Weight Training and Rowing

[stroke_1t]

I'm currently about 155pounds/70kilos, 5'10-11 and I pull a 6:46.0 2k. I am going to be racing heavyweight from now on and i want to get my time into the low 6:30s. I know thats going to take a lot of training and I have decided i should gain some muscle/weight over the summer so i've got some more raw power to work with. I havn't done any serious weight training before now and I'm looking for rower's takes on whats good to do. I want to know what specific exercises/workouts/workout schedules are going to work the best for gaining muscle thats going to help with my rowing. Also any nutritional information I should take into account, I've got no idea but all the serious workout guys that are huge i see talk about protine this and that, any of that stuff gonna do anything for me? If you can give me any info that you've got or point me in a good direction that be great.

thanks!

[johnlvs2run]

The first thing since you're going to be rowing heavyweight is to get up to 6' 7 or so, then gain a lot of weight to go along with your height.

[stroke_1t]

hahahaha helpfull. I'm working on the human growth hormone from mexico but until then...

[RowtheRockies]

stroke_1t. 6:46 as a LW is a very good time. Puts you just under the 90th percentile. Are you wanting to put on size for reasons other than rowing? Do you row on the water? The reason I ask is that getting down to the low 6:30's as a HW will be roughly equivalent to 6:46 as a LW. You are already 10lbs below HW, why not just try to put on 10 good lbs of muscle and look to better your time/standing as a LW? Like I said, don't know if your motivation to put on muscle is strictly for rowing reasons or what.

As far as lifting goes: In my humble opinion, complex lifts (involving multiple muscles and joints in the movement) are best for gaining overall practical strength. Instead of doing barbell or dumbell curls, do weighted chin ups (uses biceps as well as lats and other minor muscle groups as opposed to just concentrating on the bicep). Bench Press instead of cable crossovers or fly's. Any exercise that just isolates one muscle group is really only useful for body builders who are trying to achieve a certain look.

Ultimately for strength that translates to erging performance and functional strength, the best would be olympic lifts like,Clean and Jerk, Deadlift, etc. although these lifts carry a much higher chance of injury and should not be attempted without someone teaching you the perfect form.



Rich

[stroke_1t]

Yea i row on the water. I row sweep for club/school teams and am starting to scull, probably row a double or quad over the summer with some guys. I'm interested in on water rowing first, ergs are important though. I think that 165 is a reasonable weight and I would be quite happy to be 165 all muscle for next fall. The reason i say i am 'giving up on being a LW' is that on water Lights are 150 pounds at HS level. But in answer i AM concerned with gaining muscle for rowing first, i dont really want any extra useless weight.

Thanks, keep em coming guys...

[jjpisano]

Stroke it:

Aerobic capacity is a treasure that ought to be guarded and nurtured. You have good aerobic capacity as evidenced by your 2k. But if you neglect it, it can be lost.

So we want to get you some muscle while preserving your aerobic capacity. I'd recommend the Wolverine plan. Check it out. The reason is that it combines aerobically stressful workouts while challenging you to develop a powerful stroke, which will put muscle on you.

If you want to do what you are doing plus add strength training, you could use the rowing machine as a strength building machine by doing Heavy 10's type workouts, which are detailed in Dr. Stephen Seiler's articles on the Rowing World website.

In addition, you could combine a Heavy 10's type workout with erg jacking and you got yourself a very effective muscle building exercise, while never touching a weight and while using the rowing stroke. Problem is the loads can be tremendous and, as with any heavy weight activity, injury is a risk.
A good warmup is imperative and easing into this type of workout may be helpful.

Heavy weight workouts require alot of recovery time to get maximum muscle building effects. The recovery time may necessarily decrease the total volume of rowing that you do. The total volume of good, quality rowing will have the most positive effect on your 2k time. That's why doing things like the Wolverine plan are a good idea because your developing a powerful stroke while stressing yourself aerobically.

In the end, in my opinion, combining aerobic work with developing a powerful stroke is definitely preferable to pure strength building workouts as deveoped by weights or Heavy 10's type workouts.

[hjs]

Building muscle will not happen by rowing alone. The wp plan is very high on volume and will never help building muscle.
2/3 times serieus weighttraining, Enough food (including more protein).
Don,t do this on your own, get good help so you don,t harm yourself.
And don,t forget to keep on rowing. That has to be the basic.

[jjpisano]

HJS:

I must disagree. Have you ever seen the author of the Wolverine Plan, Mike Caviston? He is muscle bound and he is definitely aerobically fit.

I put on muscle with a combo of Heavy 10's and erg jacking, but I lost some aerobic ability. I never lifted a weight.

[hjs]

HJS:

I must disagree. Have you ever seen the author of the Wolverine Plan, Mike Caviston? He is muscle bound and he is definitely aerobically fit.

I put on muscle with a combo of Heavy 10's and erg jacking, but I lost some aerobic ability. I never lifted a weight.

I never seen in him in persone but he is a lightweight and not a short man. So he can be muscle bound in your eyes, he is not is not in mine. he is very fit offcause the man rows 200k a week. He rows a lifetime and does very well indeed but his trainingmethod is not the way to build a larger body.
If stroke 1t wants to become a heavyweight he has to build that and really focus on that, it can be done but not bye rowing alone.

[hjs]

HJS:

I put on muscle with a combo of Heavy 10's and erg jacking, but I lost some aerobic ability. I never lifted a weight.

heavy 10 are very risky, I wouldn,t advice it to anyone.

[arakawa]

HJS:

I must disagree. Have you ever seen the author of the Wolverine Plan, Mike Caviston? He is muscle bound and he is definitely aerobically fit.

I put on muscle with a combo of Heavy 10's and erg jacking, but I lost some aerobic ability. I never lifted a weight.

I agree with jjpisano. I've met Mike Caviston, and am amazed that a man his height (I'd guess around 5' 10") could be that muscular and broad-shouldered and yet still be a lightweight.

Also, with respect to gaining weight / putting on muscle and rowing as a heavyweight, you have to ask yourself - are you trying to get bigger because you want pull a faster 2K, or are you trying to get bigger because you want to get bigger? If you want to get bigger, then let's be honest with ourselves - stop erging and hit the weight room.

Higher body weight, even in the form of bigger and stronger muscles, is not correlated to a better 2K erg performance. I am 5' 11", and used to weigh 185 lbs. At that weight, I had a max bench press of 285 lbs, while my 2K time was nearly eight minutes. Now, I'm a lightweight, and my best 2K is 7:09. Not only that, while my weight was going down and I stopped lifting weights, my performance at shorter distances improved - my 500 m time dropped from 1:39 to 1:32.

[hjs]

Higher body weight, even in the form of bigger and stronger muscles, is not correlated to a better 2K erg performance. I am 5' 11", and used to weigh 185 lbs. At that weight, I had a max bench press of 285 lbs, while my 2K time was nearly eight minutes. Now, I'm a lightweight, and my best 2K is 7:09. Not only that, while my weight was going down and I stopped lifting weights, my performance at shorter distances improved - my 500 m time dropped from 1:39 to 1:32.

Did you row seriously in the time you were 285? I think not. Now you focus on rowing. Offcause you times get better.

About mike, If he wouldn,t need to be a lightweight he would be faster.
It is not the one or the other it is has to both.
Rowing is an power endurance sport. The best athlete's need to be strong and aerobicly fit. Don,t come around with stories about being strong and pulling bad times when the cause for that is obviously lack of endurance.

[michaelb]

Putting on even 10lbs of muscle in HS can take a lot of work, even if you lift seriously (I got a lot stronger, but I am not sure I gained that 10lbs until college). As others have said, staying as a lightweight for college would also make sense, so I would skip any effort to "gain weight" with protein drinks etc, and focus on getting stronger by weightlifting.

Although Rich and others here suggest powerlifting, and that may make sense, I wonder if engaging the much weak musles of the arms in those movements compromises how hard you can work your legs and body core. So I am old school on gaining muscle mass: free weights in control and with good technique for 8-12 reps, maybe 1-3 sets.

I would think the foundation of weightlifting for a rower would squats. Squats are controversial, but I still think they are the best way overall to build leg and core body strength. Do leg curls as well to balance out the hamstrings. Not sure how much rowers need to work the upper body actually, but it is fun, looks good, so you might as well do some basics there too: dips, curls, lat pulldowns, military press, dumbell flies, some form of rows, etc (I am not listing the bench press, since I wouldn't want you spending 50% of your time doing bench like everyone else, and I am sure you will do them anyway).

Some incline situps wouldn't hurt, as well as the exercise that I can't think of the name: you lie face down over a pad and hook your knees under a bar and do a reverse situp.

[stroke_1t]

Thanks for the suggestions. I'm looking to get stronger while at least maintaining or remaining close my current level of aerobic fitness. I figure if i can get more strength and keep my current aerobic ability/improve it, times pretty much have to go down a lot more than if i concentrate on improving aerobic alone. I dont care about being a huge guy, just a fast rower.

My legs are definetly in the best relative shape strength wise, I think i've kindof ignored my arms. How important are they as far as stroke power? Will building a lot more arm muscle give me as much result as building a lot more leg muscle? I've never thought much about my arms but i guess that the small difference they could make would end up a big difference on a 2k, couple of seconds average split turns into a huge difference.

[hjs]

Thanks for the suggestions. I'm looking to get stronger while at least maintaining or remaining close my current level of aerobic fitness. I figure if i can get more strength and keep my current aerobic ability/improve it, times pretty much have to go down a lot more than if i concentrate on improving aerobic alone. I dont care about being a huge guy, just a fast rower.

My legs are definetly in the best relative shape strength wise, I think i've kindof ignored my arms. How important are they as far as stroke power? Will building a lot more arm muscle give me as much result as building a lot more leg muscle? I've never thought much about my arms but i guess that the small difference they could make would end up a big difference on a 2k, couple of seconds average split turns into a huge difference.

Building stronge arms will not do you much good. If you go that way you will be on the wrong track. Do a overall strenght programme and the strenght in you arms will also develope.
Rowers do have strong legs, the legs do a lot of work so do does the back, that is why you shoul also train the other muscle's. To keep balance.