Strapless Or Strapped?

[[old] lightfoot]

Hello-<br /><br />I'm new to rowing and this is only my 2nd posting, so please bear with me.<br /><br />I'm assuming rowing "strapless" refers to strapping your feet down. My question is what's the effect of no straps. More efficient use of legs?<br /><br />- lightfoot

[[old] hjs]

<!--QuoteBegin-lightfoot+Feb 6 2006, 03:59 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(lightfoot @ Feb 6 2006, 03:59 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Hello-<br /><br />I'm new to rowing and this is only my 2nd posting, so please bear with me.<br /><br />I'm assuming rowing "strapless" refers to strapping your feet down.  My question is what's the effect of no straps.  More efficient  use of legs?<br /><br />- lightfoot <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />The main function off strapless rowing is the slowdown off the rate it will give. This way you have to push harder with your legs if you want to maintain enough speed. After a while you don,t need strapless anymore. Just try with and without straps. And try to hold your splits/500 the same.

[[old] PaulS]

<!--QuoteBegin-lightfoot+Feb 6 2006, 06:59 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(lightfoot @ Feb 6 2006, 06:59 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Hello-<br /><br />I'm new to rowing and this is only my 2nd posting, so please bear with me.<br /><br />I'm assuming rowing "strapless" refers to strapping your feet down.  My question is what's the effect of no straps.  More efficient  use of legs?<br /><br />- lightfoot <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />For being new, you have made an excellent assumption, and a quite good conclusion.<br /><br />Strapless training helps to improve efficiency in all areas of the stroke, and forces the development of skills that can remain unexercised if the straps become a requirement.<br /><br />Strapless training, while it does not ensure that you will do everything correctly, does a lot to help avoid some very common mistakes. The important thing to consider is that the goal is to develop a proper rowing stroke while strapless, and this is where we generally need some form of external feedback from a coach to get the basics correct from the beginning.<br /><br />As an example: 3 years ago I had a person, that had never sat in a boat before, start in my "learn to row" class. They learned all the basics without straps on the Erg, progressed to the boat, and eventually into rowing with the more "advanced" classes where they won a gold medal in their first race. She then became pregnant, and has spent the last two years being a mom for the most part, but still using the Erg on occassion. Last month, she showed up for my fitness class, and since she has never used straps on the Erg, sat down and began warming up with everyone else quite naturally and correctly executing technique that she had learned 3 years ago.<br />All her erging done on her own was done strapless and I'd attribute the maintenance of good technique, without additional coach monitoring, largely to that.<br />

[[old] hjs]

paul,<br /><br />all you mention is true but you forget to mention that rowing fast shorter burts only can be done effectively with strapps, not without.

[[old] PaulS]

<!--QuoteBegin-hjs+Feb 6 2006, 07:46 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(hjs @ Feb 6 2006, 07:46 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->paul,<br /><br />all you mention is true but you forget to mention that rowing fast shorter burts only can be done effectively with strapps, not without. <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />How short and fast did you have in mind?

[[old] Xeno]

Strapless rowing is good for posture and using the heel as the main connection throughout the stroke cycle. Of course at the catch, beginning of stroke, most rowers usually have their pressure on the ball of their feet.<br />XENO

[[old] hjs]

<!--QuoteBegin-PaulS+Feb 6 2006, 05:13 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(PaulS @ Feb 6 2006, 05:13 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin-hjs+Feb 6 2006, 07:46 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(hjs @ Feb 6 2006, 07:46 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->paul,<br /><br />all you mention is true but you forget to mention that rowing fast shorter burts only can be done effectively with strapps, not without. <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />How short and fast did you have in mind? <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br /><br />5 k and shorter on full speed. but you now what I mean. On longer distances its possible to reach 95 % or even more off you max but on a 500 meter flat out it will to be mess

[[old] PaulS]

<!--QuoteBegin-hjs+Feb 6 2006, 08:27 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(hjs @ Feb 6 2006, 08:27 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin-PaulS+Feb 6 2006, 05:13 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(PaulS @ Feb 6 2006, 05:13 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin-hjs+Feb 6 2006, 07:46 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(hjs @ Feb 6 2006, 07:46 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->paul,<br /><br />all you mention is true but you forget to mention that rowing fast shorter burts only can be done effectively with strapps, not without. <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />How short and fast did you have in mind? <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br /><br />5 k and shorter on full speed. but you now what I mean. On longer distances its possible to reach 95 % or even more off you max but on a 500 meter flat out it will to be mess <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />I'd always say to strap up for any "max" effort, but mostly just to eliminate the risk of losing the footplate when things get "messy".<br /><br />Perhaps the problem is with how "max" is being measured, which is usually by the Pace on the monitor, which is a calcualted figure that depends a lot on Stroke rate. I have seen no evidence that strapping the feet down allows a person to produce a harder Drive (real work), it only allows a faster recovery which creates the illusion of greater power production through the math involved in displaying a Pace. Anyone with ErgMonitor can see this quite easily.<br /><br />Looking at Pace without considering rate would be like measuring "bench press max" by saying that the guy who does 100kg 2 times in 2 seconds is "better" than the guy who does 190kg 2 times in 4 seconds.<br /><br />That said, if you can learn to bring the rate up when strapless, you can rate even higher when strapped in because of better recovery training.

[[old] hjs]

<!--QuoteBegin-PaulS+Feb 6 2006, 05:50 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(PaulS @ Feb 6 2006, 05:50 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin--><br />I'd always say to strap up for any "max" effort, but mostly just to eliminate the risk of losing the footplate when things get "messy".<br /><br />Perhaps the problem is with how "max" is being measured, which is usually by the Pace on the monitor, which is a calcualted figure that depends a lot on Stroke rate.  I have seen no evidence that strapping the feet down allows a person to produce a harder Drive (real work), it only allows a faster recovery which creates the illusion of greater power production through the math involved in displaying a Pace.  Anyone with ErgMonitor can see this quite easily.<br /><br />Looking at Pace without considering rate would be like measuring "bench press max" by saying that the guy who does 100kg 2 times in 2 seconds is "better" than the guy who does 190kg 2 times in 4 seconds.<br /><br />That said, if you can learn to bring the rate up when strapless, you can rate even higher when strapped in because of better recovery training. <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />Rowing is a repeating movement and benchpress just 1 push. You can't compare the 2.<br /><br />I myself do quit a lot strapless rowing. On a 30 min piece I don,t lose more than 2 sec. on the split. <br />If rowing strapless does help you to up the rate I don,t know?? I personaly do have problems with my rating. I rate 30/31 on a 2 k race. I wish I could rate higher, thats for sure a weak point of mine. <br /><br />I almost never read about ways of training this. It,s all about rating low and it's benefits. And although very nive and true, there is more about rowing than just becoming stronger. <br />Most big guys do a 30 rate 20 piece almost at the same splits as they would do a free rate piece. I don,t think that right. You must be able to get some more power if you up the rate from 20. <br />

[[old] PaulS]

<!--QuoteBegin-hjs+Feb 6 2006, 09:08 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(hjs @ Feb 6 2006, 09:08 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin--><br />Rowing is a repeating movement and benchpress just 1 push. You can't compare the 2.<br /><br />I myself do quit a lot strapless rowing. On a 30 min piece I don,t lose more than 2 sec. on the split. <br />If rowing strapless does help you to up the rate I don,t know?? I personaly do have problems with my rating. I rate 30/31 on a 2 k race. I wish I could rate higher, thats for sure a weak point of mine. <br /><br />I almost never read about ways of training this. It,s all about rating low and it's benefits. And although very nive and true, there is more about rowing than just becoming stronger. <br />Most big guys do a 30 rate 20 piece almost at the same splits as they would do a free rate piece. I don,t think that right. You must be able to get some more power if you up the rate from 20. <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />I'm not sure why this analogy can not be made, each Drive and Recovery are very similar to doing a weightlifting Clean repetition. But it could be a language barrier and your English is far better than my Dutch. <br /><br />During a 30'R20 piece it's likely that the Drive impulse is actually more powerful than during the free-rate 30' piece for distance. It's all a series of trade-off's to arrive at the highest average power output, and in Rowing we are generally "coasting" for longer periods than we are "working". This is why the Watts for Cycling or Stepping can not be compared to what is being done on an Ergo, which is more like using an IsoKinetic weight training machine. The Dyno is a very specific example of this, but since the Ergo is also IsoKinetic the similarities are obvious.

[[old] kinley]

<br />I'm a little confused by the weight lifting analogy too. The guy who lifts 100kg twice in 2 seconds *is* better than the guy who lifts 190kg twice in 4 seconds. <br /><br />Assuming these guys are lifting even splits, guy A will lift 400kg in the time guy B takes to lift 380kg. If the goal is to lift 2000kg in the least time possible, A wins. <br />