What do you think of the LW / HW grouping?

[trailrunner]

Would it make more sense if there were more weight groups on the indoor erg? Or perhaps divide power (watts) by body weight?

It seems kind of coarse to split it with one set up to 165 lbs and then everything above that? I pity the really fit 170 pounder that has to compete with the really fit 200 pounder. It's the big engine vs not so big engine.

In things like running, it kinda gets evened out cause you gotta carry that big engine up hills and support it all the time.

Am I missing something?

[RowtheRockies]

Trailrunner,

I think the problem is that at some venues, there would be very few people in a weight class if they added more. Selfishly, I would love it if they created a Middleweight category since I am 6' 1", 172 and my Tanita scale consistently reads 8.1 - 8.5% Body Fat. If I was to really try to shed 7 pounds to get to LW, I am afraid I would lose muscle.

I would also be selfishly happy if they would raise the split between HW/LW to 180!

Rich

[RowtheRockies]

Trailrunner,

Some local road and trail races around here have a clydesdale category that is 185+ for men. A few years back, I found myself coming through the holiday's tipping about 182. I decided to stuff myself for the next few weeks before a winter four race trail running series and got to about 186. I ended up winning the clydesdale award with a gap to second place of 26 minutes and also placed 3rd in my age group outside of the clydesdale group. I had to work like hell to keep myself above 185. Trying ro make weight by gaining is a lot more fun than trying to lose weight!!

Rich

[Widgeon]

I would rather see height catagories added for both light and heavy weight. The tall people with their long stroke have a decided advantage over those of us who are vertically challenged!

Pam

[johnlvs2run]

Would it make more sense if there were more weight groups on the indoor erg?

Yes.

Or perhaps divide power (watts) by body weight?

Definitely.

[hjs]

Would it make more sense if there were more weight groups on the indoor erg? Or perhaps divide power (watts) by body weight?

It seems kind of course to split it with one set up to 165 lbs and then everything above that? I pity the really fit 170 pounder that has to compete with the really fit 200 pounder. It's the big engine vs not so big engine.

In things like running, it kinda gets evened out cause you gotta carry that big engine up hills and support it all the time.

Am I missing something?

No groups at all would be the most logic thing. We don,t have heightdivisions in highjumping of weightdivisions in marathonrunning or feetsize divisions for swimmers. Sports is al about the differances.

[igoeja]

Although world-class competitions usually have no weight divisions, for the erg competitions, and even for high school and collegiate competition, removal of classes would would be de-motivating and the sport could lose many adherents. Essentially, victory would go to the biggest, and if removal of age classes were included, the youngest (actually mid-twentiesh).

For the less than world class competitors, age and weight competitions make it worthwhile for people to compete and excel. Removal of classes would only make more people feel like also-rans.

[p-fitz]

Removal of classes would only make more people feel like also-rans.

Which is exactly what they are. Protecting people's "feelings" should not be what rowing is about.

[igoeja]

At the highest competitive levels, the national and international levels, the idea of single classes is fine. In fact, at such levels of performance, the lack of age and weight classes already exist, but most people are not about competition.

Promotion of rowing, either for supporters or as a health initiative, would require making it less intimidating for all the also-rans. Most people find it fair, when comparing performances, to use an equivalent reference group, so the issue is one of comparison to one's peers, not to an absolute standard.

You can serve more than one aim, using single classes at the highest levels, and multiple classes for everyone else. If your purpose were to make rowing more exclusive, a single class would work wonders, and likely diminish interest in the majority of non-competitive rowers.

[arakawa]

Removal of classes would only make more people feel like also-rans.

Which is exactly what they are. Protecting people's "feelings" should not be what rowing is about.

How do you feel about classes based on gender lines or weight classes in boxing and wrestling?

[igoeja]

Rowing can have more than one purpose. There is a range of attitudes toward, and purposes of, rowing. Obviously, there is a competitive element, but the reasons people row are varied:

- health
- pleasure
- fitness
- camaraderie
- well-being / stress reduction

The Concept II company - I do not speak for it and am in no way associated with it - would probably promote all the above, since its revenue is enhanced by a large and motivated base.

As for myself, I have no illusions about my abilities, but I enjoy increasing my rankings in my competitive class, and if I couldn't use the rankings to gauge my performance, I would certainly be less motivated toward rowing.

[johnlvs2run]

Which is exactly what they are. Protecting people's "feelings" should not be what rowing is about.

Then why is consideration of weight not included.

Weight is considered in all other sports, for example rowing on the water, running, high jumping, boxing, weight lifting, and also on the rowperfect. The c2 is the only place I know of that doesn't consider the weight of the person, and gives (a time/pace) advantage for weighing more with less fitness.

For purposes of ego or whatever this doesn't matter, as people are welcome to think as they wish right or wrong. But for purposes of health and fitness, then it is a good idea to include weight in the equations for calculation of performances.

[trailrunner]

In addition to a being a wonderful, low impact, motion dynamic (I just made that up) exersize machine , the erg is one of the better fitness measuring tools. Certainly not as clinical as the VO2 max test administered on the treadmill or stationary bike. Because here there is an element of technique and strategy.

We are talking specific power measurement for events of various durations. You need to take into account weight, in the same way engine output is expressed in hp/cubic inch.

I did not mean to cry sour grapes when I started this thread. I accept the limitations of being 5'6" and middle age. My only intention was to question the wisdom of two classes.

In the mean time, happy rowing!

[p-fitz]

Weight is considered in all other sports,

Of course its not. How is weight considered in basketball, baseball, hockey, swimming, running, figure skating, squash, ballroom dancing, tiddlywinks, etc. etc. Weight is considered in only a small minority of sports like collegiate rowing, wrestling, and boxing.

for example rowing on the water, running, high jumping, boxing, weight lifting, and also on the rowperfect.

I didn't realize that competitors had to weigh in before the high jump.

The c2 is the only place I know of that doesn't consider the weight of the person, and gives (a time/pace) advantage for weighing more with less fitness.

Nonsense. The C2 doesn't care what you weigh, only how hard you pull. Why don't you stop training and start eating more? According to you, that's the best way to inprove your erg score.

Next time I do a 2k I'll be sure to wear a 50 lbs. backpack. Then by John Rupp's logic, I'll have an advantage.

[Ducatista]

I would rather see height catagories added for both light and heavy weight. The tall people with their long stroke have a decided advantage over those of us who are vertically challenged!

Pam

You win some, you lose some. I'm 5'11". Imagine me busting out a floor routine at a gymnastics meet. Heh, I made myself snort just thinking about it.

- Ann