Rowing And Weightwatchers

[old] b sayyed · Post by **[old] b sayyed** » October 15th, 2004, 1:19 pm

I thought the calorie estimator used a bodyweight of 175 lbs, not 150 (both the manual and the weight adjusted calorie counter state this). You can get a weight adjusted calorie counter from Concept 2 -- just give them a call.

[old] Tom_Pinckney · Post by **[old] Tom_Pinckney** » October 19th, 2004, 8:08 am

One thing that is not mentioned in the article about athletes gaining weight after discontinuing training is that someone that was formerly fit and muscular will qain muscle and fitness faster than someone that has never exercised at all.

[old] beemo · Post by **[old] beemo** » October 19th, 2004, 8:52 pm

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td class='genmed'>QUOTE (rowmantic @ Oct 15 2004, 12:04 AM)</td></tr><tr><td class='quote'> Beth, Have you been able to figure out your race versus moderate pace for the erg? I had a hard time trying to determine the number of APs earned for rowing on the water and for using the erg. The best advice I received was from the WW Daily Strokes message board to count 1 AP for every 2k. I think this is fairly accurate. When I started calculating 1 AP for every 2k I rowed I began to lose weight. For example today, I used the erg for 40 minutes and went slightly over 9,000 and the calories burned were over 500. I counted this as 4 APs. Janice is much younger than I and can get away with making that 5 APs. I think that you will need to be very vigilant of how many APs you use and determine if you can round up or down on your 5k erg. ~Grace  </td></tr></table> Yeah, I'm a little fuzzy on that. 5000k - 150 cals burned.... And the WW website defines it as light-moderate-high exercise in general, not specific to rowing. If I go by their guidelines, it sounds like a race pace to me but I know that I'm just doing what's comfortable, you know? Right now, I'm doing 5000k in 30/31 minutes (with about 4 minutes of rest mixes in there) I guess the short answer to your question would be no, I haven't figured it out. If you go 2k=1 ap, that's only 2.5 ap, and the board gives 3 for moderate rowing for 30 minutes, so it's sounds like that's kind of a low estimate...

[old] Janice · Post by **[old] Janice** » October 20th, 2004, 12:59 am

Beth, I think in your case as you are new to this, the important thing is just to stick with it and not get too hung up on the points. If you are losing, don't sweat it and count your erging the way WW has you doing so. If you want to know how intense you are erging ask yourself if you could you sing for a few beats, Talk to someone else for a few seconds, or only exercise? Those are the WW guidelines for low, moderate, and high. If you want any other advice or help, feel free to PM me, I was there 75lbs ago so I know just what it is like to get started

[old] tracysaville · Post by **[old] tracysaville** » October 23rd, 2004, 1:03 pm

Hello all, i have enjoyed reading the reply's. I have been thinking of trying Weight Watcher's and you have helped me finally make the move. I have put on considerable weight (not going to get lame with excuses...in the end it's more calories consummed than used) and hope to use rowing as my aerobic exercise of choice. Again, thanks for the positive reply's and helping me on my way. Mr. Tracy Saville <a href='mailto:tracysaville@msn.com'>tracysaville@msn.com</a>

[old] Tom_Pinckney · Post by **[old] Tom_Pinckney** » October 25th, 2004, 7:20 am

Activity points are based on the estimated (perceived exertion) intensity of the workout. If the workout were high in intensity, perhaps it's more points than you think. Regardless of the number of points involved when either exercising or eating food, the weight watchers program gives one the discipline to lose weight correctly without starving yourself. Keeping a food log is one of the best ideas for recording your food intake/exercise thus enabling you to plan your program efficiently. It also helps make one aware of what they are eating in terms of calories, etc. I believe the Weight Watchers program to be the best of the bunch. I lost 54 pounds while in the program. It included sensible eating (not dieting) and exercise. Although the rower does give one the number of calories burned, etc. I believe it is for someone of a body weight of approx. 180 pounds. Thus, it would differ for each one of us. Regardless of the number of points involved, quite obviously, the rower is a wonderful tool for losing weight. Recently, I bought my own rower and am quite thrilled with my progress so far. I've only had it a short time now and am cross-training the rower and Nordic Trac Ski Machine (I don't believe they are manufactured anymore). By using machines that work the whole body (and larger muscles) I have found them both to be great machines to lose weight without putting great stress on my joints (I have several past injuries). By using different machines that work the whole body differently, I have avoided overtraining and new injuries. This is the aerobic content of my program. I also lift weights to build muscle (muscle burns fat faster) and watch the fat content of a balanced diet. There's no reason to go to any extremes if you program is for weightloss and good heath. A while back, I used a heart rate monitor (chest strap type) and tested the gym machines to see which ones got my heart rate up and kept it there with the least amount of energy expended. Although some machines give you the impression that you are working very hard ("percieved exertion), I have found that the Concept2 and Nordik Trac to be the best of the bunch for me to burn calories faster, more efficiently and with less effort than any other pieces of eqipment. Of utmost importance is the ability of these machines to give you a good workout without undue stress on my joints. At 59 years of age with back and knee injuries (hurt on the job as a police officer), my workouts are basically stress-free!! During the weight loss program I've discovered that adding (to 30 minutes a day at the gym on the Nordik Trac) an additional easy 30 minutes a day (only about 5000 meters) on the rower (at home) while watching TV results in a very good weight loss weight of about 2-3 pounds a week. This amounts to about one hour per day doing an aerobic activity. Janice: 1500 calories a day? Depending on your size, could it be that your body is going into starvation mode (slowing down your metabolism in cave-man mode) to compensate for lack of food? Could be a slight addition of food could increase your weight loss due to increased metabolism to burn it up. Just a thought!! Tom

[old] Janice · Post by **[old] Janice** » October 25th, 2004, 11:20 am

Tom: Yeah, 1500, I actually only get 24 points a day which works out to 1200 calories. Add in a few flex points and APs earned and I'm somewhere around 1500. I've tried eating more and nothing. I've been the same since June and getting pretty frustrated. I think that I might have gotten as far as I can with WW and need to look for more of an athlete's plan - I've read on the message board that some people who exercise at a high intesity daily have had the same problems.

[old] DIESEL · Post by **[old] DIESEL** » October 25th, 2004, 1:57 pm

Janice, I have been reading your posts.. and I have a question: Do you do any work with weights? If you don't, that could be part of your problem. Given the amount of rowing you do, and the relatively meager number of calories you are consuming (for a rower, ) it could very well be that your metabolism has "shut down" in order to conserve itself. What's probably going on is that your body is catabolizing its muscle mass in order to feed the demands of your workouts and the recovery demands rowing places on your body. The irony is that your body will go right after the muscle mass because it's much easier for it to break down instead of body fat. Thus creating the phenomenon known as "skinny fat" (i.e. the scale says you are "skinny", but when you look in the mirror you're still kind of flabby and not at all "toned." ) You can try the following experiment. Up your calories to 2000/day - keep the same rowing volume, you are doing now, but add in 2-3x times a week a 30 minute weight workout - to add some lean mass and jumpstart your metabolism. If you are really adventurous - ask someone at your gym to teach you the Olympic lifts like the Clean and Jerk, Snatch, and some other great rowing specific exercises like the squat and pull-ups. And no, you don't have to hoist tons of weight like you see those girls doing at the Olympics - just slap some 5lb. plates on the bar and get cracking...it's a great muscle stimulator and it trains your explosive fibers, something that will come in very handy in those last 250m if you ever choose to race. One last thing: also consider spacing out your meals over 6-7 smaller meals at 2-3 hour intervals.. the constant supply of calories keeps your blood sugar levels stable and will keep your metabolism humming all through the day. It makes your body more efficient, rather than having to slug through the metabolic peaks and valleys of the traditional 3 squares a day routine we were all brought up with. Remember Janice, WW is cool, but it isn't really designed for athletes. hope this helps, D

[old] Janice · Post by **[old] Janice** » October 25th, 2004, 6:25 pm

Diesel, Funny you should mention weights because it is when I started doing them I stopped losing weight completely! My loss had been slowing up to that point, about 1/2 a week and after 1 week of working with weights it stopped completely. I've been doing 3, 30 minute sessions a week of all over body stuff, focusing on my core muscle groups. This is in addition to 4 rowing sessions a week and 16 hours of shelving books. I wouldn't say I've gone skinny fat as I've dropped a clothing size and my body has changed. For my weight I'm already really quite lean (I think Pete could atest to that). I'm not sure what my body fat % is, but when I last had it measured in January it was 28% and I was 40lbs heavier than I am now and not nearly as active. While I'm quite happy with having picked up muscle and dropping a size, I'd really like to start losing weight again because I know I would be faster on the C2 if I was lighter. I'd also like to get the last 25lbs off because I know I would look and feel better. If you're curious about exact numbers, I'll share but 25lbs would get me to "normal". Your weight suggestions are nice, but I can't really do those given some current back problems I'm having that is even keeping rowing from happening as much as it should. Thanks for trying to help!

[old] DIESEL · Post by **[old] DIESEL** » October 25th, 2004, 11:33 pm

hi janice, it sounds like you've put on some muscle mass that's why the scale stayed put even though you were dropping body fat (seeing as you still dropped a clothing size) hmmm.. well I could suggest something called "anabolic nutrient timing" and "low glycemic carb cycling" ---- that should definitely do the trick, but will require a lot of planning and discipline. It will however, work -- get you as lean as you want without much significant reduction in lean body mass. Think lots of oatmeal, brown rice, and sweet potatoes, lean cuts of meat, protein powders, flax oil, TONS of leavy green veggies and water. Spartan, yes, but very, very effective. Let me know if you're interested.... cheers, D

[old] Tom_Pinckney · Post by **[old] Tom_Pinckney** » October 26th, 2004, 6:45 am

Janice: sounds like you are doing very well to me. Keep up the good work. I have back problems myself and have learned how to work around them. However, sometimes they comeback to visit me and really screw me up. Then I have to back off and get started again. This has been going on for me since 1978 (my first back injury). Keep on pluggin' Tom

[old] tditmar · Post by **[old] tditmar** » October 26th, 2004, 11:35 am

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td class='genmed'>QUOTE (Xeno @ Sep 28 2004, 11:46 AM)</td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>Unrelated information: I own a van that advertises the IRON OARSMAN and on it is also says: Get off your bike and row. We also thought of writing: get on your butt and do something. </td></tr></table> Xeno, I couldn't help thinking about this, like a song stuck in my head, but how about "Get on Your Butt...and Move!" I think it deepens the irony, and of course exercise is all about moving. "Do Something" could mean playing cards, etc. Plus, it is not targeted at just a specific group, like bicyclists. It is probably a non-issue to you, but I thought I would throw my two cents out anyway. PS I used to be a neighbor. I lived in Corona del Mar for 11yrs. Poppy St. I'm also a UC Irvine Alum, now residing in Chicago. Boy do I miss it at times, but Chicago is a great city. Anyway, I have read your posts and checked out your website and think it is fortunate for everyone here someone like you makes yourself available and part of the C2 forum.

[old] Tom_Pinckney · Post by **[old] Tom_Pinckney** » October 28th, 2004, 8:02 am

The Weight Watchers website is available for all to view. However, there are some sections of the site that you must pay for. Your weekly dues do not cover this. Janice: Here's a link you might be intersted in: <a href='http://www.cbass.com/FATBURN.HTM' target='_blank'>http://www.cbass.com/FATBURN.HTM</a> Basically, it says that doing interval training rather than long, slow distance is more efficient for weight loss. This is explained in his book that the body burns more calories at rest after doing a high-intensity activity. The intervals help you avoid being burned out by such strenuous exercise, thus allowing you to complete a longer workout.

[old] tditmar · Post by **[old] tditmar** » October 28th, 2004, 9:34 am

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td class='genmed'>QUOTE (Tom_Pinckney @ Oct 28 2004, 07:02 AM)</td></tr><tr><td class='quote'> Janice: Here's a link you might be intersted in: <a href='http://www.cbass.com/FATBURN.HTM' target='_blank'>http://www.cbass.com/FATBURN.HTM</a> Basically, it says that doing interval training rather than long, slow distance is more efficient for weight loss. This is explained in his book that the body burns more calories at rest after doing a high-intensity activity. The intervals help you avoid being burned out by such strenuous exercise, thus allowing you to complete a longer workout. </td></tr></table> Here are a couple of other supporting articles/data regarding the same thing (interval training for fat loss.) I bought the x-iser as a complement to my C2 on slides and am glad I did. I have been using the short bout program throughout my day at work and after only 3 sessions can tell it will make a significant difference long term. It doesn't seem so expensive now. <a href='http://xiser.com/SBEP.html' target='_blank'>http://xiser.com/SBEP.html</a> <a href='http://xiser.com/MetResearch.html' target='_blank'>http://xiser.com/MetResearch.html</a> <a href='http://xiser.com/Abstract.html' target='_blank'>http://xiser.com/Abstract.html</a> Check out the machine itself at: <a href='http://xiser.com/Xiser.html' target='_blank'>http://xiser.com/Xiser.html</a>

[old] Tom_Pinckney · Post by **[old] Tom_Pinckney** » October 28th, 2004, 11:00 am

Thanks for your response. I found this information in a book called "Challenge Yourself." It is written by Clarence Bass, a lifelong fitness enthusiast/bodybuilder. Clarence is in his 60s and maintains a body fat composition in the single digits. At one point, below 3% bodyfat when he won the masters Mr. America contest. I can relate to what he says (I am 59 yrs. old) and use his training methods as guidelines. Although I am a new erg owner, I used one in the past and had really good results by using the long, slow distance method (when it was popular). Although intervals seem to be the "new thing," LSD does work. For me, it does work (probably a better choice than intervals) because I have had numerous permanent injuries (back, neck, shoulder, knees) as a police officer of 31 years. On top of that, I also had 1/3 of my lung removed 15 years ago due to cancer (no, I never smoked). I have been able to lose weight, rebuild my lung capacity & I find the Concept2 and Nordic Trac (Pro Skier) cause less stress to my joints and past injuries, thus - they are great fat-burning tools that I can handle. The steppers, etc. cause much more stress than these two pieces of equipment and are more fun to use. It's also wonderful that one can compete agains others with the rower. Although a "newby", I look forward to years of using my erg. Great to have a forum like this to ask questions and to pass on one's views. We all can learn from one another. Tom

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