Max heart rate

[pagomichaelh]

I notice that my heartrate goes up 5 BPM before I need to burp and goes down again after. Could take a few minutes before that happens during rowing though. Should that count as (over)training?

Ha ha, mine goes the other direction when I either burp or pass wind! The bpm will drop about 5 beats for about ten strokes, then go back to where it was.

[Sakly]

I notice that my heartrate goes up 5 BPM before I need to burp and goes down again after. Could take a few minutes before that happens during rowing though. Should that count as (over)training?

Ha ha, mine goes the other direction when I either burp or pass wind! The bpm will drop about 5 beats for about ten strokes, then go back to where it was.

Same here, but for me it drops up to 10 beats and then returns

[Merlin]

What would be a reliable way to get a max heart reading on a rower (I haven't updated mine in a while)

Reliability = test standardization; use the same workout, with same effort and try to keep all other things as similar as possible (well-recovered? well-nutritioned? stress-level?, weather conditions?)

Choose a workout that's bullet proof for raising your heart beat to the max:

warm-up 10 mins @"I can go like this forever pace"

- 10x100m full effort sprint intervals with 30s rest for incomplete recovery

If you give 90-95% the first interval and a true max effort for all subsequent intervals, your HR should reliably peak at interval 6-9 depending on how much power endurance you have in the tank

Of course you can also do max effort 6x200m sprints.. but it should be a distance that you complete at a true max effort and that you can repeat multiple times so your heart rate increases in a "controlled" step-wise way over time and the test should be short enough, so it can be repeated without too much training load/strain on the body added to your workout program.

(Consider "uncertainty about your estimate": I would consider difference of ±5bpm as "random (measurement) error", so rather than considering every change "important/meaningful", I would rather assume that the max heart rate is relative stable (i.e. declining very slowly with age) and that the best estimate is the average of multiple (standardized) measurements within a reasonable timeframe (e.g. 3-6 or even 12 months without significant changes in lifestyle/training volume/general health etc).

[lindsayh]

after a long time away from all this i will put my "oar' back in the water briefly as I have a particular interest although I am not an exercise physiologist
There is good evidence that shows that trying to determine MHR by any formula is very unwise and unreliable and you must simply go as hard as you can to get as close as you can.
A proper VO2 max done with lactates will get you to max and determine training zones but hard to find somewhere to do on the erg.
The most widely accepted protocol is the one developed at the Australian Institute of Sport from my understanding. I was lucky enough to get do it in their lab a few years ago.
It is based on a stepped down 7x 4'/1'R starting steady each one faster and ending at maximum to failure. They set each 4' target based on % of target watts and measure lactate and HR at each step.
The AIS people are also confident that a simply 100% 30 minute piece will get you there or very close as well.

If you want to get a reasonable idea of training zones without lactates then you can take your MHR and subtract your resting HR to get heart rate reserve then take the % of HRR and add back the RHR.....
Say MHR is 180 and RHR is 60 then HRR = 120 and cap on UT1 = 80% of 120 + 60 = 156

Just my $0.02 - i will gracefully withdraw again

best to all from the olden days!

[Dangerscouse]

Just my $0.02 - i will gracefully withdraw again

best to all from the olden days!

Hello mate!!!! Great to see you back on here. How long has it been?

You're not allowed to withdraw again

[MPx]

Just my $0.02 - i will gracefully withdraw again

best to all from the olden days!

Hello mate!!!! Great to see you back on here. How long has it been?

You're not allowed to withdraw again

I second that - welcome back Lindsay

[lindsayh]

Hi Danger and Mike
the quote below that I posted yesterday on FF thread probably explains best.
I wouldn't say a come back but I dropped in to the team thread to try to explain my decline to those who might remember (or even care) when i was competitive at this game and then was distracted by this thread.
I have no functional knees and limited training opportunities unfortunately. Covid just became all consuming and peripheral activities were collateral damage and accelerated the OA.
The erging that I can do is actually good to at least keep moving but it is pretty sad to measure the decline so accurately. It will be interesting to see how the new knees will function next year once all is done but lack of compression at the catch is terminal I suspect.

very best to all

Hi all - long time no talk - approaching 2 years I am afraid. Some may actually remember me from when I could actually do this erg stuff successfully.
I was compelled to back off when my life became consumed during the pandemic by my work (I am a veterinarian) which meant little training time and an acceleration of the OA in my knees from all the standing. My CTCs have documented this fall form grace to disgrace sadly but fortunately I have been able to complete my 130th consecutive CTC entry today. My 2k has fallen from 7:05 to maybe 8:20+ in the same time frame.
I felt bound to check in to explain why I am so slow to those oldies who may wonder. The August CTC was completed literally on one leg as I recover from a foot surgery and prepare for the first of two knee replacements in October. My racing days are over!

[Dangerscouse]

Hi Danger and Mike
the quote below that I posted yesterday on FF thread probably explains best.
I wouldn't say a come back but I dropped in to the team thread to try to explain my decline to those who might remember (or even care) when i was competitive at this game and then was distracted by this thread.
I have no functional knees and limited training opportunities unfortunately. Covid just became all consuming and peripheral activities were collateral damage and accelerated the OA.
The erging that I can do is actually good to at least keep moving but it is pretty sad to measure the decline so accurately. It will be interesting to see how the new knees will function next year once all is done but lack of compression at the catch is terminal I suspect.

very best to all

Hi all - long time no talk - approaching 2 years I am afraid. Some may actually remember me from when I could actually do this erg stuff successfully.
I was compelled to back off when my life became consumed during the pandemic by my work (I am a veterinarian) which meant little training time and an acceleration of the OA in my knees from all the standing. My CTCs have documented this fall form grace to disgrace sadly but fortunately I have been able to complete my 130th consecutive CTC entry today. My 2k has fallen from 7:05 to maybe 8:20+ in the same time frame.
I felt bound to check in to explain why I am so slow to those oldies who may wonder. The August CTC was completed literally on one leg as I recover from a foot surgery and prepare for the first of two knee replacements in October. My racing days are over!

Sorry to hear about your knees, and I know this is far far easier said than done, but don't worry about your times as still erging into your 70s is an amazing thing.

Your advice and knowledge have been much missed, so that at the very least is something that we'll appreciate you doing if you're able to

[MartinSH4321]

Hi Danger and Mike
the quote below that I posted yesterday on FF thread probably explains best.
I wouldn't say a come back but I dropped in to the team thread to try to explain my decline to those who might remember (or even care) when i was competitive at this game and then was distracted by this thread.
I have no functional knees and limited training opportunities unfortunately. Covid just became all consuming and peripheral activities were collateral damage and accelerated the OA.
The erging that I can do is actually good to at least keep moving but it is pretty sad to measure the decline so accurately. It will be interesting to see how the new knees will function next year once all is done but lack of compression at the catch is terminal I suspect.

very best to all

Hi all - long time no talk - approaching 2 years I am afraid. Some may actually remember me from when I could actually do this erg stuff successfully.
I was compelled to back off when my life became consumed during the pandemic by my work (I am a veterinarian) which meant little training time and an acceleration of the OA in my knees from all the standing. My CTCs have documented this fall form grace to disgrace sadly but fortunately I have been able to complete my 130th consecutive CTC entry today. My 2k has fallen from 7:05 to maybe 8:20+ in the same time frame.
I felt bound to check in to explain why I am so slow to those oldies who may wonder. The August CTC was completed literally on one leg as I recover from a foot surgery and prepare for the first of two knee replacements in October. My racing days are over!

Hello Lindsay!
Sorry to hear that, I hope your knee replacements will go as planned, all the best!

[MPx]

... My racing days are over!

Hi Lindsay - great to have you back. I'm sure its all a bit depressing seeing the times that are possible now vs what you were doing a couple of years ago...but I'm much more hopeful of a significant bounce back than you appear to forecast.

First point that you already know so well is that time in the saddle would make a huge difference. No or limited training = decline; training most days = improvements. If you are ready to cut back on the work commitment a bit and allow a bit more room for training it will reward you with better times. As hard as it is, the erg is very fair like that!

Second, you'll be at a bit of a low with the OA and other issues...but rectification is already in the timetable. You know Richard S has suffered similarly and has had one total hip replacement thus far. It took some time post op, but he's been coming back strongly over the last couple of years and has already set a couple of British records this year in the 70+. No reason you couldn't do similar once the bionic knees are in place. My very best wishes for a successful outcome and a competitve erging future.

Stay with us....

[Cyclist2]

best to all from the olden days!

Hi Lindsay. I guess I'm one those "old timers", now. I tend to get preoccupied with actual rowing, cycling, life, etc. and only check in here occasionally. I haven't done a CTC in a few months either. I'm glad to see you're still active, even with the OA issues getting you down. As Mike and Danger stated, you'll bounce back. Hang in there, and post on here once in a while - let us know your progress.