Endurance erging - A place to discuss 42, 50, 100k upwards.

[ericMX73]

I just did my first 100k yesterday. What an amazing feeling.

Great effort!! How did it go? And how you feeling today? I did my first 50k today but seems to pale in comparison to all of you smashing in 100k. Lol

Thanks! It went pretty good. Much better than my first FM back in January where the pain was increasing exponentially in the last 45 min. It sucked so bad. At the time I thought why would any sane person do these long rows, LOL. I learned a lot in January, made some changes and longer rows this year have become much more tolerable. I'm pretty addicted to them now. I did my first 50k back in September, kept the HR down low and slow. That was a good trial run and stepping stone to the 100k. Yesterday, starting out on the journey, I knew going past 50k would be uncharted territory. if I could make it to 70k without any major surprises, that would be a promising sign. Heart rate was my main focus and I kept it as low as possible while trying to maintain my window of 8hrs completion time. I visualized the 100km spread out into an 8 hour work day. Once I reached 70k I knew I could slowly click off 10k at a time to finish the 100k. The aches and pains were only increasing minimally and very gradual and linear. In the later half of the row, I had to stop periodically to stretch out my legs and lower back. This stretching really helped me both physically and mentally. It was reassuring and a huge boost to know I could greatly subdue the muscle tightness with periodic stretching. Mainly the muscles on the back of my legs were super tight last night and this morning, but 24hrs later it's not bad at all.

[ericMX73]

I just did my first 100k yesterday. What an amazing feeling.

Massive congratulations, but I'm not sure I'd ever describe my experience as amazing

Maybe I need to have another go?

Thanks! It was amazing because I had no idea that I was capable of rowing for so long.

[ericMX73]

How much of y'alls training is anything sprint related? I'm finding myself gravitating towards long distance more because I really don't like doing interval work. Much easier mentally for me to do a 75 minute UT2 workout than a 15 minute AT workout, go figure.

No sprints for me this year. I’ve really enjoyed a steady diet of longer 1 to 2 and 3 hour UT2 rows this season. That’s been my main focus. It’s given me a solid foundation and confidence to embark on the journey to 100km. I’m so grateful to Concept2 for having all these endurance row challenges. It’s an amazing feeling to conquer them for the first time.

[GlennUk]

Yesterday, I became the first woman to row an individual century in less than 7 hours.

ROW:
https://log.concept2.com/profile/1558013/log/82043761

For anyone to complete in less than 7 hours is a major event, to be the first women to do so is a major milestone not just for you, but all women, and our sport generally. Congrats.

Re the seams, i feel your pain, PITA can be a real PITA when it happens.

Interesting that you found eating tough, i found drinking as much as the guidance suggested a real problem for me, but not so much eating, other than finding out bananas is about the best thing (for me at least).

Congrats once again

[RWAGR]

Just checking in. About 2 months out from my 100k attempt. Training going well. Today was my first "long" piece- 30k in 6x5k at r20 on 2' rest (most have been 18-24k so far). All went well. Felt strong throughout and no issues. Tried tailwind powder in my drink (thanks Stu) and drank every 5k during the rest. After 20k I also had a energy gel (Honey Stinger- which tasted great to me as I love honey). Obviously this pace is faster than I'd sustain a 100k, but it's good I was comfortable enough. No other physical issues to report.

2:01:11.1 30,000m 2:01.1 197 976 20
20:13.0 5,000m 2:01.3 196 974 20
20:14.2 5,000m 2:01.4 196 972 20
20:14.3 5,000m 2:01.4 195 972 20
20:11.1 5,000m 2:01.1 197 978 20
20:11.3 5,000m 2:01.1 197 977 20
20:07.2 5,000m 2:00.7 199 984 20

[alex9026]

Just checking in. About 2 months out from my 100k attempt. Training going well. Today was my first "long" piece- 30k in 6x5k at r20 on 2' rest (most have been 18-24k so far). All went well. Felt strong throughout and no issues. Tried tailwind powder in my drink (thanks Stu) and drank every 5k during the rest. After 20k I also had a energy gel (Honey Stinger- which tasted great to me as I love honey). Obviously this pace is faster than I'd sustain a 100k, but it's good I was comfortable enough. No other physical issues to report.

2:01:11.1 30,000m 2:01.1 197 976 20
20:13.0 5,000m 2:01.3 196 974 20
20:14.2 5,000m 2:01.4 196 972 20
20:14.3 5,000m 2:01.4 195 972 20
20:11.1 5,000m 2:01.1 197 978 20
20:11.3 5,000m 2:01.1 197 977 20
20:07.2 5,000m 2:00.7 199 984 20

Looking at your 2023 times, you're going in to it with a solid foundation, how are you finding the longer pieces? How long a build up are you taking in to the 100k attempt?
Never tried honey stinger gels, but really enjoyed (as much as you can enjoy food during exercise) their thin jersey pocket sized waffles on long bike rides.

[Dangerscouse]

Obviously this pace is faster than I'd sustain a 100k, but it's good I was comfortable enough. No other physical issues to report.

That's a good strategy as you need to almost make your 100k pace seem too slow. Although it does need careful attention as that can slip into then going too fast, too soon when hubris starts to dictate the pace.

[RWAGR]

Looking at your 2023 times, you're going in to it with a solid foundation, how are you finding the longer pieces? How long a build up are you taking in to the 100k attempt?

Longer pieces all good so far - but of course haven’t done anything that long yet so time will tell! Planning to row the 100k in about 2 months from now (on or around 9th March).

Stu- agreed on pacing!

[olliepoole]

Hello all

I've been indoor rowing a while, and I'm planning to attempt a 100k effort in 2 months (March). Looking for some thoughts/advice etc from any of you who've done it. I'm 185cm, 92KG, 34 year old male.

I've done a FM in 2:57 and did a 50K recently in 3:51. I've been putting in high volumes weekends (40-50k total) and trying to do what I can during the week but work prevents a lot of rowing for a variety of reasons. Been focusing on staying in a Zone 2-3 HR zone which for me is around 145-155.

I'm most interested in perspectives on nutrition. Here are my back of the envelope thoughts, please feel free to critique at will. I'd rather find out now that my plan is insane than 75km in.

At my size and anticipated pace (around 2:15-2:20/500m = about 8hrs), I'm planning on consuming:

Calories: 250-300cal/hr
- probably will burn about 6000-8000 cals. I'm thinking I'll need to consume about 1/3 of these during, the other 2/3 coming from fat and glycogen. So I'm planning on consuming about 2500cals total (300cal/hr)
Water: 500mL/hr
- I sweat a reasonable amount, but with a fan and Zone 2-3 I should sweat less than normal. I'm anticipating losing about 500-700mL of fluid an hour. So I'll plan to replace most of this.
Sodium: 500-700mg/hr
Potassium: 300-400mg/hr

My plan was to drink a Tailwind mix (for no specific reason other than seeing other have success with it):

5 scoops of Tailwind in 1000mL of water. I'll need 4 of these total.

I'll drink 1000mL every 2 ours. Each bottle will have:

500 cals
1550mg Na+
450mg K+
60mg Mag
135 Calcium
175mg Caffeine
1000mL water

Will probably eat some Haribo but no plans for other solids.

Any thoughts on this?

I have some concern about the amount of caffeine. Maybe also a little light on K+ but can probably make that up with some coconut water or something.

Thank you

[Dangerscouse]

Hello all

I've been indoor rowing a while, and I'm planning to attempt a 100k effort in 2 months (March). Looking for some thoughts/advice etc from any of you who've done it. I'm 185cm, 92KG, 34 year old male.

I've done a FM in 2:57 and did a 50K recently in 3:51. I've been putting in high volumes weekends (40-50k total) and trying to do what I can during the week but work prevents a lot of rowing for a variety of reasons. Been focusing on staying in a Zone 2-3 HR zone which for me is around 145-155.

I'm most interested in perspectives on nutrition. Here are my back of the envelope thoughts, please feel free to critique at will. I'd rather find out now that my plan is insane than 75km in.

At my size and anticipated pace (around 2:15-2:20/500m = about 8hrs), I'm planning on consuming:

Calories: 250-300cal/hr
- probably will burn about 6000-8000 cals. I'm thinking I'll need to consume about 1/3 of these during, the other 2/3 coming from fat and glycogen. So I'm planning on consuming about 2500cals total (300cal/hr)
Water: 500mL/hr
- I sweat a reasonable amount, but with a fan and Zone 2-3 I should sweat less than normal. I'm anticipating losing about 500-700mL of fluid an hour. So I'll plan to replace most of this.
Sodium: 500-700mg/hr
Potassium: 300-400mg/hr

My plan was to drink a Tailwind mix (for no specific reason other than seeing other have success with it):

5 scoops of Tailwind in 1000mL of water. I'll need 4 of these total.

I'll drink 1000mL every 2 ours. Each bottle will have:

500 cals
1550mg Na+
450mg K+
60mg Mag
135 Calcium
175mg Caffeine
1000mL water

Will probably eat some Haribo but no plans for other solids.

Any thoughts on this?

I have some concern about the amount of caffeine. Maybe also a little light on K+ but can probably make that up with some coconut water or something.

Thank you

Welcome to the forum Ollie.

I think the Tailwind option is good, but I'd also recommend a litre of plain water, and a protein shake, before and during.

Have you tried Haribos during the 50k? Definitely make sure you've tried anything that you're proposing to have before the 100k, including the protein shake as this may cause issues; unlikely but everyone is different. I found it was tough to eat anything like Haribos with a really long distance, albeit it was jelly beans I used to eat. Marshmallows and banana are great options, not least for the potassium and I also liked to have salted cashews.

I'd also recommend a bowl of oats / porridge as a breakfast with fruit and nuts & seeds.

I have mixed reactions to caffeine. I respond to caffeine in coffee, but I don't seem to benefit in the same way with tablets or powder. I also didn't notice any benefits from it when I was starting to really struggle. Your response to caffeine may be different, so it's worth experimenting.

As a great alternative, I'd suggest 50/50 diluted fruit juice, with a big pinch of salt and teaspoon of sugar (glucose is a quicker energy response to fructose). I like OJ, but I preferred Apple and Mango fruit juice as it just felt more palatable to me.

Best of luck. Ime, it gets very dark from 80k onwards. Close enough to be almost done, but also no way near close enough to be done

[olliepoole]

Thanks for your thoughts, much appreciated.

I have tried the Haribo during the 50K. They werent an issue. They're something I occasionally eat not on a rowing machine so hoped that would increase the chance I tolerate them - so far so good but 100K is uncharted for me.

The solid breakfast in the morning is a great suggestion, i'm not a breakfast person but will have to be that day.

I'm planning to do another 50K between now and when I try it, just test out the Tailwind, and trial a few other issues that have come up on longer rows:

I got some different socks as I was starting to get a heel blister during the 50K which I really wasn't expecting. I also changed my foot position to 5/6 to try and create some space and take strain off my low back and hams. It worked but my left ankle flared up: probably from the extra flexion it isn't used to in my stroke. So I've been working on some ankle flexibility. I think offloading the low back and hams as long as possible will pay off.

When I finished the 50K, I honestly felt pretty mangled. I had lots of reasons to not be top form that day (3 hours sleep on a couch night before, baby waking up multiple times, blah blah), but did not feel ready to do another 50. I'm hoping there is a mental aspect to it, in that the last 5k of any long row will hurt, because it's the last 5k and you're almost there. During the 100k I'm hoping to not notice too much when I'm getting to 50k and still be feeling OK. Is that wishful thinking? Or am I going to be in a dark dark place for 50km?

Im not planning on a seat cushion or gloves. Hasn't been an issue so far. Is that foolish?

I read your post on the 100k from elsewhere in the forum it was very helpful so thanks for that. The 100km Concept 2 row community isn't massive, which I guess isn't a huge surprise, but it was helpful to have some thoughts from someone who's been there.

Cheers.

OP

[Dangerscouse]

Thanks for your thoughts, much appreciated.

I have tried the Haribo during the 50K. They werent an issue. They're something I occasionally eat not on a rowing machine so hoped that would increase the chance I tolerate them - so far so good but 100K is uncharted for me.

The solid breakfast in the morning is a great suggestion, i'm not a breakfast person but will have to be that day.

I'm planning to do another 50K between now and when I try it, just test out the Tailwind, and trial a few other issues that have come up on longer rows:

I got some different socks as I was starting to get a heel blister during the 50K which I really wasn't expecting. I also changed my foot position to 5/6 to try and create some space and take strain off my low back and hams. It worked but my left ankle flared up: probably from the extra flexion it isn't used to in my stroke. So I've been working on some ankle flexibility. I think offloading the low back and hams as long as possible will pay off.

When I finished the 50K, I honestly felt pretty mangled. I had lots of reasons to not be top form that day (3 hours sleep on a couch night before, baby waking up multiple times, blah blah), but did not feel ready to do another 50. I'm hoping there is a mental aspect to it, in that the last 5k of any long row will hurt, because it's the last 5k and you're almost there. During the 100k I'm hoping to not notice too much when I'm getting to 50k and still be feeling OK. Is that wishful thinking? Or am I going to be in a dark dark place for 50km?

Im not planning on a seat cushion or gloves. Hasn't been an issue so far. Is that foolish?

I read your post on the 100k from elsewhere in the forum it was very helpful so thanks for that. The 100km Concept 2 row community isn't massive, which I guess isn't a huge surprise, but it was helpful to have some thoughts from someone who's been there.

Cheers.

OP

BBC News - Courtney Dauwalter: Step inside the 'pain cave', where rules are remade
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/athletics/67945344

I love this article as she provides some excellent advice on what to do when the inevitable darkness descends.

As you've done 50k with Haribos, that's more than enough to test them out. I got stomach cramps after about an hour with energy drinks that didn't agree with me.

I like to wear cushioned running socks, but getting shoes that are a snug fit (maybe a size or half a size smaller than usual) might be a good option. Or maybe just wear two pairs of socks?

Your prep for the 50k will definitely have affected you, do with a better sleep etc, you'll feel better. Now you've done 50kn, you will also feel better just because you know, at least slightly what to expect, and if it feels better, which it probably will do, it can be a big confidence boost.

Ime, 50k is a double edged sword. You're halfway, but you're still 50k from finishing, so it's very short lived. The mental fortitude you need from then on is invaluable and will be what pulls you through the darkest moments. They come in waves, so don't convince yourself it will always be that bad, or it will get worse. It might plateau and it will recede, unless you've totally cooked yourself and it's not possible to continue. The second 50k is where you need to focus on the pain cave advice in the article. Remember why you started and focus on how good you'll feel when it's done.

I don't ever use gloves. I've got callouses, and occasionally painful blisters but it's manageable, for me anyway. If you can manage 50k without a seat cushion, you should be fine for the 100k. I don't use one, and I had no issues when I got to 82k in my last failed 100k attempt.

Finally, I'd firmly recommend that you focus on your goal and adapt your training to suit it. I've always got carried away with other PBs in the build up, which have been hugely detrimental as I've let my ego dictate the decisions rsther than focusing on recovery

[Dangerscouse]

A few other things I've noted recently that might be worth a mention.

I find for a long row, the inside of my upper arms can become chafed due to them slightly rubbing on my knees. A bit of vaseline on the knees and inner arms works a treat.

Consider your breathing often. Ime, it becomes shallower as you progress. Not notably shallower, but enough to make a difference and the occasional deep breath really helps reset it. I probably do it once every few minutes, as there's no downside to it.

I also like to shrug my shoulders a couple of times every now and again. You can quite easily carry a lot of tension, which serves no purpose and will just leak energy.

@Ollie, you may not have seen this on previous posts but I'm a big advocate of rowing with eyes closed. Just zoning out and really understanding the stroke is a great tool imo. It can also help as I deliberately undercount the amount of metres rowed just to make it seem more manageable. Focusing all the time on the monitor is detrimental ime as it all too easily becomes overwhelming.

I'd also say, you may, or may not have seen the difference between my 50k PB and 100k PB. This isn't any indication of what to expect as there's a significant back story to this that really derailed my 100k.

[ShortAndStout]

What sort of stuff do you guys and gals do for the hard workouts? I know some here do solely UT2 with a lot of time behind it, others do a mix of long form SS and something sharper, just wondering how sharp on average. Especially for extreme endurance. We talking 8x500 500W intervals or like AT work at the max?

[btlifter]

What sort of stuff do you guys and gals do for the hard workouts? I know some here do solely UT2 with a lot of time behind it, others do a mix of long form SS and something sharper, just wondering how sharp on average. Especially for extreme endurance. We talking 8x500 500W intervals or like AT work at the max?

Even a 100k is largely a test of aerobic fitness. So, mixing in plenty of threshold work and some Vo2 is likely one's best bet. Not substantively different from middle distance training.