CTC sprints

[john_n]

Anyone have comments about the c2ctc sprints for this month?

I wasn't even going to attempt it, because the idea of short sprints and then sitting idle in between does not sound healthy. I mean, after running, biking or rowing vigorously, I always do a warm-down so the large muscles of the body can assist in blood circulation while the heart is slowing. Sitting idle after a sprint sounds like a good way for blood to build up in the lower extremities and if nothing else contribute to distended, varicose-looking veins in the lower legs.

But I had the idea that, since the computer screen will display a countdown timer for the idle time, I could just keep an eye on that timer and, since rowing in the rest time is forbidden, could do something else with my legs, such as walking. So I walked on a treadmill, set at 3mph, during each rest period, until the countdown timer displayed 10 seconds to go, then sat on the rower again and got in position to row the next sprint.

What would be the point of sprinting and then being totally idle in the rest period?

I found that, even with the rest periods, one needs to pace oneself. The first sprint was at an average pace of about 1:35, but in the 4th sprint I was getting a bit winded so I caught my breath by slowing to an average pace of about 1:51 in that interval. Overall, had an avg pace of 1:42, but there should be plenty of room for improvement on that, once I figure out what is the right pace to start out with.

[Yankeerunner]

I never thought of that. (I did mine by just sitting and waiting for the next rep to come around.) Good idea. If I do another before the month is out I'll try it your way.

Rick

[johnlvs2run]

What would be the point of sprinting and then being totally idle in the rest period?

Quicker recovery, though it would be faster laying down.

I just rested on the erg in between, which was plenty hard enough and, even so, almost didn't get my breath back after the 8th one.

Focusing on long complete exhalations during the rest helped a lot, then I took the 9th one slightly easier and picked up again on the 10th but not much.

They are definitely tough!

[hjs]

Anyone have comments about the c2ctc sprints for this month?

I wasn't even going to attempt it, because the idea of short sprints and then sitting idle in between does not sound healthy. I mean, after running, biking or rowing vigorously, I always do a warm-down so the large muscles of the body can assist in blood circulation while the heart is slowing. Sitting idle after a sprint sounds like a good way for blood to build up in the lower extremities and if nothing else contribute to distended, varicose-looking veins in the lower legs.

But I had the idea that, since the computer screen will display a countdown timer for the idle time, I could just keep an eye on that timer and, since rowing in the rest time is forbidden, could do something else with my legs, such as walking. So I walked on a treadmill, set at 3mph, during each rest period, until the countdown timer displayed 10 seconds to go, then sat on the rower again and got in position to row the next sprint.

What would be the point of sprinting and then being totally idle in the rest period?

I found that, even with the rest periods, one needs to pace oneself. The first sprint was at an average pace of about 1:35, but in the 4th sprint I was getting a bit winded so I caught my breath by slowing to an average pace of about 1:51 in that interval. Overall, had an avg pace of 1:42, but there should be plenty of room for improvement on that, once I figure out what is the right pace to start out with.

If you sprint and feel the need to not rest in between there is only one thing to say: you don,t try hard enough.
Afterwards you can do all the cool down you need and want.

[john_n]

If you sprint and feel the need to not rest in between there is only one thing to say: you don,t try hard enough.
Afterwards you can do all the cool down you need and want.

My point was not that I didn't feel the need to rest in between sprints. I believe it is most likely harmful to be totally idle in between sprints.

In everything I've read about the reasons for warm-downs there is a warning to not just stop and stand still after a run, but rather to walk for 10 minutes or so to let the contractions of the large muscles of the legs continue to aid the heart in pumping the blood from the lower extremities while the heart is slowing.

If walking in between sprints, rather than being totally motionless, means I won't be able to get quite as good a time, I think the trade-off is worth it.

After all, the competition is just for fun and for the sake of good health.

I suppose the same health issue could be addressed by laying prone in between sprints, as one poster suggested. But from that position I couldn't see the countdown clock.

[hjs]

John,

I don,t think that pushing yourself to the limit is healty in the first place. For me is erging not something I do for my health.

Bye the way if you to keep moving inbetween the sprints you could put the handle down and just keep going up and down the slide. This would be active rest without moving the handle.

[Citroen]

With a one minute rest, you're not going to get your HR down to your recoveryHR (2 * restingHR) (for me that's 100).

If you're going hard on the 250m work, you'll push HR way up (for me over 170). So, this test gets progressively harder on each successive interval.

You need the full minute to be able to get the best possible overall time.

On the tenth interval you can go full eyeballs out (as you have limitless rest).

To illustrate this; here's a HR graph from a 5K warm-up, 8 * 250m 2:00r, 20' cool down I did in January.

[Bob S.]

To illustrate this; here's a HR graph from a 5K warm-up, 8 * 250m 2:00r, 20' cool down I did in January.

How did you get the graph?

Bob S.

[Citroen]

How did you get the graph?

I wore a Suunto HR belt and captured the data on my T6 wristop computer.
Downloaded the data to my PC into Suunto Training Manager.
Then used Paintshop Pro screen capture.

[Bob S.]

How did you get the graph?

I wore a Suunto HR belt and captured the data on my T6 wristop computer.
Downloaded the data to my PC into Suunto Training Manager.
Then used Paintshop Pro screen capture.

Citroen,

Thank you very much. I had thought that you were probably using a Suunto. I have been considering getting one, since I am not satisfied with the results from my Polar and the Polar/PM3 combo. But I wasn't really sure what a Suunto could do until I saw your graph. Their website is not very informative.

thanks again,

Bob S.

[Citroen]

I had thought that you were probably using a Suunto. I have been considering getting one, since I am not satisfied with the results from my Polar and the Polar/PM3 combo. But I wasn't really sure what a Suunto could do until I saw your graph.

Their software is quite good (except it's windows only). I've, also, got a BikePOD (spoke magnet/sensor) so I get speed on my T6. The T6 does altitude on the watch (it's barometric you have to calibrate it to a known height above sealevel every time before you start - either with the TAF/METAR from my nearest airfield or I set it to 111m based on my GPS receiver at home). I'm getting some interesting data from my cycling.

The Suunto HR belt is compatible with PM4, although the PM4 doesn't do anything useful with the HR data (then again it never did anything useful with the Polar data).

The Suunto Training manager makes it easy to compare one session with another. I can take all my rides into the gym (same route every day) and directly compare them. I can compare a rowing session from last month with the same one from today.

[john_n]

That's a good idea, hjs. Or perhaps I could try just sitting there and flexing my calf muscles a bit. I don't know if that would assist circulation as much as walking.

Nice graph, Citroen. Interesting that on all but one or 2 of the interval sprints shown on the graph, that the heart rate increased. Wonder why it didn't increase from the 3rd to 4th. Looks like it was just nearly maxed out in the 6th, 7th and 8th intervals, but the peaks seem to be still trending up slightly in those last 3.

The highest I've seen my HR this year has been 191, but it didn't get much higher than the 170's during the 10 intervals on the C2CTC sprints, either.

I row for my health, both mental and physical. I participate in nonathlon.com and c2ctc.com for the sake of their incentives to row.

[Citroen]

Interesting that on all but one or 2 of the interval sprints shown on the graph, that the heart rate increased. Wonder why it didn't increase from the 3rd to 4th. Looks like it was just nearly maxed out in the 6th, 7th and 8th intervals, but the peaks seem to be still trending up slightly in those last 3.

I was no where near my max. I'm 43, but I've had 191HR in a 3K race.
Here's the splits for that session. Slightly off the pace on the third interval.

0:49.1 250 38 1:38.2
0:48.6 250 35 1:37.2
0:47.9 250 35 1:35.8
0:48.7 250 36 1:37.4
0:48.6 250 36 1:37.2
0:48.5 250 37 1:37.0
0:48.7 250 37 1:37.4
0:48.8 250 39 1:37.6

[john_n]

Your pace was very constant even after the third, faster interval. Interesting.

Well, I'm 60 and have no idea what my maximum hr is, but it must be somewhere above 191 because I wasn't huffing and puffing the day it went up that high.

Something curious I read somewhere about maximum hr - that it has no particular bearing on how well a person can perform in any activity, but even more curious (in the same article) the writer said that for anyone who is sedentary, their maximum hr declines by about 1 beat per minute per year of life that they are sedentary but that for every year that anyone is regularly and significantly active in something such as running, biking, rowing etc, their maximum heart rate does not decline.

[johnlvs2run]

Increased stroke volume is another thing that can cause your maximum HR to decline.

Cardiac output = HR x SV. As your heart gets stronger to pump a greater stroke volume, it doesn't need to beat as quickly to accomplish the same perfusion as before. Also the heart then functions differently, pumping more blood volume per beat, rather than beating more times in attempting to accomplish the same.

Even so, the MHR of top athletes varies greatly. World class runner Anne Audain had a MHR of 159, whereas others are close to 200. Generally though, highly trained athletes will have lower MHR's than untrained sedentary people. The latter's decline with age results from clogged arteries and poor functioning, as opposed to a training effect.