New Personal Best! Brag About That New Pb!

[Huopaaja]

Thanks guys, I think I'm going to scrap that strategy.
It didn't really work for me on the 4min TT either, where the first minute was fastest (even if only about 1 sec below avg pace and only due to the first 20 seconds) and I found myself out of breath by the middle.

[winniewinser]

Regarding Ron's TT, what's the forum's verdict on 2k pacing?

I mean especially the initial dash off the gate as suggested my many pundits (for instance Dark Horse and Rowing WOD guy), where the first 10-20 strokes are done almost as a sprint at a clearly faster-than-average pace... This could add up to 200-250 meters or so, which is sure to skew the average pace for the first split, even if you drop the pace to below target for the remainder of the split.

Let's say, with a target time of 6:40, you'd do about 1:35 for first 250m, followed by 1:41-42 between 250-1000m, about 1:40 between 1000-1500m, below 1:40 between 1500-1750m and then sprint to the finish at 1:3x.

Does this work in practice or would it be safer to have just a couple of hard strokes to accelerate to 1:41 and keep it there until the second half?

That's normally how mine pan out but not by design....more by the lack of ability not to bold like a greyhound and then realise I can't keep that up!

[philjoakley]

7907m in 30 minutes.

Have set my season's target at 8000m so am reasonably happy with this. Not doing as much rowing as last season. Am currently rowing 3 times a week doing 30 mins, 4x6 mins 4R and 3 x 4mins 3R. Also doing about 4 hours a week cycling and a couple of hours hill walking on the treadmill so CV fitness is fairly good.

Still enjoying the Concept 2 above all else.

Welcome back Phil, and great work with the PB.

Thanks Max. Hope all is going well.

[max_ratcliffe]

Regarding Ron's TT, what's the forum's verdict on 2k pacing?

I mean especially the initial dash off the gate as suggested my many pundits (for instance Dark Horse and Rowing WOD guy), where the first 10-20 strokes are done almost as a sprint at a clearly faster-than-average pace... This could add up to 200-250 meters or so, which is sure to skew the average pace for the first split, even if you drop the pace to below target for the remainder of the split.

Let's say, with a target time of 6:40, you'd do about 1:35 for first 250m, followed by 1:41-42 between 250-1000m, about 1:40 between 1000-1500m, below 1:40 between 1500-1750m and then sprint to the finish at 1:3x.

Does this work in practice or would it be safer to have just a couple of hard strokes to accelerate to 1:41 and keep it there until the second half?

Physically the least energy output is a constant pace because of the cubic rule, and I think I've read that a small negative split is optimal physiologically .

I would always go with Henry's advice, and I think Stu's comment about the mental side of things is also very relevant.

I'm going to get the following very wrong, but it might give you a few points for googling.

Physiologically, the "free" energy you get at the start is the ATP-CP and it doesn't produce lactate. It last only 12-15s, though, so it would be well exhausted by the 47s ish it would to take to do the first 250m. Then you'd be producing lactate, and it'd probably start to hurt much earlier than it would without the sprint start.

Now that said, JDS front-loaded his 2k WR and I seem to remember reading him saying somewhere that he was happy with building up lots of lactate. Someone else can explain why that is a good idea, but it obviously worked for him.

[rtbrouwer]

Regarding Ron's TT, what's the forum's verdict on 2k pacing?

I mean especially the initial dash off the gate as suggested my many pundits (for instance Dark Horse and Rowing WOD guy), where the first 10-20 strokes are done almost as a sprint at a clearly faster-than-average pace... This could add up to 200-250 meters or so, which is sure to skew the average pace for the first split, even if you drop the pace to below target for the remainder of the split.

Let's say, with a target time of 6:40, you'd do about 1:35 for first 250m, followed by 1:41-42 between 250-1000m, about 1:40 between 1000-1500m, below 1:40 between 1500-1750m and then sprint to the finish at 1:3x.

Does this work in practice or would it be safer to have just a couple of hard strokes to accelerate to 1:41 and keep it there until the second half?

I've been reflecting quite a lot and looked at some old data from my cycling and running days. I noticed that I have always used this kind of pacing. Also with running races and even with cycling TT's I like to take massive advantage of that initial "off the line" adrenaline and my first K is ussually the fastest, both in running and cycling. When I feel like I am entering the pain cave (I like it there a lot ) it helps me to know that I am ahead of my schedule and that I can actually lose some time on my projected pace. I keep that up untill the finish comes into sight. Then I start upping the pace and end with about the same pace that I set off on.

Physically not the best strategy because theory says a flat pace is always best. But there is a huge mental side to sports as well and this seems to work well for me and to be honest, I think I'll stick to it!

On this particular 2k TT I think I should have stuck to 1:43 for the 3rd quarter but it was hard to feel where I stand because i've been rowing more then ever. I know I could easilly beat my old PR but had no idea where the limit was..... guess now I know!

[hjs]

Difference between cycling and rowing is with cycling you don,t stop much if you start fading powerwise. With rowing not so, stop for 5 seconds and you lost half your speed. Op the bike you hardly notice that.

[rtbrouwer]

Difference between cycling and rowing is with cycling you don,t stop much if you start fading powerwise. With rowing not so, stop for 5 seconds and you lost half your speed. Op the bike you hardly notice that.

You are right. In cycling you can always get some "rest time" during races. Especially in the peleton but even in TT's. You stop paddeling for corners. Road is seldom flat so on the downward stretches you have at least some let-up. In rowing it is just like a stationary bike. Just produce constant watts. Much more difficult!

[Tandstad]

Need some more volume in my training to be hitting big numbers on the difficult(for me) 60 minute distance, but after the failed(HD) attempt on the half marathon 2 days ago, I will settle with this for now

Good feeling overall, minimal numbness in butt and legs

16672 - 1:47.9 - rate 27 - avg HR 162

[MartinSH4321]

Need some more volume in my training to be hitting big numbers on the difficult(for me) 60 minute distance, but after the failed(HD) attempt on the half marathon 2 days ago, I will settle with this for now

Good feeling overall, minimal numbness in butt and legs

16672 - 1:47.9 - rate 27 - avg HR 162

Well done Jo Andre, a very strong result! With some practise for the longer rows your score will be even more impressive

[Tandstad]

7907m in 30 minutes.

Have set my season's target at 8000m so am reasonably happy with this. Not doing as much rowing as last season. Am currently rowing 3 times a week doing 30 mins, 4x6 mins 4R and 3 x 4mins 3R. Also doing about 4 hours a week cycling and a couple of hours hill walking on the treadmill so CV fitness is fairly good.

Still enjoying the Concept 2 above all else.

Good job, 8k definitely within reach soon

[Dangerscouse]

Need some more volume in my training to be hitting big numbers on the difficult(for me) 60 minute distance, but after the failed(HD) attempt on the half marathon 2 days ago, I will settle with this for now

Good feeling overall, minimal numbness in butt and legs

16672 - 1:47.9 - rate 27 - avg HR 162

This sort of session is exactly what you need to prepare for the HM. Really impressive hour of power

[rtbrouwer]

Need some more volume in my training to be hitting big numbers on the difficult(for me) 60 minute distance, but after the failed(HD) attempt on the half marathon 2 days ago, I will settle with this for now

Good feeling overall, minimal numbness in butt and legs

16672 - 1:47.9 - rate 27 - avg HR 162

Wow. Congrats. Big numbers man!

[DavidA]

Well, I have always said if it's your first time its a PB. Did my first ever FM today and I am pretty stoked. I have also said I have never done a workout with a pace over 2:00 so secretly I had this as a goal. First goal was to finish but wanted to really test myself and......

FM at 2:47:46.6.....a 1:59.2 pace!!!!

It was the best test of my physical and mental capacities I have had including all my CF stuff. Was so different than a shorter test. I wanted to HD a few times but followed my plan and had a cushion and knew I just needed to hang on. Towards the end I resisted the temptation to go faster as I was so set on making sure
I didn't freeze up until last 100m where I pulled n the 1:40s. Could write paragraphs about it but still trying to recover. Lots of blisters and behind in pain but worth it.

Maybe I'm not a sprinter

Come get it Stu!

Congratulations!
That is a great pace for a marathon!

David

[DavidA]

New HOP PR and American 30-39 HW record

17,599m
1:42.2

Waiting for C2 to list it as the new record

Edit:

Here's how my 5' splits compare to my previous PR from 2018:

2018 5 minute splits: ================ 2020 5' splits:
1:45.1 ================ 1:43.0
1:45.0 ================ 1:42.9
1:44.8 ================ 1:42.9
1:44.6 ================ 1:42.8
1:44.7 ================ 1:42.8
1:44.6 ================ 1:42.8
1:44.6 ================ 1:42.8
1:44.6 ================ 1:42.8
1:43.9 ================ 1:42.3
1:44.0 ================ 1:42.1
1:42.8 ================ 1:41.2
1:40.0 ================ 1:38.4

WOW!
Congratulations!

David

[Tandstad]

Need some more volume in my training to be hitting big numbers on the difficult(for me) 60 minute distance, but after the failed(HD) attempt on the half marathon 2 days ago, I will settle with this for now

Good feeling overall, minimal numbness in butt and legs

16672 - 1:47.9 - rate 27 - avg HR 162

Well done Jo Andre, a very strong result! With some practise for the longer rows your score will be even more impressive

Thanks a lot Martin, yeah unless anything changes drastically, I want to be closing in on 17k towards the end of this season. With fresh feet I could optimally go into the 167xx now(also the pace calculator indicates this), so need to improve by about 300 meters, which should be possible. Will you do any work on your 60' the coming season?

Need some more volume in my training to be hitting big numbers on the difficult(for me) 60 minute distance, but after the failed(HD) attempt on the half marathon 2 days ago, I will settle with this for now

Good feeling overall, minimal numbness in butt and legs

16672 - 1:47.9 - rate 27 - avg HR 162

This sort of session is exactly what you need to prepare for the HM. Really impressive hour of power

Thanks a lot Stu, yeah I am starting to like the 60 minutes sessions more now that my body(butt and legs) doesn't falls asleep after 40 minutes anymore

Need some more volume in my training to be hitting big numbers on the difficult(for me) 60 minute distance, but after the failed(HD) attempt on the half marathon 2 days ago, I will settle with this for now

Good feeling overall, minimal numbness in butt and legs

16672 - 1:47.9 - rate 27 - avg HR 162

Wow. Congrats. Big numbers man!

Thanks a lot rtbrouwer, much appreciated More to come!