Looking For Training Partner

[old] starboardrigged1seat · Post by **[old] starboardrigged1seat** » February 25th, 2005, 8:56 pm

I'd agree that both pasta and rice can be good fuels for athletes, however, I'd stay away from white rice and pasta with refined flour. Try for whole wheat pasta and brown rice. Additionally, I'd say that we've completely derailed this thread from its original purpose. John -- oatmeal has a lower glycemic index than pasta. That means it gets absorbed into your blood stream slower, and keeps you "fuller" longer. The fat has something to do with that. Besides, training athletes need a healthy amount of fat -- more fat than a sedetary person. New research is showing that "good" fats, such as the fats found in olive oil, wheat, hemp, flax, and fish, actually help people lose weight. Diets such as the South Beach Diet take advantage of this. John -- try this experiment...have a plain bagel one morning, then the next day, have half a bagel, but spread it with peanut butter (natural if possible), and see how you feel. I bet you'll feel both fuller and have more energy after eating the bagel with PB.

[old] pamcnm · Post by **[old] pamcnm** » February 25th, 2005, 11:28 pm

Oatmeal is conssidered a nutritous, low gylcemic carb (the old fashioned variety or irish oats, not the instant variety) Also, oatmeal is not 17% fat. 1 c. of cooked, old fashioned otameal contains 2g fat (4%) Oatmeal as also been found to contribute to favorable blood lipid levels. As for protein supplements, some people do well without them, but I find one mini-meal a day of a whey protein powder containing shake helps me get my required amount of protein, without consuming excess calories.

[old] John Rupp · Post by **[old] John Rupp** » February 25th, 2005, 11:57 pm

Starboard, I agree if you want to feel full a long time and don't care about losing weight, then go ahead and eat a lot of fat. However if you want to lose weight and be healthy then you have to cut down the fat in your diet. Replacing bad fat with a lot of olive oil etc is a pallative and won't do much except make your doctor happy when you keep getting sick. By the way I do ground up flax seeds now and then and add them to long grain rice with picante sauce, but I don't have a lot of it and don't have any problem losing weight. I would never recommend having a lot of ANY fat when you are trying to lose fat and lose weight. To do otherwise would be a very bad idea. In regards to fish, again make sure it's low fat. Fish like sole and cod are good. Avoid canned tuna as it is very high in mercury. By the way some bagels are as high as 50% calories from fat. Also some of them are full of benzene. Read the labels. Peanut butter is also extremely high in fat. But then you're not trying to lose weight. The topic of the thread is more in line with losing it.

[old] John Rupp · Post by **[old] John Rupp** » February 26th, 2005, 12:10 am

Pam, People often make the mistake of counting grams of fat instead of calories from fat. The food industry encourages that but it is grossly misleading. I happen to have a package of old fashioned quaker oats right here which is: 3 grams of fat and 150 calories per serving As you probably know, each gram of fat is 9 calories so this is 27 calories of fat. 27 / 150 = 18% calories from fat You're right. It's not 17% fat. It's 18% fat. I would also agree it contributes to blood lipid (fat) levels. But - isn't that what you're trying to reduce???? Long grain white rice is less than 1% of calories from fat.

[old] starboardrigged1seat · Post by **[old] starboardrigged1seat** » February 26th, 2005, 3:51 am

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(John Rupp @ Feb 25 2005, 10:57 PM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>Starboard, I agree if you want to feel full a long time and don't care about losing weight, then go ahead and eat a lot of fat. However if you want to lose weight and be healthy then you have to cut down the fat in your diet. Replacing bad fat with a lot of olive oil etc is a pallative and won't do much except make your doctor happy when you keep getting sick.[right] </td></tr></table> If you feel full for a long time, your less likely to overeat at meals. Although you posses incredible intestinal fortitude, not many people are able to apply the stringent standards you are, and rely on measures such as "hunger" and "appetite". Edited for accuracy in quote.

[old] DIESEL · Post by **[old] DIESEL** » February 26th, 2005, 5:14 pm

John, the fact that you are actually saying that white rice and pasta are better carb choices than oatmeal is absolutely ludicrous. your complete ignorance at how carb choice affect insulin levels and thus affect how that carb activates fat storage is also shocking. Study this interaction and then explain to me why whole oats are a worse carb choice than pasta (which is usually made from refined flour). fat is not your enemy. refined carbs like those found in white rice and pasta are. If you're on a diet you should avoid them like the plague. Your rice diet you mentioned is garbage given what we know now about training and nutrition. You are citing some hokey book from the early 70's !! How many calories did that diet include. by my count, less than 1000 - not healthy - It was so low you could eat an equivalent amount of snickers bars and still lose the same amount of weight.

[old] starboardrigged1seat · Post by **[old] starboardrigged1seat** » February 26th, 2005, 7:59 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(DIESEL @ Feb 26 2005, 04:14 PM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>You are citing some hokey book from the early 70's !! How many calories did that diet include. by my count, less than 1000 - not healthy - It was so low you could eat an equivalent amount of snickers bars and still lose the same amount of weight. </td></tr></table> Hmmmmmm...I could easily pack down 1,000 calories of Snickers bars right now.

[old] John Rupp · Post by **[old] John Rupp** » February 26th, 2005, 9:02 pm

Diesel (why do you shout your name), Long grain white rice is just as nutritious as brown rice, the only difference is the hull which doesn't have much nutrition in it either. And if you want the hull for fiber than perhaps just chew a few branches? Personally I prefer chopped veggies, which have the highest mineral content and are the healthiest of any foods you can eat. Yes, long grain white rice is a superior food choice to oatmeal. Long grain white rice is less than 1% of calories from fat. As has been shown earlier, rolled oats have 18% of it's calories from fat! Why would you want more fat if you are trying to lose weight or become fitter??? No one would, unless you don't care about such things. How do you think that 18% fat got in the oats? Maybe it's there naturally. But then maybe they added trans fat during processing for preservative. Do you know? What about all the chemicals sprayed on the machinery to maintain it and which get mixed in with the oats before packaging? And what about the metal that gets on the oats from the rollers? Are you totally unaware of these things or don't care? Yes pasta is processed quite a bit. So are oats. However, pasta has less fat than rolled oats and in my opinion is a safer and healthier food choice (see above). When I got measured I was 5% body fat at your age. What body fat are you? How much do you weigh? Are you lighter than me? You say "fat is not your enemy". Well Diesel, this shows YOUR ignorance. My total cholesterol is 123. What is yours? My blood pressure is 96/60. What is yours? The fact is that Norman Walker who wrote the earliest book I mentioned lived to be 115 years of age! By the way some doctors told him, in his 20's, to get his affairs in order as he had only a few weeks to live and would be lucky to finish the month. So I know what I"m talking about, but you don't. Enjoy your snickers bar. By the way, snickers bars are high in caffeine, which depletes and throws your adrenals out of whack, upsets your thyroid hormones, hardens your arteries, and increases your blood pressure, as well as overstimulating your body and wearing out your nervous system. Long grain rice does not contain any caffeine.

[old] starboardrigged1seat · Post by **[old] starboardrigged1seat** » February 26th, 2005, 9:05 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(John Rupp @ Feb 26 2005, 08:02 PM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'> Enjoy your snickers bar. By the way, snickers bars are high in caffeine, which depletes and throws your adrenals out of whack, upsets your thyroid hormones, hardens your arteries, and increases your blood pressure, as well as overstimulating your body and wearing out your nervous system. </td></tr></table> But they taste sooooooooo good!

[old] whp4 · Post by **[old] whp4** » February 26th, 2005, 9:18 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(John Rupp @ Feb 27 2005, 01:02 AM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>Enjoy your snickers bar. By the way, snickers bars are high in caffeine, which depletes and throws your adrenals out of whack, upsets your thyroid hormones, hardens your arteries, and increases your blood pressure, as well as overstimulating your body and wearing out your nervous system.[right] </td></tr></table> As usual, you get some portion of the truth and bend it completely out of shape. About the only part you got right here is that there is in fact some caffeine in a Snickers bar. Fact: a Snickers bar has 5mg of caffeine in the typical 2 oz size. <a href='http://www.calorie-count.com/calories/i ... m_id=19155' target='_blank'>How much caffeine in a Snickers bar, from calorie count.com</a> Fact: just about any caffeinated beverage has much more caffeine than a Snickers bar. Coke Classic: 34.0 mg/12oz Dr. Pepper: 41.0 mg/12oz drip coffee: 115-175 mg/8oz iced tea: 47 mg/8oz hot cocoa: 14 mg/8oz decaf coffee, brewed: 3-4mg/8oz <a href='http://wilstar.com/caffeine.htm' target='_blank'>Caffeine content of various beverages</a> Conclusion: if you chose to buy into John's alarmist views about caffeine, worry more about what you drink.

[old] pamcnm · Post by **[old] pamcnm** » February 27th, 2005, 8:17 pm

John, I am not sure you understand how to correctly interpret the information on a nutrition label. Oatmeal is not a high fat food, and does not contain 18% fat. Also, if you read my post more carefully, you will see that I wrote oatmeal is known to contribute to a favorable lipid profile. That is something that I do actually desire, and should not be confused with high lipids. For the record, Diesel is correct that the most current research is now showing that lowfat diets are not healthy. Most of us do best on a diet with 20-30% fat, with the bulk of the fat coming from fat monosaturated sources of fat such as olives, nuts, avocados, etc. Trans fats should be avoided like the plaque. You are correct about many fatty fish containing high levels of mercury. This does not mean the fat from the fish is bad for us, but that eating the fish can be bad for us due to pollution. Pollutants are often stored in animal fat, so this can be a problem the higher you eat on the food chain. BTW, did the original poster ever find a workout buddy???

[old] John Rupp · Post by **[old] John Rupp** » February 27th, 2005, 9:59 pm

Pamela, Oatmeal is 18% calories from fat and it says so right on the label. You are welcome to interpret that how you wish. Anyway if you think 30-40% fat is good then oatmeal will be no problem for you.

[old] DIESEL · Post by **[old] DIESEL** » February 27th, 2005, 10:22 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(John Rupp @ Feb 26 2005, 08:02 PM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>Diesel (why do you shout your name), Long grain white rice is just as nutritious as brown rice, the only difference is the hull which doesn't have much nutrition in it either. And if you want the hull for fiber than perhaps just chew a few branches? Personally I prefer chopped veggies, which have the highest mineral content and are the healthiest of any foods you can eat. Yes, long grain white rice is a superior food choice to oatmeal. Long grain white rice is less than 1% of calories from fat. As has been shown earlier, rolled oats have 18% of it's calories from fat! Why would you want more fat if you are trying to lose weight or become fitter??? No one would, unless you don't care about such things. How do you think that 18% fat got in the oats? Maybe it's there naturally. But then maybe they added trans fat during processing for preservative. Do you know? What about all the chemicals sprayed on the machinery to maintain it and which get mixed in with the oats before packaging? And what about the metal that gets on the oats from the rollers? Are you totally unaware of these things or don't care? Yes pasta is processed quite a bit. So are oats. However, pasta has less fat than rolled oats and in my opinion is a safer and healthier food choice (see above). When I got measured I was 5% body fat at your age. What body fat are you? How much do you weigh? Are you lighter than me? You say "fat is not your enemy". Well Diesel, this shows YOUR ignorance. My total cholesterol is 123. What is yours? My blood pressure is 96/60. What is yours? The fact is that Norman Walker who wrote the earliest book I mentioned lived to be 115 years of age! By the way some doctors told him, in his 20's, to get his affairs in order as he had only a few weeks to live and would be lucky to finish the month. So I know what I"m talking about, but you don't. Enjoy your snickers bar. By the way, snickers bars are high in caffeine, which depletes and throws your adrenals out of whack, upsets your thyroid hormones, hardens your arteries, and increases your blood pressure, as well as overstimulating your body and wearing out your nervous system. Long grain rice does not contain any caffeine. </td></tr></table> Hey John, listen, bro, eat all the white rice you want. I'm not getting sucked into the logical black hole you call an "argument" - we're not going to change our minds, are we? probably not. Anyway, I like and eat white rice, but I eat oatmeal too. However, for training purposes Oatmeal is a better source for sustained energy release... why? it has some fat and a lower glycemic index. keep on being stuck in your 70's high carb/ no fat diet. If it works for you, great - but it's UNBALANCED - that's why you weigh 130 lbs. Like anything in life fats are necessary to a healthy diet. Debate all you want, but like a lot of stuff you'll post here - it's wrong. Nor do I need to go an start a pissing match by comparing health stats, if I weighed less than you at 6'4 that wouldn't be good... and no fat is not your enemy - please explain why the Mediterranean diet is so good for you then, genius. Pretty fat-laden to me. Refined carbs + saturated fats are your enemy. Not fats or carbs in isolation, per se. You shouldn't be some "health nazi" and say all fat is your enemy - that is ludicrous. peace, D p.s. I never really figured I was screaming my name.. I guess I am, my bad. p.s. 2 - you shouldn't be so literal - the snickers bar comment was rhetorical - i.e. the reason your rice diet worked isn't because of its nutritional value, per se but because it's so low in calories, the glycemic index of white rice is so high - that to the body it might as well be a snickers bar - it'll have much the same insulin spiking effect. but if you only eat less than 1000 calories a day of anything rice or snickers bars - you're going to lose weight. period.

[old] John Rupp · Post by **[old] John Rupp** » February 27th, 2005, 10:50 pm

Diesel, Like I said before, if you and Pam want to eat 40% fat and convince yourselves that is healthy then have at it. Okay?

It's not an argument on my part cause I'm right, and it's not an argument for you unless you disagree with me. So, no problems okay.

[old] Coach Gus · Post by **[old] Coach Gus** » February 27th, 2005, 11:25 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(John Rupp @ Feb 27 2005, 05:59 PM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>Oatmeal is 18% calories from fat and it says so right on the label. </td></tr></table> I usually stay out of the John Rupp discussions as he doesn't make much sense to me almost all of the time. However, his claim that 18% of the calories in oatmeal are from fat piqued my curiosity. So, I got my container of Old Fashioned Oats and the label says a serving is 150 calories with 25 of those calories from fat. 25/150 = 16.666666% While JR is not completely correct at 18%, he's pretty close. This surprised me, both him being almost right and that the figure was so high.