Continued troubles with tendonitis--biomechanical solutions for the erg?

[Sakly]

When I tore my biceps in March, I was allowed to row again in May, but only 1000 meters at a time, once a week, at df 70, at 100w and 18SPM (yeah, my physio rowed as well, he knew how to box me in...). In essence, I could only row 5 minutes a week, at an agonizing slow pace with absolutely no resistance (for me). When I could do that for two weeks without pain, I was allowed to slowly increase one of these parameters. Its 9 months ago, and I am still getting back to my old level. But I also learned that rushing my healing process will bring me back to where I started. On the plus side, as my ego was completely out of the picture, I had lots of rows with a strong focus on technique.

Many greetings to the physio, he knows his job very well

[p_b82]

While I have no first hand experience - or have medical training - I do recall when my father ruptured his tendon. (not directly linked but recovery I think has some similarities to chronic tendonitis)

They put him in a cast up to his thigh (as they rightly detected if they didn't limit his mobility entirely he would walk on a knee length cast) - he was informed that complete rest was required, or it would not heal.

https://www.bupa.co.uk/health-informati ... on-rupture

I've put this link in - as the recovery part from the rupture I think is relevant - "You can expect to be back to normal activities, including low-impact sports, within four to six months..." (cycling, jogging, swimming were listed)

"....It might take a year or more to get back to your previous level of performance...." (in relation to high impact sports)

It does sound like you're trying to row before you've given the tendon the time it really needs to heal - and you're in an aggravation loop.

If you can get a referral to a physio they ought to be able to give some suitable medical advice on whether to ditch the erg for a brief while entirely though.

[Slidewinder]

My advice would be to follow username STC's example (in the 2011 thread linked by Nomath) and quit the RowErg.

And then?

And then he continues to get physically better and better, as he clearly states in the referenced thread.

[Slidewinder]

"From using the erg daily I riddled my body with tendonitus."
"My doctor now tells me, absolutely no more erging."

And asking doctors about physical exercises is often not a good idea. Many of them don't know what they are doing.

The person I quoted (from the thread linked by Nomath) took his doctor's advice. He reported that since quitting the erg he was getting physically better and better every day.

[Sakly]

"From using the erg daily I riddled my body with tendonitus."
"My doctor now tells me, absolutely no more erging."

And asking doctors about physical exercises is often not a good idea. Many of them don't know what they are doing.

The person I quoted (from the thread linked by Nomath) took his doctor's advice. He reported that since quitting the erg he was getting physically better and better every day.

Sure, if I don't trigger the injured area, it will heal. I don't need to be a doctor to know this and nothing wrong with this.
I don't need to be a doctor to know that "absolutely no more erging" is not a good recommendation. That is because the issues were not caused by the rower. I know that you don't want to accept that opinion, so any discussion on that will lead to wasting time.

[JaapvanE]

I know that you don't want to accept that opinion, so any discussion on that will lead to wasting time.

Let's ignore these ramblings and get back to why we are here: helping the OP in keeping on the Erg in the long run.

Reducing the strain on the Achilles is key here. Did you try short rows at no drag and no speed?

[Slidewinder]

Let's ignore these ramblings and get back to why we are here: helping the OP in keeping on the Erg in the long run

Let's ignore the advice from the ergo fanatics here. Using a rowing ergometer is not a necessary part of life. If using the device causes pain and injury, quit. Only a fool would continue. There are other ways to maintain fitness.

[Sakly]

Keeping the OP on the erg in the long run means let the tendon heal and then get back on the rower. If rowing causes setbacks, stay off the erg, that's it. Let the tendon heal completely and work on strengthening and mobilisation with low reps and only pain free exercises.

[Slidewinder]

That is because the issues were not caused by the rower.

Oh? If you are suffering from pain and injury and as a test you quit a particular activity and the pain disappears and the injury heals, a rational person would conclude that the discontinued activity was the cause of the pain and injury. The OP states that every time he gets on the erg he suffers from pain, but most here are urging him to get back on that machine and push through the pain. Why? It is senseless. The man could end up injured for life. Quit the erg. That is my caring, positive advice.

[Sakly]

That is because the issues were not caused by the rower.

Oh? If you are suffering from pain and injury and as a test you quit a particular activity and the pain disappears and the injury heals, a rational person would conclude that the discontinued activity was the cause of the pain and injury. The OP states that every time he gets on the erg he suffers from pain, but most here are urging him to get back on that machine and push through the pain. Why? It is senseless. The man could end up injured for life. Quit the erg. That is my caring, positive advice.

I think you are stupid, really. I don't like to write such sentence when I don't know the person well, but all I read from you in this thread to argue your point of view is stupid.
You only read parts you want, you only quote parts out of context which has no value for a discussion.
So I will stop discussing with you

[JaapvanE]

Keeping the OP on the erg in the long run means let the tendon heal and then get back on the rower. If rowing causes setbacks, stay off the erg, that's it. Let the tendon heal completely and work on strengthening and mobilisation with low reps and only pain free exercises.

Yeah,

Summarizing (to overcome the noise):

• Visiting a physiotherapist is very sensible and advised, visiting a GP/doctor is often less effective as they are less trained on dealing with restrictions in movement (at least in our part of the woods);
• Give the Achilles some rest
• If you start to row, try to reduce the strain on the Achilles. Reducing drag is a way, lowering the feet might help, putting the machine on slides or even install rotating foot plates might also reduce the strain. But knowing what stresses you Achilles is key here (is it the stretching, or the contracting, is it the repetition etc.).
• If you start to row, start small and light, and be reluctant to increase your training load. You indicated that a low-moderate row set you back, so that might be too much (light rowing only?). Your fitness might allow you to row a marathon, but one part of your body might object. Listen to your body, even the small parts. After some rest and recovery, it might be time to learn what your Achilles can do safely (and that might not be much), but don't push yourself. Take signals seriously.

I would like to add that in exercise and injury recovery, there are two schools of thought. First is the "Take a rest" school, which typically fixated hurt joints for months. This frequently results in stiff joints and weakened muscles that need to be trained after the fixation is removed. The second is "if you don't use it, you will lose it" which will still describe some rest, but also focusses on restricted movement. Here, some controlled movement and exercise is introduced earlier, preventing joint stiffness and muscle degradation. My experience is that most physiotherapists are from the second school and only fixate when the joint really needs a rest.

To illustrate: I had a herniated neck twice. As a fanatic judoka, my first question to my neurologist was whether I was banned from Judo for 6 months. He gave me no neck brace, no nothing. He even encouraged me to continue Judo as the health benefits are obvious, but advised me to prevent specific neck clamps and throws where a neck/head-landing might happen. His reason: not moving my neck/shoulder section for months would degrade flexibility and strength that would be hard to get back. So he reminded me to take my responsibility to prevent specific harmful situations, but encouraged me to keep moving.

The second school does require the patient to be honest with himself: do you feel pain, and when?

[Sakly]

The second school does require the patient to be honest with himself: do you feel pain, and when?

That's the most important part. No ego lifting, no ego erging, no ego <replace with any other activity>.
That us also true for healthy people.

[JaapvanE]

The second school does require the patient to be honest with himself: do you feel pain, and when?

That's the most important part. No ego lifting, no ego erging, no ego <replace with any other activity>.
That us also true for healthy people.

For me, that is the most difficult part. It is so tempting to get back to the pre-injury pace and distance. Or even hit a sprint to see if you can still reach that old pace. Especially if almost your entire body feels it could do much more. But as you said: overdoing will cause a flare-up and thus hurt you long term.

I felt as slow as a turtle, starting with 5 minutes a week at a boring pace. Felt like a bad warmup. But at least I was back on the erg. I was lucky that C2 resets the season at May 1st, so all my season records are post injury. This keeps my ego a bit satisfied as I can see progress. But keep seeing progress in any shape or form is essential.

That return to pre-injury training levels is agonising slow. As an indication (providing no serious setbacks): I'll be back at my normal drag (df 135) around september, starting at df 70 last May. So almost 18 months since my injury, and no clue what my pace will be at that df.

[Sakly]

The second school does require the patient to be honest with himself: do you feel pain, and when?

That's the most important part. No ego lifting, no ego erging, no ego <replace with any other activity>.
That us also true for healthy people.

For me, that is the most difficult part. It is so tempting to get back to the pre-injury pace and distance. Or even hit a sprint to see if you can still reach that old pace. Especially if almost your entire body feels it could do much more. But as you said: overdoing will cause a flare-up and thus hurt you long term.

I felt as slow as a turtle, starting with 5 minutes a week at a boring pace. Felt like a bad warmup. But at least I was back on the erg. I was lucky that C2 resets the season at May 1st, so all my season records are post injury. This keeps my ego a bit satisfied as I can see progress. But keep seeing progress in any shape or form is essential.

That return to pre-injury training levels is agonising slow. As an indication (providing no serious setbacks): I'll be back at my normal drag (df 135) around september, starting at df 70 last May. So almost 18 months since my injury, and no clue what my pace will be at that df.

For me this is also a hard part sometimes. I know my body well, but sometimes I do stupid things knowing that this is not the right thing to do. Anyway, if you're aware of that it's not a big deal and you can handle that. If this is the "normal state" then something goes wrong.

Regarding DF: for me I find DF not an important setting. As long as it's in a range not too high or too low I'm fine with it (means 115-140, up to 150 for short distance high rate) and it doesn't have much influence to pace, or better to say, the ability to get to a specific pace.

[JaapvanE]

Regarding DF: for me I find DF not an important setting. As long as it's in a range not too high or too low I'm fine with it (means 115-140, up to 150 for short distance high rate) and it doesn't have much influence to pace, or better to say, the ability to get to a specific pace.

Big benefit of the low df is that the flywheel spins down less, making the catch much smoother and feel lighter. At df70, I was basically sliding up and down the rail holding a handle. No real stress on the body (please note my SPM and pace were limited as well).

Regarding df and pace. I recently had a strong focus on technique and noticed I could pull a 2:00/500m at df80 (yeah, my ego made me do that bad thing, regretted it later). But I can't get passed that point (where at df250 I pulled 1:30/500m easily with worse technique). So when you are unlimited, one might close to a pace obtained at higher df, but matching it might be impossible. For me, at 100kg, higher SPM's are difficult. But a LWT might have bo issue there.