Training effect on resting heart rate

[aussie nick]

So you know very little about the fitness requirements of a rugby player then.

I have watched the game. I have played similar sports and I have rowed at the collegiate level and run marathons and ultra-marathons and finished Ironman triathlons. And, I am a physician. I feel I have a pretty good sense of the aerobic fitness requirements of different sports. One doesn't have to have done a sport to understand the aerobic requirements are different for weight lifters and marathoners.

You have shown your ignorance of the fitness requirements of rugby players by your comments.
As with all sports there are the casual, social players who won’t be very fit, and the professional/elite players who are very fit across the whole range of aerobic, anaerobic, strength, power, agility fitness required to perform at that level.
You are, of course correct, in that different sports require different balances of fitness.
I can say with certainty that Mo Farah couldn’t survive in the front row of a rugby scrum, or tackle a 120Kg prop running at him but that doesn’t make him unfit. No more than that 120kg prop being unable to run a 3 hour marathon makes him unfit, aerobically or otherwise.

correct all round.

my brother is an ultra marathon runner who came second in his age group at leadville (100 mile trail run at high altitude) a few years ago (RHR 52-54 so...maybe he needs to run more as per frankenrack, idk?!) but all he is good for is long, slow running. he can't even do a pull up, no way he could squat his body weight and he only gets quicker than me at 800m.

[Carl Watts]

My resting HR is typically 58-60 but this is not really a true resting its just sitting still for a minute or so.

Have seen it as low as 52-54 after a few days off rowing and fully recovered. If I saw it drop under 50 I would probably panic and call the doctor.

[Ombrax]

How well are "resting" heart rate (which I assume means what you get in middle of day if you sit or lie down for a while then measure your HR) and "waking" heart rate, which by definition I believe is what you measure when you first wake up in the morning, before getting out of bed, correlated?

I've always thought that waking HR was a more useful measure than resting. (If only because if you notice that it's starting to trend upwards it can be a sign of insufficient recovery / overtraining.)

[frankencrank]

I have watched the game. I have played similar sports and I have rowed at the collegiate level and run marathons and ultra-marathons and finished Ironman triathlons. And, I am a physician. I feel I have a pretty good sense of the aerobic fitness requirements of different sports. One doesn't have to have done a sport to understand the aerobic requirements are different for weight lifters and marathoners.

You have shown your ignorance of the fitness requirements of rugby players by your comments.
As with all sports there are the casual, social players who won’t be very fit, and the professional/elite players who are very fit across the whole range of aerobic, anaerobic, strength, power, agility fitness required to perform at that level.
You are, of course correct, in that different sports require different balances of fitness.
I can say with certainty that Mo Farah couldn’t survive in the front row of a rugby scrum, or tackle a 120Kg prop running at him but that doesn’t make him unfit. No more than that 120kg prop being unable to run a 3 hour marathon makes him unfit, aerobically or otherwise.

correct all round.

my brother is an ultra marathon runner who came second in his age group at leadville (100 mile trail run at high altitude) a few years ago (RHR 52-54 so...maybe he needs to run more as per frankenrack, idk?!) but all he is good for is long, slow running. he can't even do a pull up, no way he could squat his body weight and he only gets quicker than me at 800m.

You guys are complicating the problem. There are degrees of everything and there are many kinds of fitness from aerobic, strength, agility, etc. Different sports require different balance of those fitnesses. Elite marathoners and ultra marathoners don't give a whit whether they can do a single pull-up or shoot a basketball or tackle anyone. Their sole focus is training the heart to get as much oxygen as possible to the leg muscles. I consider that to be a higher degree of aerobic fitness than that required of most other sports. It isn't a "better" fitness overall, just a different sport. But, if you look at those muscles under a microscope you will see more capillaries and more mitochondria than you will see in the rugby player (who will have more contractile elements which robs from the ability to have more capillaries and mitochondria - there is only so much room). It is that capillary density and mitochondrial density that determines the aerobic fitness of that muscle.

Don't take it personally when I say rugby players are lesser from an aerobic fitness point of view. They are different sports.

[frankencrank]

My resting HR is typically 58-60 but this is not really a true resting its just sitting still for a minute or so.

Have seen it as low as 52-54 after a few days off rowing and fully recovered. If I saw it drop under 50 I would probably panic and call the doctor.

When I started marathoning it took awhile for my HR to drop and for that to be and feel normal. As it dropped I kept getting early contractions (called PVC's - premature ventricular contractions) and it took awhile for those to go away. It was a little frightening until I understood what was happening. When you drop below 50 and you call your doctor he will go Ho-Hum if you are asymptomatic otherwise.

I use to pretend that God only give us so many heart beats. It was one of the ways I justified training so much when I really wasn't any good. I expected that my 2 hours at 140 training were worth it when the rest of the day was spend in the 40's. Seems to have worked (with the help of a few stents) as I approach 80 and still have a RHR less than 50 (with the help of a beta blocker).

[frankencrank]

How well are "resting" heart rate (which I assume means what you get in middle of day if you sit or lie down for a while then measure your HR) and "waking" heart rate, which by definition I believe is what you measure when you first wake up in the morning, before getting out of bed, correlated?

I've always thought that waking HR was a more useful measure than resting. (If only because if you notice that it's starting to trend upwards it can be a sign of insufficient recovery / overtraining.)

Your waking HR is really your resting HR because that is when you are most rested.

[Carl Watts]

Its important to look also at your MAX HR to look at your range available.

A resting of 48 may be good, but what's your MAX ? it can vary. I have a mate that's in the 40's but his max is not in the 180's like mine so the range is not as good so the resting HR can mean little.

Always used the free spirits HR Bands calculator when I first started rowing.

https://www.freespiritsrowing.com/forum ... calculator

[electricstart]

I am 66 have resting heart rate of 44 to 46 . Trust me I am not in as good of shapes as most of you guys . Means very little . Fitbit does say I am in excellent shape for my age. I will try that Multi-Stage-Fitness-Test' and let you know.

[frankencrank]

I am 66 have resting heart rate of 44 to 46 . Trust me I am not in as good of shapes as most of you guys . Means very little . Fitbit does say I am in excellent shape for my age. I will try that Multi-Stage-Fitness-Test' and let you know.

The question isn't how you compare to the 20 year olds.but how you compare to your peers. My guess is you will do very well.

Apple says I am below average but they stop iterating at 65 so I am being compared to those more than 20 years younger. My cardiologist is impressed though so I feel I am doing just fine.

[electricstart]

frankencrank I understand what saying and my cardiologist just says I have a low heart rate nothing about my condition . My HR number has always been in 40s whether I am in good shape or bad shape . Was low when I was much younger also .My mothers was low so I inherited it maybe . I do not think you can use that number as a overall condition guide .In my case anyway . The fitbit watch charge 4 does have a guide on there watch that tracks your overall heath not sure if it goes by heart beat . I think it is how much cardio you do a week . It is for my age group .

[frankencrank]

frankencrank I understand what saying and my cardiologist just says I have a low heart rate nothing about my condition . My HR number has always been in 40s whether I am in good shape or bad shape . Was low when I was much younger also .My mothers was low so I inherited it maybe . I do not think you can use that number as a overall condition guide .In my case anyway . The fitbit watch charge 4 does have a guide on there watch that tracks your overall heath not sure if it goes by heart beat . I think it is how much cardio you do a week . It is for my age group .

40's is very unusual (rare) for someone who is sedentary. If someone reasonably sedentary walked into my office and I saw that I would work you up and down (well, maybe I would wait until I had seen it a couple of times) to make sure I wasn't missing something. I would start with thyroid issues. https://www.verywellhealth.com/thyroid- ... rt-1746112 Doctors just don't like "different"

In mammals resting HR does vary somewhat with mass (Elephants have very low HR compared to us) but I doubt you are that big. https://dinoanimals.com/animals/heart-r ... ls-top-10/

In most cases the last thing you want to be is "interesting" to your doctor. Perhaps you (and your family) are different.

[dabatey]

My resting heartrate is high 40's(in bed)to low 50's (depending on just how resting/relaxed) whether I've been fit or unfit over the years. Had plenty physicals in the forces and no doctor has ever found my heartrate 'interesting'. I don't think scare stories are warranted.

[electricstart]

frankencrank I understand what saying and my cardiologist just says I have a low heart rate nothing about my condition . My HR number has always been in 40s whether I am in good shape or bad shape . Was low when I was much younger also .My mothers was low so I inherited it maybe . I do not think you can use that number as a overall condition guide .In my case anyway . The fitbit watch charge 4 does have a guide on there watch that tracks your overall heath not sure if it goes by heart beat . I think it is how much cardio you do a week . It is for my age group .

40's is very unusual (rare) for someone who is sedentary. If someone reasonably sedentary walked into my office and I saw that I would work you up and down (well, maybe I would wait until I had seen it a couple of times) to make sure I wasn't missing something. I would start with thyroid issues. https://www.verywellhealth.com/thyroid- ... rt-1746112 Doctors just don't like "different"

In mammals resting HR does vary somewhat with mass (Elephants have very low HR compared to us) but I doubt you are that big. https://dinoanimals.com/animals/heart-r ... ls-top-10/

In most cases the last thing you want to be is "interesting" to your doctor. Perhaps you (and your family) are different.

I have one of the best Cardiologist in the country . My heart has been tested many times in 66 years. I do have extra beats PVCS they call it . My heart rate is Normal for Me . Trust me I had heart monitor on for five days and pushed it to 190 peak heart rate and back down many times. All good . Had many stress tests, nuclear tests . All Normal except extra beats . . I was a wrestler, played football, a runner and had strenuous job at one time they say that is what contributed to the low rate .Plus genetics Nothing to do with Thyroid all good .Weight a little over weight but not much .10 lb. All my blood work Good. They test my heart once a year because of the PVCS . I am still here and workout and heart still ticking 44 to 46 resting HR .

[johnlvs2run]

My resting heartrate is high 40's(in bed)to low 50's (depending on just how resting/relaxed) whether I've been fit or unfit over the years. Had plenty physicals in the forces and no doctor has ever found my heartrate 'interesting'. I don't think scare stories are warranted.

I completely agree with you.

[frankencrank]

frankencrank I understand what saying and my cardiologist just says I have a low heart rate nothing about my condition . My HR number has always been in 40s whether I am in good shape or bad shape . Was low when I was much younger also .My mothers was low so I inherited it maybe . I do not think you can use that number as a overall condition guide .In my case anyway . The fitbit watch charge 4 does have a guide on there watch that tracks your overall heath not sure if it goes by heart beat . I think it is how much cardio you do a week . It is for my age group .

40's is very unusual (rare) for someone who is sedentary. If someone reasonably sedentary walked into my office and I saw that I would work you up and down (well, maybe I would wait until I had seen it a couple of times) to make sure I wasn't missing something. I would start with thyroid issues. https://www.verywellhealth.com/thyroid- ... rt-1746112 Doctors just don't like "different"

In mammals resting HR does vary somewhat with mass (Elephants have very low HR compared to us) but I doubt you are that big. https://dinoanimals.com/animals/heart-r ... ls-top-10/

In most cases the last thing you want to be is "interesting" to your doctor. Perhaps you (and your family) are different.

I have one of the best Cardiologist in the country . My heart has been tested many times in 66 years. I do have extra beats PVCS they call it . My heart rate is Normal for Me . Trust me I had heart monitor on for five days and pushed it to 190 peak heart rate and back down many times. All good . Had many stress tests, nuclear tests . All Normal except extra beats . . I was a wrestler, played football, a runner and had strenuous job at one time they say that is what contributed to the low rate .Plus genetics Nothing to do with Thyroid all good .Weight a little over weight but not much .10 lb. All my blood work Good. They test my heart once a year because of the PVCS . I am still here and workout and heart still ticking 44 to 46 resting HR .

Cool. History is important. Key word in my prior response was sedentary. Few here qualify. Scary indeed.