New Personal Best! Brag About That New Pb!

[iangallagher]

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Have you seen the Eddie Fletcher 2k warm up guide? Not used it myself but tucked away the guide for when I feel like going back to the 2k. Not quite sure how to use it and if each warm up section is continuous to the next one, but may be of use.

Thanks Dino,
<>
I have been vaguely aware of the EF warm-up - I've never used it, but perhaps I'll give it a shot next time I try a 2k (that pesky 1.5s!).
<>

Well.. since I posted it, thought might as well give it a go this evening (bit of support tape on the knee and largely ignoring it)

Target was 7:20 so after some stretching, followed the WU plan accordingly:


Found it hard to pace so low and rate up to 22/24. I also should have made a card up in large writing and stuck in next to the monitor as hard to read it on A4 paper on the floor! This is 19:45 of continuous rowing which ended up at ~4600m

Wasn't sure what to do after this, hit it straight away or do something else. So ended up jumping on my spin bike for 5 mins as had seen Cameron Buchan do this whilst he was still as Leander on one of his videos. Kept my HR around 110.
Then onto the 2K.

Plan was to be slightly behind for first 750 (+1), 750-1500 at target 1:50, then last 500 ramp up, with all out last 150-100.
Of course went off too fast, got to 425 way under, backed off to 500, then stuck on 1:50. Briefly flirted with 28spm which have never done before then reverted back to what I am happy with, 25/26. Hit MHR at 6 mins, but TBH wasn't looking at HR, just my pace and trying to blank off projected. At 750 to go was getting painful. 400m to go it was 10 strokes at a time. Started ramp up with 30 seconds to go and 'attacked the pain' and was able to go 1:40 for the last 10 strokes.

Anyway, new 2k PB of 7:17.6
Previous was April '19 at 7:24.2 and the only 2k attempt between then and now was is in May this year at 7:24.7

Time Meters Pace Watts Cal/Hr S/M AHR
7:17.6 2,000m 1:49.4 267 1219 26 164
1:49.6 500m 1:49.6 266 1214 25 155
1:50.7 1,000m 1:50.7 258 1187 25 163
1:50.1 1,500m 1:50.1 262 1202 26 169
1:47.2 2,000m 1:47.2 284 1277 28 172

To follow Max's example (in an Alec Guinness voice) "...this wasn't the PB I was looking for..." I had been trying for a FM PB but had aborted attempt last Sunday

To finish off, 5m rest followed by 5k @ 2:06 then actual WD back on the bike

congrats Dino! What a well earned PB! Thats a good chunk of time to take off a relatively long standing PB too. Pacing looks really strong and well controlled. Great effort! You know its hurting when you have to start counting 10's

[Dangerscouse]

Well.. since I posted it, thought might as well give it a go this evening (bit of support tape on the knee and largely ignoring it)

Target was 7:20 so after some stretching, followed the WU plan accordingly:


Found it hard to pace so low and rate up to 22/24. I also should have made a card up in large writing and stuck in next to the monitor as hard to read it on A4 paper on the floor! This is 19:45 of continuous rowing which ended up at ~4600m

Wasn't sure what to do after this, hit it straight away or do something else. So ended up jumping on my spin bike for 5 mins as had seen Cameron Buchan do this whilst he was still as Leander on one of his videos. Kept my HR around 110.
Then onto the 2K.

Plan was to be slightly behind for first 750 (+1), 750-1500 at target 1:50, then last 500 ramp up, with all out last 150-100.
Of course went off too fast, got to 425 way under, backed off to 500, then stuck on 1:50. Briefly flirted with 28spm which have never done before then reverted back to what I am happy with, 25/26. Hit MHR at 6 mins, but TBH wasn't looking at HR, just my pace and trying to blank off projected. At 750 to go was getting painful. 400m to go it was 10 strokes at a time. Started ramp up with 30 seconds to go and 'attacked the pain' and was able to go 1:40 for the last 10 strokes.

Anyway, new 2k PB of 7:17.6
Previous was April '19 at 7:24.2 and the only 2k attempt between then and now was is in May this year at 7:24.7

Time Meters Pace Watts Cal/Hr S/M AHR
7:17.6 2,000m 1:49.4 267 1219 26 164
1:49.6 500m 1:49.6 266 1214 25 155
1:50.7 1,000m 1:50.7 258 1187 25 163
1:50.1 1,500m 1:50.1 262 1202 26 169
1:47.2 2,000m 1:47.2 284 1277 28 172

To follow Max's example (in an Alec Guinness voice) "...this wasn't the PB I was looking for..." I had been trying for a FM PB but had aborted attempt last Sunday

To finish off, 5m rest followed by 5k @ 2:06 then actual WD back on the bike

Wow, Dino seven seconds is a massive improvement in a 2k. Sneaking up on a PB without any pressure building up is a better solution if you ask me.

Got to love it though, you aimed for an FM PB and ended up with a great 2k PB!

[Tandstad]

<>
Have you seen the Eddie Fletcher 2k warm up guide? Not used it myself but tucked away the guide for when I feel like going back to the 2k. Not quite sure how to use it and if each warm up section is continuous to the next one, but may be of use.

Thanks Dino,
<>
I have been vaguely aware of the EF warm-up - I've never used it, but perhaps I'll give it a shot next time I try a 2k (that pesky 1.5s!).
<>

Well.. since I posted it, thought might as well give it a go this evening (bit of support tape on the knee and largely ignoring it)

Target was 7:20 so after some stretching, followed the WU plan accordingly:


Found it hard to pace so low and rate up to 22/24. I also should have made a card up in large writing and stuck in next to the monitor as hard to read it on A4 paper on the floor! This is 19:45 of continuous rowing which ended up at ~4600m

Wasn't sure what to do after this, hit it straight away or do something else. So ended up jumping on my spin bike for 5 mins as had seen Cameron Buchan do this whilst he was still as Leander on one of his videos. Kept my HR around 110.
Then onto the 2K.

Plan was to be slightly behind for first 750 (+1), 750-1500 at target 1:50, then last 500 ramp up, with all out last 150-100.
Of course went off too fast, got to 425 way under, backed off to 500, then stuck on 1:50. Briefly flirted with 28spm which have never done before then reverted back to what I am happy with, 25/26. Hit MHR at 6 mins, but TBH wasn't looking at HR, just my pace and trying to blank off projected. At 750 to go was getting painful. 400m to go it was 10 strokes at a time. Started ramp up with 30 seconds to go and 'attacked the pain' and was able to go 1:40 for the last 10 strokes.

Anyway, new 2k PB of 7:17.6
Previous was April '19 at 7:24.2 and the only 2k attempt between then and now was is in May this year at 7:24.7

Time Meters Pace Watts Cal/Hr S/M AHR
7:17.6 2,000m 1:49.4 267 1219 26 164
1:49.6 500m 1:49.6 266 1214 25 155
1:50.7 1,000m 1:50.7 258 1187 25 163
1:50.1 1,500m 1:50.1 262 1202 26 169
1:47.2 2,000m 1:47.2 284 1277 28 172

To follow Max's example (in an Alec Guinness voice) "...this wasn't the PB I was looking for..." I had been trying for a FM PB but had aborted attempt last Sunday

To finish off, 5m rest followed by 5k @ 2:06 then actual WD back on the bike

Big congrats Dino, looks like you had a decent amount of power left to the last split, nice work indeed

[winniewinser]

<>
Have you seen the Eddie Fletcher 2k warm up guide? Not used it myself but tucked away the guide for when I feel like going back to the 2k. Not quite sure how to use it and if each warm up section is continuous to the next one, but may be of use.

Thanks Dino,
<>
I have been vaguely aware of the EF warm-up - I've never used it, but perhaps I'll give it a shot next time I try a 2k (that pesky 1.5s!).
<>

Well.. since I posted it, thought might as well give it a go this evening (bit of support tape on the knee and largely ignoring it)

Target was 7:20 so after some stretching, followed the WU plan accordingly:


Found it hard to pace so low and rate up to 22/24. I also should have made a card up in large writing and stuck in next to the monitor as hard to read it on A4 paper on the floor! This is 19:45 of continuous rowing which ended up at ~4600m

Wasn't sure what to do after this, hit it straight away or do something else. So ended up jumping on my spin bike for 5 mins as had seen Cameron Buchan do this whilst he was still as Leander on one of his videos. Kept my HR around 110.
Then onto the 2K.

Plan was to be slightly behind for first 750 (+1), 750-1500 at target 1:50, then last 500 ramp up, with all out last 150-100.
Of course went off too fast, got to 425 way under, backed off to 500, then stuck on 1:50. Briefly flirted with 28spm which have never done before then reverted back to what I am happy with, 25/26. Hit MHR at 6 mins, but TBH wasn't looking at HR, just my pace and trying to blank off projected. At 750 to go was getting painful. 400m to go it was 10 strokes at a time. Started ramp up with 30 seconds to go and 'attacked the pain' and was able to go 1:40 for the last 10 strokes.

Anyway, new 2k PB of 7:17.6
Previous was April '19 at 7:24.2 and the only 2k attempt between then and now was is in May this year at 7:24.7

Time Meters Pace Watts Cal/Hr S/M AHR
7:17.6 2,000m 1:49.4 267 1219 26 164
1:49.6 500m 1:49.6 266 1214 25 155
1:50.7 1,000m 1:50.7 258 1187 25 163
1:50.1 1,500m 1:50.1 262 1202 26 169
1:47.2 2,000m 1:47.2 284 1277 28 172

To follow Max's example (in an Alec Guinness voice) "...this wasn't the PB I was looking for..." I had been trying for a FM PB but had aborted attempt last Sunday

To finish off, 5m rest followed by 5k @ 2:06 then actual WD back on the bike

COngrats on the new 2k PB Dino!

[Soleith]

Hey guys, been rowing again for a little over 2 years after a major knee injury. Decided to do my first attempt at a 2k today so new pb!

7m 41.5s

43 years old, 6'3, 230lbs (gammy leg!)

Edit, been a while since I was here, 10k time has been bettered too, 41.13 now! On another note, the 2k killed me, pace fell off a cliff after about 3 mins.

Well done. If you can post the data of the row we may be able to help get you to go faster. If you notably slowed after three minutes then your pacing strategy could be improved to get more performance

Thanks! Yes I think definitely improvements to be made. Any suggestions gratefully received!

[hjs]

Re re 2k. A next time, start out at 155 and try to rate up a bit. Think you can better that time a good bit. At 1400m in, if possible speed up.

Nevertheless, congrats, being getter than ever before is always a great feeling

[Dangerscouse]

Thanks! Yes I think definitely improvements to be made. Any suggestions gratefully received!

As Henry says start off at 1:55 (your average pace) and then see how you go. You should be able to hold the average pace, and you won't have the added pressure of freaking out your 'inner chimp' and it telling you that you're going to die!

I'm impressed that you kept going, and didn't HD, as that's a very fast first 500m. I assume that r28 doesn't feel natural either as you lowered your rate so much as you got tired? A higher rate is preferable, but if you become inefficient then it's far better to pick what suits you and enables you to maximise your chances.

[max_ratcliffe]

<>

Wasn't sure what to do after this, hit it straight away or do something else. So ended up jumping on my spin bike for 5 mins as had seen Cameron Buchan do this whilst he was still as Leander on one of his videos. Kept my HR around 110.
Then onto the 2K.

I've been wondering about HR for a while. I tend to use it as a proxy for recovery, so wait until it's gone back to 100 or so before starting a
TT. But I'm not sure if that's right. Obviously we don't want to be coughing up a lung before beginning a TT, but my guess is high HR without fatigue is the way to go, if only we could figure out a way to make that happen.

Plan was to be slightly behind for first 750 (+1), 750-1500 at target 1:50, then last 500 ramp up, with all out last 150-100.
Of course went off too fast, got to 425 way under, backed off to 500, then stuck on 1:50. Briefly flirted with 28spm which have never done before then reverted back to what I am happy with, 25/26. Hit MHR at 6 mins, but TBH wasn't looking at HR, just my pace and trying to blank off projected. At 750 to go was getting painful. 400m to go it was 10 strokes at a time. Started ramp up with 30 seconds to go and 'attacked the pain' and was able to go 1:40 for the last 10 strokes.

Anyway, new 2k PB of 7:17.6
Previous was April '19 at 7:24.2 and the only 2k attempt between then and now was is in May this year at 7:24.7

Time Meters Pace Watts Cal/Hr S/M AHR
7:17.6 2,000m 1:49.4 267 1219 26 164
1:49.6 500m 1:49.6 266 1214 25 155
1:50.7 1,000m 1:50.7 258 1187 25 163
1:50.1 1,500m 1:50.1 262 1202 26 169
1:47.2 2,000m 1:47.2 284 1277 28 172

To follow Max's example (in an Alec Guinness voice) "...this wasn't the PB I was looking for..." I had been trying for a FM PB but had aborted attempt last Sunday

To finish off, 5m rest followed by 5k @ 2:06 then actual WD back on the bike

Very good work. Congratulations. The doubts really begin at 750, but if they don't, you're probably not going fast enough!

I can't imagine doing a 5k at 2:06 after a 2k TT. (I stumbled my way through 1k at about 2:30). Your endurance must be pretty tidy.

[max_ratcliffe]

Thanks! Yes I think definitely improvements to be made. Any suggestions gratefully received!

Well done. As Stu said, a very gutsy effort not to HD when you'd gone out so fast, as I bet you were hurting.

[max_ratcliffe]

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Max - great result! The 2km is always a daunting one. But i know think the 5km is worse..

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Great PB, well done.

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Good job Max, awesome effort

Thanks all. Still feeling a) a bit sore, and b) pleased with myself.

[max_ratcliffe]

I watched an Eric Murray youtube vid a while ago where he said something to the effect of: "you need to get your heart rate up in warm up, or your heart won't be able to keep up with the demand and you'll go anaerobic straightaway", and that made lots of sense to me.

That must be why I'm not sub 6. Obviously, that can be the only reason

Sounds about right.

I'm confident that I can challenge JDS's WR. All I need to do is to pull my current stroke at 65spm. Should be a cinch.

[KeithT]

<>
Have you seen the Eddie Fletcher 2k warm up guide? Not used it myself but tucked away the guide for when I feel like going back to the 2k. Not quite sure how to use it and if each warm up section is continuous to the next one, but may be of use.

Thanks Dino,
<>
I have been vaguely aware of the EF warm-up - I've never used it, but perhaps I'll give it a shot next time I try a 2k (that pesky 1.5s!).
<>

Well.. since I posted it, thought might as well give it a go this evening (bit of support tape on the knee and largely ignoring it)

Target was 7:20 so after some stretching, followed the WU plan accordingly:


Found it hard to pace so low and rate up to 22/24. I also should have made a card up in large writing and stuck in next to the monitor as hard to read it on A4 paper on the floor! This is 19:45 of continuous rowing which ended up at ~4600m

Wasn't sure what to do after this, hit it straight away or do something else. So ended up jumping on my spin bike for 5 mins as had seen Cameron Buchan do this whilst he was still as Leander on one of his videos. Kept my HR around 110.
Then onto the 2K.

Plan was to be slightly behind for first 750 (+1), 750-1500 at target 1:50, then last 500 ramp up, with all out last 150-100.
Of course went off too fast, got to 425 way under, backed off to 500, then stuck on 1:50. Briefly flirted with 28spm which have never done before then reverted back to what I am happy with, 25/26. Hit MHR at 6 mins, but TBH wasn't looking at HR, just my pace and trying to blank off projected. At 750 to go was getting painful. 400m to go it was 10 strokes at a time. Started ramp up with 30 seconds to go and 'attacked the pain' and was able to go 1:40 for the last 10 strokes.

Anyway, new 2k PB of 7:17.6
Previous was April '19 at 7:24.2 and the only 2k attempt between then and now was is in May this year at 7:24.7

Time Meters Pace Watts Cal/Hr S/M AHR
7:17.6 2,000m 1:49.4 267 1219 26 164
1:49.6 500m 1:49.6 266 1214 25 155
1:50.7 1,000m 1:50.7 258 1187 25 163
1:50.1 1,500m 1:50.1 262 1202 26 169
1:47.2 2,000m 1:47.2 284 1277 28 172

To follow Max's example (in an Alec Guinness voice) "...this wasn't the PB I was looking for..." I had been trying for a FM PB but had aborted attempt last Sunday

To finish off, 5m rest followed by 5k @ 2:06 then actual WD back on the bike

First, great PB with a big reduction in time!!! Looks like you fought the mind games well and pushed thru with some left in the tank at the end. Glad you tried the EF warmup and with some success. I have the warmup stored for use but never have tried it as I always have been "afraid" to use up too much energy. I know that is incorrect thinking but I have never done long warmups. I really need to try it.

[Soleith]

Thanks! Yes I think definitely improvements to be made. Any suggestions gratefully received!

As Henry says start off at 1:55 (your average pace) and then see how you go. You should be able to hold the average pace, and you won't have the added pressure of freaking out your 'inner chimp' and it telling you that you're going to die!

I'm impressed that you kept going, and didn't HD, as that's a very fast first 500m. I assume that r28 doesn't feel natural either as you lowered your rate so much as you got tired? A higher rate is preferable, but if you become inefficient then it's far better to pick what suits you and enables you to maximise your chances.

Thanks for the feedback all. Yeah, inner chimp was definitely screaming! HD was tempting but managed to resist. Breathing was really difficult at that point though.

R28 is definitely not natural for me, this is the shortest row I've done since I started again a couple of years ago and I tend to do 10 or 15k rows at somewhere around r23. Will probably do a 10 or 15k tomorrow and try for a 2k time again next week, starting at around 1.55.

[Dino]

congrats Dino! What a well earned PB! Thats a good chunk of time to take off a relatively long standing PB too. Pacing looks really strong and well controlled. Great effort! You know its hurting when you have to start counting 10's

Wow, Dino seven seconds is a massive improvement in a 2k. Sneaking up on a PB without any pressure building up is a better solution if you ask me.
Got to love it though, you aimed for an FM PB and ended up with a great 2k PB!

Big congrats Dino, looks like you had a decent amount of power left to the last split, nice work indeed

Congrats on the new 2k PB Dino!

I've been wondering about HR for a while. I tend to use it as a proxy for recovery, so wait until it's gone back to 100 or so before starting a
TT. But I'm not sure if that's right. Obviously we don't want to be coughing up a lung before beginning a TT, but my guess is high HR without fatigue is the way to go, if only we could figure out a way to make that happen.
<>
Very good work. Congratulations. The doubts really begin at 750, but if they don't, you're probably not going fast enough!
I can't imagine doing a 5k at 2:06 after a 2k TT. (I stumbled my way through 1k at about 2:30). Your endurance must be pretty tidy.

First, great PB with a big reduction in time!!! Looks like you fought the mind games well and pushed thru with some left in the tank at the end. Glad you tried the EF warmup and with some success. I have the warmup stored for use but never have tried it as I always have been "afraid" to use up too much energy. I know that is incorrect thinking but I have never done long warmups. I really need to try it.

Thanks all. Yes it was quite an old PB, I probably should have taken care of it sooner. Its amazing what a few months of 300k+ can do
Just a bit of a difference to the FM PB I was hoping to tick off this month!!
I need to sort out the 1st 500 else it generally went to plan. It also showed that my MHR of 172 is probably correct as looking at Logbook it hit this at 6 mins and it wavered at 171/172 from then on.

Although I haven't been doing any sprint / short-distance work (apart from one attempt at 8x500 and one at 6x1000) my steady state on Zwift often has sprints built in... e.g. Monday group 'row' was 7 laps of the Richmond course and every lap there was a balls to the wall all out sprint. Quite short but an absolute max effort... (500W or 1:30ish for me was absolute limit) followed by a wheezing recovery and keeping the wheels to carry on - total ride on Monday was just over an hour. Also when I get dropped I really have to put the foot down as once you drop out of the draft its tough to get back on - so although to look at my average hour on Zwift is normally 14000 to 14200 it doesn't tell the full story.

Keith - the EF warm-up worked very well and will use it next time. I'd recommend giving it a go. It's quite benign but does the job and beats trying to think of what to do yourself. I think my max HR during the WU was around 146 (out of 172 MHR). It didn't tire me out but everything was flowing nicely. As the chart is just a snippet I expect from a proper program doc, then I was unsure what to do after the WU... hence I did the 5 min spin bike to just keep things ticking over - and get ready to hit it. Just make sure you write it down in big letters so you can read it whilst rowing!

Max - yeah I seem to recover quite quickly although the last 1k of the 5 did bite a bit but I had already set myself 21mins to do it in so couldn't welch on the deal!! Race you to 7:15? ..although I am in long distance mode I am tempted to give it another go before end of the season - i.e. not leave it another 18 months!

[Dino]

Thanks! Yes I think definitely improvements to be made. Any suggestions gratefully received!

As Henry says start off at 1:55 (your average pace) and then see how you go. You should be able to hold the average pace, and you won't have the added pressure of freaking out your 'inner chimp' and it telling you that you're going to die!

I'm impressed that you kept going, and didn't HD, as that's a very fast first 500m. I assume that r28 doesn't feel natural either as you lowered your rate so much as you got tired? A higher rate is preferable, but if you become inefficient then it's far better to pick what suits you and enables you to maximise your chances.

Thanks for the feedback all. Yeah, inner chimp was definitely screaming! HD was tempting but managed to resist. Breathing was really difficult at that point though.

R28 is definitely not natural for me, this is the shortest row I've done since I started again a couple of years ago and I tend to do 10 or 15k rows at somewhere around r23. Will probably do a 10 or 15k tomorrow and try for a 2k time again next week, starting at around 1.55.

Congrats on the 2K! Having just done one myself, know they are a tough session.
Others have given plenty of advice... graph looks like classic 'fly and die' which I am sure we have all been guilty of at one time or another. Now you have a line in the sand, you'll be able to plan the next one. As Dangerscouse said, your rate is what you feel comfortable with. I struggle with higher rates too - and averaged 26 last night which is quite low for a 2k TT.

This link is quite a good intro to the 2K. This video is worth a watch too.