World Rowing Indoor Championships -2023, age groups

[jamesg]

Presumably the Masters events will continue to be 1k and use this rule:

A rower may compete as a masters rower from the beginning of the year during which he or she turns 27. Masters rowers are then placed in categories A to M, ‘A’ being an average of 27 years or over, and ‘M’ being an average of 89 years or over. Dependent on the age they turn that year, the masters rower will then compete against others with the same average age in the respective category.


A. Minimum age: 27 years
B. Average age: 36 years or more
C. Average age: 43 years or more
D. Average age: 50 years or more
E. Average age: 55 years or more
F. Average age: 60 years or more
G. Average age: 65 years or more
H. Average age: 70 years or more
I. Average age: 75 years or more
J. Average age: 80 years or more
K. Average age: 83 years or more
L. Average age: 86 years or more
M. Average age: 89 years or more

[Rod]

Presumably the Masters events will continue to be 1k and use this rule:

A rower may compete as a masters rower from the beginning of the year during which he or she turns 27. Masters rowers are then placed in categories A to M, ‘A’ being an average of 27 years or over, and ‘M’ being an average of 89 years or over. Dependent on the age they turn that year, the masters rower will then compete against others with the same average age in the respective category.


A. Minimum age: 27 years
B. Average age: 36 years or more
C. Average age: 43 years or more
D. Average age: 50 years or more
E. Average age: 55 years or more
F. Average age: 60 years or more
G. Average age: 65 years or more
H. Average age: 70 years or more
I. Average age: 75 years or more
J. Average age: 80 years or more
K. Average age: 83 years or more
L. Average age: 86 years or more
M. Average age: 89 years or more

I think you're talking about the on water rowing rules there.

We're talking about the Indoor Championships.

I'm going to Toronto (I live in England) and will racing in the 2k in the 65 - 69 Lighweight category.

It's not right that those of 70 and over are all put in together. How is an 85 year old supposed to race fairly against a 70 year old.

[GlennUk]

it just saves you the medals and potentially a specific group (and thus timeslot) to start. In all honesty,

My assumption was that grouping them together essentially saved a few medals, not sure what prizes are given if any.

Substantially though, it appears someone, in their prime probably, has decided that no one would care and those affected don't matter.

Pretty sad given how inclusive society is getting generally.

[nick rockliff]

These are the results from BIRC 2003 which was my first race, can remember watching them race.

LM70-74: Gradley 8.07.1, Huddy 8.30.6, Brunt 8.32.3, Franklin 8.54.6
LM75-79: Leah 7.37.6, Everington 7.46.6, Towler 8.08.4
LM80-89: Melody 8.52.8
LM90+: Hodgson 9.55.4

John Hodgson went on to compete at 100 years young.

[GlennUk]

When i started erging in the 2009 seasons, i used to go to erg comps, there was a guy there, Charles (apologies i cant recall his surname) was competing and he was in his 80s, inspirational to say the least.

There are many on the Diamonds FB group over 70 erging regularly and excelling in their age classes, with some taking WR. Life doesn't stop just because one reaches a specific age, the The Diamonds FB group affirms this very clearly, from those at the elite level to those of us much less capable.

I hope that the competition changes their decision.

[MPx]

When i started erging in the 2009 seasons, i used to go to erg comps, there was a guy there, Charles (apologies i cant recall his surname) was competing and he was in his 80s, inspirational to say the least.

It was Charles Morley, a good friend of Susan Young (TPK). Tribute to him here https://www.parkrun.org.uk/brueton/news ... te-speech/.

[nick rockliff]

When i started erging in the 2009 seasons, i used to go to erg comps, there was a guy there, Charles (apologies i cant recall his surname) was competing and he was in his 80s, inspirational to say the least.

It was Charles Morley, a good friend of Susan Young (TPK). Tribute to him here https://www.parkrun.org.uk/brueton/news ... te-speech/.

Was trying to put a surname but just couldn't remember. He was at all the races.

[btlifter]

it just saves you the medals and potentially a specific group (and thus timeslot) to start. In all honesty,

My assumption was that grouping them together essentially saved a few medals, not sure what prizes are given if any.

Substantially though, it appears someone, in their prime probably, has decided that no one would care and those affected don't matter.

Pretty sad given how inclusive society is getting generally.

The lumping of all 70+ athletes seems like a poor oversight to me. However, while I won't speculate as to decision-makers' rationale, I'd be skeptical of the "in their prime" perspective. The same decision-makers have also removed the "Open" age-division.

[GlennUk]

The lumping of all 70+ athletes seems like a poor oversight to me. However, while I won't speculate as to decision-makers' rationale, I'd be skeptical of the "in their prime" perspective. The same decision-makers have also removed the "Open" age-division.

Fair point, letting my prejudices get in the way.

They may be in their prime but that may not be the primary reason why they discriminated against the older rowers, it wasn't just those over 70 they discriminated against

On a serious note, i am sure whoever did this, and however they came to the decision, it was not out of any intent to offend or discriminate. The fact that it has upset a group of people is unfortunate and it is hoped they will reconsider.

[GlennUk]

When i started erging in the 2009 seasons, i used to go to erg comps, there was a guy there, Charles (apologies i cant recall his surname) was competing and he was in his 80s, inspirational to say the least.

It was Charles Morley, a good friend of Susan Young (TPK). Tribute to him here https://www.parkrun.org.uk/brueton/news ... te-speech/.

Thanks Mike, I was sure he was friends with Two Pudding Kid (AKA Susan Young) I was in my late 40s/early 50s and i can remember seeing him get on the erg and was blown away by the fact that thi s'old guy' was racing.

Now a 'few' years later, Im still blown away by the efforts some of my FB group peers are putting in, hope to be able to emulate them as my hair grows that little bit grey,.

[Sleigh]

The reply from World Rowing came today. Here it is:
Dear Bob,
Thank you for your email and comments. It is certainly understood that in any competition age category, there will be a range of athletes--some of whom will be disadvantaged because of age. This decision was taken by the World Rowing Council after a recommendation of the World Rowing Indoor Rowing Commission, based on an analysis of past participation and performance data and considering the scheduling, technical, and logistical constraints of the event as well as the long term strategy for the event.
Best,
World Rowing

Okay; That's that. I want to thank you for the support you offered in this Forum; it is very much appreciated.
After I turn ninety in late November of this year I'll be posting times in the Concept 2 Rankings.

[Dangerscouse]

The reply from World Rowing came today. Here it is:
Dear Bob,
Thank you for your email and comments. It is certainly understood that in any competition age category, there will be a range of athletes--some of whom will be disadvantaged because of age. This decision was taken by the World Rowing Council after a recommendation of the World Rowing Indoor Rowing Commission, based on an analysis of past participation and performance data and considering the scheduling, technical, and logistical constraints of the event as well as the long term strategy for the event.
Best,
World Rowing

Okay; That's that. I want to thank you for the support you offered in this Forum; it is very much appreciated.
After I turn ninety in late November of this year I'll be posting times in the Concept 2 Rankings.

I'm not surprised by the response, but I am disappointed. The worst bit is the reference to their 'long term strategy for the event'...what does that mean?!?! That's quite an insidious statement imo.

All the very best for your future rowing and please make sure to post on here with your results. I'll be very interested to see how you do.

[JaapvanE]

After I turn ninety in late November of this year I'll be posting times in the Concept 2 Rankings.

Please do, because each time you do, you inspire us "youngsters". Seeing people like yourself still rowing, enjoying the sport and be fit is a tribute to an active lifestyle and a shining example to the rest of us that really deserves some podium somewhere.

In many sports governing bodies I was a board member of, there was the enduring discussion around the relation between the peak of the pyramid (i.e. the profesional athletes, your Olympic teams) and the floor of the pyramid (the thousands of amateur sporters). Some think the floor is just there to grow the future peak from. I always liked to think the other way around: the peak is there to grow the floor, to inspire people to discover and pick up the sport. It is a shame that in rowing people forgot that it is the floor that brings health benefits to the masses and joy to so many. That they write off people because they don't fit their too narrowly defined image of an "example athlete" and write off anybody in the pyramid above a certain age in the process. They clearly forgot that their primary goal is to inspire people to get in these boats/ergs, regardless of age. A real shame.

[GlennUk]

The reply from World Rowing came today. Here it is:
Dear Bob,
Thank you for your email and comments. It is certainly understood that in any competition age category, there will be a range of athletes--some of whom will be disadvantaged because of age. This decision was taken by the World Rowing Council after a recommendation of the World Rowing Indoor Rowing Commission, based on an analysis of past participation and performance data and considering the scheduling, technical, and logistical constraints of the event as well as the long term strategy for the event.
Best,
World Rowing

Okay; That's that. I want to thank you for the support you offered in this Forum; it is very much appreciated.
After I turn ninety in late November of this year I'll be posting times in the Concept 2 Rankings.

'Good'' to see they value the support and efforts of some pretty amazing athletes so little.

I suspect the participation of those over 70 will drop further, reinforcing their decision to lump them all together and discriminate against those over 70.

[Tsnor]

The reply from World Rowing came today. Here it is:
Dear Bob,
Thank you for your email and comments. It is certainly understood that in any competition age category, there will be a range of athletes--some of whom will be disadvantaged because of age. This decision was taken by the World Rowing Council after a recommendation of the World Rowing Indoor Rowing Commission, based on an analysis of past participation and performance data and considering the scheduling, technical, and logistical constraints of the event as well as the long term strategy for the event.
Best,
World Rowing

Okay; That's that. I want to thank you for the support you offered in this Forum; it is very much appreciated.
After I turn ninety in late November of this year I'll be posting times in the Concept 2 Rankings.

'Good'' to see they value the support and efforts of some pretty amazing athletes so little.

I suspect the participation of those over 70 will drop further, reinforcing their decision to lump them all together and discriminate against those over 70.

FYI, Concept2 2022 complete year ranking database, 2K, verified, 65+ = all ages 65 to 99, etc., men, women.
65+ 922 men put in a ranked workout, 211 women
70+ 461, 99
75+ 160, 32
80+ 53, 9
90+ 4, 1

This pool of possible participants led to a single unified 75+ mens heat last year (2022) with 12 total entries. Not all age groups had an entry. Most had a single entry.
https://regatta.time-team.nl/wrich/2022 ... de2634.php Watch the race video. Women had a single heat at 70+ with 11 entices. https://regatta.time-team.nl/wrich/2022 ... 05cf2c.php

You can see why they might decide not to hold separate 4 classes (Men, women, lightweight, heavy) for each 5 year age group 75 and above. They risk getting only one participant in an age group who doesn't know how to row being named "best in the world" while rowing a 30 minute 2K, ugly form, laughing all the way and later posting a video making fun of indoor rowing that gets 2M clicks on youtube. (They did not have this problem in 2022, all the the rowers were credible.)

As pointed out above, the only difference between 2022 and 2023 will be handing out a dozen or two additional ribbons. The ribbons don't cost that much, so don't think cost is an issue. Given the lifetime achievement videos C2 posts I do think C2 respects older rowers. So I'm thinking this decision is focused on making sure all the "best in the world" victories come from a big enough pool of rowers to merit the title as a way of protecting the athletes who put in 1000s of hours prepping for this race.