AN at 1:47? Of course, I will have to do the 2K test after week 8 according to this thing, and I think you are supposed to redo your chart based on your new 2K time anyway, so if I can bring that test time down, maybe my targets will have to go down, too. (That assumes the time is lower, who the heck knows? I already dread doing that test.)

I think the thing about feet out is that I don't feel comfortable getting as much layback at the finish of the stroke. I do work on core/ab exercises almost daily, but I know that stronger abs would help. Thanks for your thoughts on that.

I just took my airline tickets to Boston off of "on hold" and purchased them, so I'm committed. 11 weeks to go. (I did use FF miles, and can put them back for a fee--I suppose I am still having trouble believing I can do this...)

Carla, since you add in one long row each week, what kind of pace do you do? I am tempted to add a long, steady state row today because I love how I feel when I finish (I have decided that if Freud know about erging, he might add a chapter to his psychology book called, "The compulsive erging affliction"), and I could use the workout to burn off some calories. I guess I could go for a medium cardio heart rate and just row, but I wondered how you choose how hard to row these extra 10Ks or 14Ks or whatever you do. If I go too hard, it could screw up tomorrow's workout.

Fwiw, I don't have another 45ish rower here at my club who trains like you do and is as closely matched to what I can do as you are. It's cool to know you are out there, and no matter what happens at the race, I really look fwd to meeting you. :)
Deborah - F 45 HWT

Bob S.
Marathon Poster
Posts: 5142
Joined: March 16th, 2006, 12:00 pm

Post by Bob S. » December 9th, 2007, 1:22 am

Today (December 8th) I did a repeat of a workout that I did on the 21th of November. It was a 60’ all-in-one piece, including 15’ each of warm up and cool down. The middle 30’ was at a 20spm steady state except for 5 x 45’ of sprints at 5’ intervals. I had the monitor set for 17 intervals with zero seconds for each rest:

5’ @ 12 spm
5’ @ 15 spm
5’ @ 18 spm
5’ @ 20 spm
45” sprint (33 spm ave.)
4:15 @ 20 spm
45” sprint (33 spm ave.)
4:15 @ 20 spm
45” sprint (33 spm ave.)
4:15 @ 20 spm
45” sprint (35 spm ave.)
4:15 @ 20 spm
45” sprint (36 spm ave.)
4:15 @ 20 spm
5’ @ 18 spm
5’ @ 15 spm
5’ @ 12 spm

The total distance was 12647m. Not great, but O.K. for a training piece that included the warm up and cool down.

But, when I went back to compare it with the previous workout with the same monitor settings, I was completely blown away. The total distances were identical!!! There was a fair amount of pace variation in comparing the appropriate intervals between the two and the average sprint rates in the November piece were generally higher, 37, 33, 36, 36, and 39. As a numbers freak, I was more jazzed by this coincidence of equal distances than I would have been by a particularly successful workout.

Bob S.

User avatar
Yankeerunner
10k Poster
Posts: 1193
Joined: March 16th, 2006, 12:17 pm
Location: West Newbury, MA
Contact:

Post by Yankeerunner » December 9th, 2007, 9:46 am

seat5 wrote:Hey Rick,
Are you using the IP or planning to? I haven't kept up with your diary, are you still doing those sadistic wheel barrow workouts? And when is NE2K 2008?

Today was my first TR workout. It was a little hard. Target was 1:58/26 10 min--I was a little slow at 1:58.5/26. Still on 80 lbs on the 3 x 10 squats. I think I will put it up to 85 next week.

Mel is home from college and told me she's doing 4 x 6 squats with 135 lbs. Sheesh. I am an old lady!

Hope you guys feel better soon. I will miss my Friday workout but plan on getting in a session on Saturday to make up for it as I really want to make the Holiday Challenge this year.
Carla,

You haven't kept up with my dairy?!?!? Shame on you! :D

For the first time in a while I am not doing the IP. When Dave Nock and I put our heads together after BIRC we decided that I needed to shake things up severely. I'm currently doing more short intervals than ever before and between those workouts covering the monitor (except for the meters box) and going by 'feel' at S10MPS, striving to avoid excessive strain while not loafing. So far I like it. It will be interesting to see where it leads.

The 5th NE2KC is tentatively scheduled for Sunday January 20th. I keep meaning to get an email out to the previous participants but have been procrastinating. There is a good chance that we will have another event as well. Doug Smith from Newburyport was in and said that his wife is now on the board of the Lowell Boat Shop in Amesbury and wants an event there. At first he thought that maybe mine could move over there, but I would like to keep mine as is. I suggested having a second event to give us more opportunities. Maybe two weeks before or two weeks after the Newburyport one?

Rick

seat5
2k Poster
Posts: 467
Joined: March 16th, 2006, 8:28 pm

Post by seat5 » December 9th, 2007, 2:10 pm

Yankeerunner wrote:
Carla,

You haven't kept up with my dairy?!?!? Shame on you! :D

For the first time in a while I am not doing the IP. When Dave Nock and I put our heads together after BIRC we decided that I needed to shake things up severely. I'm currently doing more short intervals than ever before and between those workouts covering the monitor (except for the meters box) and going by 'feel' at S10MPS, striving to avoid excessive strain while not loafing. So far I like it. It will be interesting to see where it leads.

The 5th NE2KC is tentatively scheduled for Sunday January 20th. I keep meaning to get an email out to the previous participants but have been procrastinating. There is a good chance that we will have another event as well. Doug Smith from Newburyport was in and said that his wife is now on the board of the Lowell Boat Shop in Amesbury and wants an event there. At first he thought that maybe mine could move over there, but I would like to keep mine as is. I suggested having a second event to give us more opportunities. Maybe two weeks before or two weeks after the Newburyport one?

Rick
It should be interesting to see how things pan out for you this season with your new regime!

RE: NE2KC, 1/20 seems fine. I don't know if I'll be able to handle another event--yours and CrashB are enough stress for me, I think, unless maybe Doug's event could have other distances, like a 5K or something. don't think I'm up for another serious all out 2K. It seems to take a lot out of me to prepare and to recover. whimper whimper :oops:

are you still doing the wheel barrows?
Carla Stein--F 47 HWT

[img]http://www.c2ctc.com/sigs/img1193870739.png[/img]

Rowmaniac
1k Poster
Posts: 125
Joined: November 22nd, 2007, 5:51 pm
Location: California

Post by Rowmaniac » December 9th, 2007, 3:05 pm

I don't know if I'll be able to handle another event--yours and CrashB are enough stress for me, I think, unless maybe Doug's event could have other distances, like a 5K or something. don't think I'm up for another serious all out 2K. It seems to take a lot out of me to prepare and to recover.
Spoken like a true erg warrior, Carla. 2K is too hard, can I go 5K instead??? :P

Seriously, I know what you mean. Our rowing club usually has its annual "erg rodeo" the same weekend as the CRASH B, so I thought I'd miss it this year, but now they've scheduled it for January 26, so I think I will row it for a final 2K test 4 weeks out from the CRASH B. I already get a little flurry of anxiety just thinking about it.

Yesterday I made myself happy with a nice 60' row. I focused on form and consistency, and went about 13,500m. I kept my HR nice and low (for me--I have a low resting HR but keeping it at 148 average takes some restraint) and felt good. Today is 2 x 10'AT and I would just like to be able to do them close to what I did 2 x 8'AT on Friday. We shall see. I am having a little soreness in my right 'tennis elbow' area, so I've been icing it.

I've got about 67,000 more HC meters to go. I wonder how many Christmas sugar cookies you burn rowing 200K. I haven't had any yet, but I would like to designate some as my own prize.
Deborah - F 45 HWT

Bob S.
Marathon Poster
Posts: 5142
Joined: March 16th, 2006, 12:00 pm

Post by Bob S. » December 9th, 2007, 5:40 pm

Bob S. wrote: But, when I went back to compare it with the previous workout with the same monitor settings, I was completely blown away. The total distances were identical!!!
Bob S.
I was so carried away by the euphoria over the happy coincidence of the equal distance numbers that I forgot to report on the more meaningful numbers of the day:

For the holiday challenge, I had reached 108k, so I was a little over half way to the usual goal and it was just about half way through the time period. I am not signed up for this, since I am not interested in pins, t-shirts, and mugs — or whatever, but it is still a nice goal to shoot for. Last season I cleared it by only about 3k.

For the season, I had less than 11k to go for 1 million meters and there was less than 6k needed to reach 6 million so-called life time meters. In this case, life time means since september of 2003 when I resumed erg work. I don't have the data entered for the 14 years previous to that time.

I picked up another couple of km today from my daily wake up row, so I should make the season 1 million and the life time 6 million this week even if I don't do what I would call a workout.

Bob S.

seat5
2k Poster
Posts: 467
Joined: March 16th, 2006, 8:28 pm

Post by seat5 » December 9th, 2007, 9:50 pm

I already get a little flurry of anxiety just thinking about it.
my little flurries of anxiety usually send me running to the bathroom....
Carla Stein--F 47 HWT

[img]http://www.c2ctc.com/sigs/img1193870739.png[/img]

Post Reply