1000m breakdown

[Tsnor]

To provide some numbers:
8x500/3:30 @1.42.x
10kr20 sub 40’
5k@26 sub 19’

2khd was an 1.45 attempt.

I’m guessing power endurance at higher ratings is letting me down.
But how to remedy this?

Thanks

2K is 80% aerobic. Only 20% anaerobic. To hit 7 mins, 300 watts, you need roughly 240 watts from your aerobic system. A 40 minute 10K is a 2:00 split, is nearly all aerobic, and is 205 watts. So you are looking for another 30-40 watts aerobic base. 240 watts is a 1:53 split.

How are you training your aerobic system?

Couple of approaches to use for aerobic. I use the approach Elizabeth uses -- lots of long/slow (45 to 100 minute sessions) with at least one and up to three hard session a week. There are other training approaches that work.

How long have you stuck with an approach that includes easy meters? It's a long game approach, but works over time.

Expect gradual gains, maybe 30-50 watts/year at the start, lower gains after the first year until you hit your limit. If you look at training plans for improving cycling FTP and find one you like the same training approach applies to rowing and will give your your aerobic base.

Note, you can train your aerobic system with exercise other than rowing. Running, cycling, elliptical, hard hiking, etc will all build your cardio system. That can take some load off your back and keeps interest up. A bluetooth headset for music or movies or audio books also helps on long rows.

PERSONAL preference. Stop targeting 1:45. Do a 2K at 1:55, should be a solid but not extreme effort. Then slowly crank down the time on future efforts. Train to success, not handle down, by using objectives you can hit with 95%-98% effort, not 100%. Handle down is brutal.

[Jerome]

I recently started with intentionally slowing even further down, with a heart rate in the low 130s. This seems to correspond with a self selected / by feel easy pace for me and should be ballpark 70% mHR.
Not sure however if this is too low, however.

Imo, that can be a good pace BUT you also have to make sure that you're working harder in the shorter sharper sessions. If you go easier than you also must compensate with going harder. It's also important that you find what works best for you as some people thrive off circa 70% whilst others need closer to 80%.

I'm thinking that another big part of your issue is the psychology of erging. If you got to 750m and it still felt easy, but HDed, at 1k, something has probably gone drastically wrong with your mindset. The only time I have had something similar is in a race, and it was massively distorted by adrenaline.

Do you have any coping strategies or did you just let your bad inner chimp (voice) convince you that you needed to HD?

To be fair, it wasn’t a total mental breakdown. More like an evaluation I would not be able to sustain my goal pace/time. So I didn’t see the point of continuing. My purpose was an sub 7, not sub7.10.

The next time I will start slower and work the times downs as suggested.

[Jerome]

PERSONAL preference. Stop targeting 1:45. Do a 2K at 1:55, should be a solid but not extreme effort. Then slowly crank down the time on future efforts. Train to success, not handle down, by using objectives you can hit with 95%-98% effort, not 100%. Handle down is brutal.

That’s solid advice. As Elizabeth suggested, working different rates and paces will probably also be really helpful to get to know the distance, my personal ability, and the corresponding feeling.

[p_b82]

I'll often target 2 times on a piece - one being a "in perfect world on a good day I want to beat X" and the second is "If it's not perfect I want to still beat Y"

In my HM, I had those set at 1 min apart - Yes I felt slightly deflated I'd missed my main aim; but I also had a big improvement as the "not so good" and I knew I'd beat & that kept me going when I really wanted to stop.

I am fan of incremental goals as well - helps keep the motivation wen I beat my current aim, rather than the disappointment of trying to jump too far ahead.
Yes it's slower than some - but I'm not that quick generally nor to I train all that effectively either.

[iain]

Much good advice I won't repeat above. 2 more thoughts on the mental side: Most people feel they may not be able to sustain the pace 40% through most pieces of 1k+, be ready for it! I think of the first half of a piece as mental. It is not just staying controlled that matters, but staying positive. Most of my HD come because I am focussing on "just getting to X" unless I can move the goal on before I get to X then I will HD at X! So I only set interim goals that are close as "celebrations" that I have made that point on schedule.

Re 4 x 1k with long rests, I find each closely matches the 2k mindset for the successive 500s.

1st 1k all about settling into the target pace and coping with the change in energy systems (however hard the warm up we start anaerobically as it takes some time to hit max aerobic production, as a result the oxygen debt build up is initially rapid. If you extrapolate that from say 1:00 to 1:30 into a 2k, I would quickly hit my limit. However the aerobic system will fill much of the gap and so the oxygen debt build up will slow rapidly). As a result I need to be ready for doubts after everything feeling easy, staying positive through that is tough and needs practice so I go through it in my mind ahead of the attempt. Surprised you managed 750 before this hit, but we are all different.

2nd 1k / 500 is about staying focussed in the now and on schedule. The rate at which it is feeling harder is decreasing, but the breathing is feeling more laboured (sometimes feeling almost suffocating) as I hit max aerobic production. This leads to slowing rating to give time for deeper breaths and I need to fight this and keep the rating up or the muscles will give out too early. I find this aspect doesn't continue to get worse, so having survived it before lets me know I can this time, again expecting it and seeing overcoming this "shock" as a key milestone helps me through it.

3rd 1k / 500 "the Dead Zone". This is when the body starts to hurt and get less effective. This is the start of the "Physical" battle. Any deterioration needs to be compensated as allowing a 1S drop below schedule will quickly grow to 2 or 3. I may need to raise the rate or even reduce the length of the slide (as legs are slowing I need to compensate with more work from other areas). Here it is about concentrating on what has been achieved and knowing that I don't want to go through that all again so have to make this one count. I also start to focus on the end as I am nearing it, counting 12 strokes between checking the monitor and revelling in another 100 less of this part to do. Also as somehow except where I have given in, I always finish faster, so no that there is always some reserves that are hidden during this phase.

4th 1k / 500 . Here I have a clear strategy that I have done before for 500s, for the 1k this is for the last 600, but knowing this is the last, I can get through the first 400 by focussing solely on this and taking the last 600 as a fait accompli as I have done it before. Up to you how you address this, but an optimal strategy will have you crossing the line slowing to the pace before it was implemented (ie if you were rowing at 1:46 before starting your end routine at 500 to go, if you can still go faster than 1:46 at the end, you could have started earlier and, as the extra metres are at quicker than 1:46, this would make you quicker). Ending short stroking at high rating thrashing about primarily with torso and arms is the necessary finish!

[Elizabeth]

What pace/intensity guidelines do you use, Elizabeth?

I recently started with intentionally slowing even further down, with a heart rate in the low 130s. This seems to correspond with a self selected / by feel easy pace for me and should be ballpark 70% mHR.
Not sure however if this is too low, however.

Most of my meters are capped at 75% max HR, but 70% works as well and some days I will land there. It's not clear from me from how you described prior training, but this helps to build a base and allow me to hammer down hard on the hard days - both are important in this style of training.

To be fair, it wasn’t a total mental breakdown. More like an evaluation I would not be able to sustain my goal pace/time. So I didn’t see the point of continuing. My purpose was an sub 7, not sub7.10.

The next time I will start slower and work the times downs as suggested.

For the future, there's value in continuing, even if you are not going to hit your goal time. I've had some nasty hard sessions where I have just died at the end, and the feeling of going when your legs and lungs are just shot can be really helpful mentally when you hit that place again and need to dig deep. The last 150m of my last 2k were absolutely brutal, and I spent it counting strokes and thinking of a similar piece I did where I gutted it out.

I'm also a big fan of chipping away over time - setting a goal pace for the first 1500m with a pace that you've hit before, and then seeing how hard you can hammer at the end. Rinse, repeat.

[Dangerscouse]

For the future, there's value in continuing, even if you are not going to hit your goal time. I've had some nasty hard sessions where I have just died at the end, and the feeling of going when your legs and lungs are just shot can be really helpful mentally when you hit that place again and need to dig deep. The last 150m of my last 2k were absolutely brutal, and I spent it counting strokes and thinking of a similar piece I did where I gutted it out.

The one thing I'd also add is that to this is that if I do HD there is always a consequence to it, so it's not a 'free pass'. For example, the next hard session I do it has to be finished, and probably harder than it would have been too. As Vince Lombardi said "once you learn to quit it becomes a habit", something I semi-believe in, as there is a bit more nuance to it than that.

[Jerome]

Re 4 x 1k with long rests, I find each closely matches the 2k mindset for the successive 500s.

Thanks for weighing in, Ian!
To be honest, I’ve been avoiding 4X1k a little.
Though not sure if they have become more attractive after your detailed description
But I’ll put them in the mix more often.

Most of my meters are capped at 75% max HR, but 70% works as well and some days I will land there. It's not clear from me from how you described prior training, but this helps to build a base and allow me to hammer down hard on the hard days - both are important in this style of training.

Elizabeth, at least once week I do a workout that is definitely hard, i.e. speed interval workout. The problem is sustained hard efforts. As I see it, you’ve three variables in interval training : faster, longer, more often. My natural inclination is seeking progression by going faster. But I’m thinking that after reaching a relative speed, longer and or more repeats are becoming more important.

Did the numbers again, and I’m also closer to 75% than 70%. So that’s probably a good thing.

You’re definitely right about building a future reference, thanks. David Goggins calls this filling his cookies jar, so you can grab a mental cookie when you need one

The one thing I'd also add is that to this is that if I do HD there is always a consequence to it, so it's not a 'free pass'. For example, the next hard session I do it has to be finished, and probably harder than it would have been too. As Vince Lombardi said "once you learn to quit it becomes a habit", something I semi-believe in, as there is a bit more nuance to it than that.

I’m wired the same way, Stu. After grumbling around a bit I got back on the erg and did a surprisingly solid 30r20. Being pissed at myself really helps sometimes. I remember a F&D on a 2k several years back, grabbing a cup of coffee, thinking F-it and rowing my second best ever.

[Elizabeth]

Elizabeth, at least once week I do a workout that is definitely hard, i.e. speed interval workout. The problem is sustained hard efforts. As I see it, you’ve three variables in interval training : faster, longer, more often. My natural inclination is seeking progression by going faster. But I’m thinking that after reaching a relative speed, longer and or more repeats are becoming more important.

You mentioned prior training left you with a good base but that there was a lack of intensity, so I wasn't sure if you had the hard efforts then.

Different paced hard work can drive different adaptations. The short stuff you're doing is good for improving VO2max. Longer, relatively slower intervals can help improve your body's ability to clear blood lactate, which is also helpful in a 2k.

[GlennUk]

A point perhaps worth reiterating is that your training should prepare you not just physically, but mentally for whatever event you are undertaking.

Something often missed out in training plans IME is the mental side of things. You need to be confident in your physical ability to undertake the physical challenge and believe in yourself.

I have found, since thinking about all both physical and mental elements of erging, I can push through when the going gets tough. Not always there are times i just completely screw up the pacing and there is no way i can continue at the pace i have set, however, mostly i find that i have gained confidence in my ability.

the mental prep is as important as the physical prep in the lead up to races/pb attempts imho.

[JaapvanE]

A point perhaps worth reiterating is that your training should prepare you not just physically, but mentally for whatever event you are undertaking.

Something often missed out in training plans IME is the mental side of things. You need to be confident in your physical ability to undertake the physical challenge and believe in yourself.

And for longer rows, being able to mentally handle the boredom of those long sessions. Getting used to it, and knowing you are able to fight the inevitable pain and discomfort associated with rowing, is a key part of getting to the finish.

[iain]

And for longer rows, being able to mentally handle the boredom of those long sessions. Getting used to it, and knowing you are able to fight the inevitable pain and discomfort associated with rowing, is a key part of getting to the finish.

Maybe I am just odd, but I cannot ever remember being bored on the erg including on a 111,111M row and on slower training runs of up to 60,000M. Interested to know when others get bored. For me the mental side is all about believing that you can get to the end and not giving up because you don't believe that you will be up to the task. Another issue that I am yet to understand is unexpected H/D. Sometimes I fight the urge and then give in by focussing on a partial target (most likely to happen if I set a target too far away and so the focus can make it difficult to reset for the next stage and so lead to H/D shortly after making the (initially) interim target. This I understand, but other times everything seems to be going fine and then I get an urge to H/D that I follow without really considering it. Is this just me? If not, any ideas what that is all about and how to stop it happening?

[Dangerscouse]

Maybe I am just odd, but I cannot ever remember being bored on the erg including on a 111,111M row and on slower training runs of up to 60,000M. Interested to know when others get bored. For me the mental side is all about believing that you can get to the end and not giving up because you don't believe that you will be up to the task. Another issue that I am yet to understand is unexpected H/D. Sometimes I fight the urge and then give in by focussing on a partial target (most likely to happen if I set a target too far away and so the focus can make it difficult to reset for the next stage and so lead to H/D shortly after making the (initially) interim target. This I understand, but other times everything seems to be going fine and then I get an urge to H/D that I follow without really considering it. Is this just me? If not, any ideas what that is all about and how to stop it happening?

I have very rarely been bored, maybe a few times over the years. I've been uncomfortable and in pain, but very rarely bored, and if I am it's because I'm just in a strange mood. As I row first thing in the morning I'm usually struggling to be bored.

HDs are very strange. I've had them on occasions, like you, that it feels like someone flicked a switch off and I just stop without really struggling. No prior notice and it just collapses.

I'm not sure of what to do avoid them, but I'm also not too bothered by them as they are very rare occasions and as there's mental wrestling going on it's very hard to control them.

Standard HDs are addressed with trying to interrogate why I want to stop, and I want to respond rather than react. Reacting is instinctive and can all too easily be emotional, but responding takes effort and thought, and for the avoidance of doubt, that might mean a HD is the best option.

[GlennUk]

And for longer rows, being able to mentally handle the boredom of those long sessions. Getting used to it, and knowing you are able to fight the inevitable pain and discomfort associated with rowing, is a key part of getting to the finish.

Im with Stu, i dont get bored, I have music on, but don't really listen to it, i watch the PM5 to better control my rowing, the longest i have rowed was 11.5hours, was not bored the whole time (although will admit to feeling that the metres counted down particularly slowly between 42 - 20k to go, despite having covered 74k by that point i got to 42k!),

[iain]

Thanks both.