[In]decent Intervals
- NavigationHazard
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Re: [In]decent Intervals
30 x 1' r20 on 30" this afternoon, average 1:47.0. I couldn't run ErgData as my phone was out of juice and I had no charger with me....
67 MH 6' 6"
Re: [In]decent Intervals
Funny how your consistent split is at the 1:46.7 - just riding that upper edge of the split without quite getting there.NavigationHazard wrote: ↑March 21st, 2019, 1:02 pm30 x 1' r20 on 30" this afternoon, average 1:47.0. I couldn't run ErgData as my phone was out of juice and I had no charger with me....
Roughly what training band does that heart rate put you at? Very consistent as well.
32M 5'7" 170LBs
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- NavigationHazard
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Re: [In]decent Intervals
I got to a 140 bpm finish on rep 5. A 160 bpm finish on rep 20. Subjectively, from feel, I would be inclined to rate the first 29 reps as sub-threshold and the last one as threshold or above. The first 15 or so felt like UT2 and the remainder mostly felt like UT1. But there's no easy answer to your question about training bands, since:
1) On this sort of workout, HR actually tends to peak during the nominal rests, while you're not actually rowing. There's a lag in your cardiovascular response to demand, for one thing. For another, once you're soaked-sweaty, the combination of air coming out of the fan housing and the cooling effects of you moving back and forth through the air tends to help your temperature control while you're rowing as opposed to while you're resting. Moreover, do enough constant-effort intervals at enough effort and HR will more or less flatten out. You stay much the same whether you're rowing or whether you're nominally resting. A few days ago, for example, I ended rep 6 of a similar 1' r20/30" workout at 140 bpm. I started rep 7 at 141 bpm, and ended it at 145 bpm. I started rep 8 at 142 bpm, etc. etc.;
2) On this sort of workout, you typically progress through a number of nominal HR bands. How long you stay in any one of them depends on how many you're doing, how consistent your effort is (including stroke-to-stroke consistency, not just overall pace/rate from one interval to the next), hydration levels (especially if you're drinking during some of the rest intervals), ambient temperature/humidity and air flow, etc.;
3) I have no real idea what my factual maximum HR these days is. I would be inclined to think maybe 175 bpm, except that the other day I was getting readings up to 203 bpm during a CTC attempt. So whether or not you're defining things in terms of % of MHR or HRR, there's still a considerable difference depending on which max value factors into the calculations,
1) On this sort of workout, HR actually tends to peak during the nominal rests, while you're not actually rowing. There's a lag in your cardiovascular response to demand, for one thing. For another, once you're soaked-sweaty, the combination of air coming out of the fan housing and the cooling effects of you moving back and forth through the air tends to help your temperature control while you're rowing as opposed to while you're resting. Moreover, do enough constant-effort intervals at enough effort and HR will more or less flatten out. You stay much the same whether you're rowing or whether you're nominally resting. A few days ago, for example, I ended rep 6 of a similar 1' r20/30" workout at 140 bpm. I started rep 7 at 141 bpm, and ended it at 145 bpm. I started rep 8 at 142 bpm, etc. etc.;
2) On this sort of workout, you typically progress through a number of nominal HR bands. How long you stay in any one of them depends on how many you're doing, how consistent your effort is (including stroke-to-stroke consistency, not just overall pace/rate from one interval to the next), hydration levels (especially if you're drinking during some of the rest intervals), ambient temperature/humidity and air flow, etc.;
3) I have no real idea what my factual maximum HR these days is. I would be inclined to think maybe 175 bpm, except that the other day I was getting readings up to 203 bpm during a CTC attempt. So whether or not you're defining things in terms of % of MHR or HRR, there's still a considerable difference depending on which max value factors into the calculations,
67 MH 6' 6"
- NavigationHazard
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Re: [In]decent Intervals
Here is the ErgData graph for the interval from 3/16 cited above. Note the essentially flat HR during the work interval; as I've said, it would have looked roughly the same during the rests on either side as well....
67 MH 6' 6"
Re: [In]decent Intervals
This makes sense. Heart rate is playing catchup with your previous interval, while you're resting. Sometimes I have to remind myself that our heart rate changes are a response to work output, rather than a direct correlation of current output.NavigationHazard wrote: ↑March 21st, 2019, 4:15 pmI got to a 140 bpm finish on rep 5. A 160 bpm finish on rep 20. Subjectively, from feel, I would be inclined to rate the first 29 reps as sub-threshold and the last one as threshold or above. The first 15 or so felt like UT2 and the remainder mostly felt like UT1. But there's no easy answer to your question about training bands, since:
1) On this sort of workout, HR actually tends to peak during the nominal rests, while you're not actually rowing. There's a lag in your cardiovascular response to demand, for one thing. For another, once you're soaked-sweaty, the combination of air coming out of the fan housing and the cooling effects of you moving back and forth through the air tends to help your temperature control while you're rowing as opposed to while you're resting. Moreover, do enough constant-effort intervals at enough effort and HR will more or less flatten out. You stay much the same whether you're rowing or whether you're nominally resting. A few days ago, for example, I ended rep 6 of a similar 1' r20/30" workout at 140 bpm. I started rep 7 at 141 bpm, and ended it at 145 bpm. I started rep 8 at 142 bpm, etc. etc.;
2) On this sort of workout, you typically progress through a number of nominal HR bands. How long you stay in any one of them depends on how many you're doing, how consistent your effort is (including stroke-to-stroke consistency, not just overall pace/rate from one interval to the next), hydration levels (especially if you're drinking during some of the rest intervals), ambient temperature/humidity and air flow, etc.;
3) I have no real idea what my factual maximum HR these days is. I would be inclined to think maybe 175 bpm, except that the other day I was getting readings up to 203 bpm during a CTC attempt. So whether or not you're defining things in terms of % of MHR or HRR, there's still a considerable difference depending on which max value factors into the calculations,
32M 5'7" 170LBs
https://log.concept2.com/profile/1086130/log
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- NavigationHazard
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Re: [In]decent Intervals
3/22 Team Oarsome March Challenge -- 1k. I did it r20 per the PM5, r21 per ErgData. Dividing factual elapsed time by factual stroke count, rating works out to 20.47 spm (which in a normal world should round off to 20).
I can assure you that this was a lot harder than the HR data might suggest. The low rating helps to hold HR down even though you're working very hard on the drives. One of the things to keep in mind about the long low-rate sessions done by national-squad types: they also are typically working quite hard on the drives, and also using the comparatively long recoveries to help offset the cardiovascular load. The result isn't long slow distance (to borrow a term from running). Instead it's high power/low rate work....
3/23 30 minutes on the TechnoGym recumbent cycle at a nominal 369 watts, cadence 59, average HR theoretically 136 bpm with a peak of 144 bpm. Again, I can assure you that this was a lot harder than the HR data might suggest. If comparison formulas cited earlier in this thread are accurate, my wattage probably was equivalent to 295-300 watts on an erg. That's 1:45-46 pace, for whatever it's worth....
I can assure you that this was a lot harder than the HR data might suggest. The low rating helps to hold HR down even though you're working very hard on the drives. One of the things to keep in mind about the long low-rate sessions done by national-squad types: they also are typically working quite hard on the drives, and also using the comparatively long recoveries to help offset the cardiovascular load. The result isn't long slow distance (to borrow a term from running). Instead it's high power/low rate work....
3/23 30 minutes on the TechnoGym recumbent cycle at a nominal 369 watts, cadence 59, average HR theoretically 136 bpm with a peak of 144 bpm. Again, I can assure you that this was a lot harder than the HR data might suggest. If comparison formulas cited earlier in this thread are accurate, my wattage probably was equivalent to 295-300 watts on an erg. That's 1:45-46 pace, for whatever it's worth....
67 MH 6' 6"
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Re: [In]decent Intervals
Broke yet another erg yesterday. This one was the u-shaped brass ferrule that helps attach the handle to the chain It broke in two a third of the way through the third 666m piece in another attempt at the CTC. There's no mechanical reason why the part needs to be there, and once I'd figured out what had happened I started up again. I even rejiggered the rests to try to account for the 30 seconds or so I lost punching in the new workout parameters. I consider it a valid workout, as workouts go. But I have too much integrity to try to submit the result in the CTC. Besides, I was only half a second of pace better than my previous go at it.
.
This one I set up r20 for the first 666/333m set; r24 for the second; r28 for the third; and r32 for the fourth. I ended up with 13:07.4, which is 1:38.4 average pace. Rather annoyingly, ErgData captured only the first 4 work intervals. It dropped the metres rowed in rep 5 up until the ferrule broke and I briefly stopped. And although I thought I was starting it up again when I resumed, such evidently was not the case. I wrote down the individual splits (pace, rate, wattage) and reconstructed the workout the old fashioned way.
Today I didn't get back from the combo of a clinic visit to pick up prescriptions and the pharmacy to get them filled in time to put in a workout. It's just as well as I'm knackered....
.
This one I set up r20 for the first 666/333m set; r24 for the second; r28 for the third; and r32 for the fourth. I ended up with 13:07.4, which is 1:38.4 average pace. Rather annoyingly, ErgData captured only the first 4 work intervals. It dropped the metres rowed in rep 5 up until the ferrule broke and I briefly stopped. And although I thought I was starting it up again when I resumed, such evidently was not the case. I wrote down the individual splits (pace, rate, wattage) and reconstructed the workout the old fashioned way.
Today I didn't get back from the combo of a clinic visit to pick up prescriptions and the pharmacy to get them filled in time to put in a workout. It's just as well as I'm knackered....
67 MH 6' 6"
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Re: [In]decent Intervals
Reversion to first principles. 8 x 500m r30 on 2' rest. Mildly negative splitted and then boom on the last rep.
Resting HR this morning was 58 bpm, blood pressure 119/63. Per an impedence test at the gym I am 19.4% body fat. If so I have a fat free body mass index of something like 25.6 and a normalized ffbmi of something like 26.7.* That is probably better than Benton these days, or for that matter anyone on the British Olympic viii. This is why you should always take such fitness indexes with a few hundredweight of salt. There is no way I am in that league as an erger. But I probably am slightly less flabby than I think I am....
* It's normally pretty hard to get much over 25 without some form of PED abuse. In my case, it has an awful lot to do with the constant struggle against diabetes. I control my blood glucose levels mainly through the combination of a severely restricted, vigilantly monitored diet and aggressive athletic training. And if you don't take in gratuitous carbs or fat to begin with, you don't store them in inconvenient places on your body....
Resting HR this morning was 58 bpm, blood pressure 119/63. Per an impedence test at the gym I am 19.4% body fat. If so I have a fat free body mass index of something like 25.6 and a normalized ffbmi of something like 26.7.* That is probably better than Benton these days, or for that matter anyone on the British Olympic viii. This is why you should always take such fitness indexes with a few hundredweight of salt. There is no way I am in that league as an erger. But I probably am slightly less flabby than I think I am....
* It's normally pretty hard to get much over 25 without some form of PED abuse. In my case, it has an awful lot to do with the constant struggle against diabetes. I control my blood glucose levels mainly through the combination of a severely restricted, vigilantly monitored diet and aggressive athletic training. And if you don't take in gratuitous carbs or fat to begin with, you don't store them in inconvenient places on your body....
67 MH 6' 6"
- NavigationHazard
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Re: [In]decent Intervals
3/27 14 x 1' r20 on 30":
I added 30' on the Technogym recumbent at a modest 318w and some leg weights. Meh.
I added 30' on the Technogym recumbent at a modest 318w and some leg weights. Meh.
67 MH 6' 6"
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Re: [In]decent Intervals
3/28 I had the best of intentions as far as doing a longer erg workout, but discovered on rep 7 that my phone (running ErgData) was approaching 5% battery capacity and about to start shutting down apps. I'd been doing 250m reps r32 on 1 minute at about 1:34.8 pace or so. I did rep 8 in 1:24.0 pace r38 and shut down. I added 30 mins on the TechnoGym recumbent at a nominal 331 watts, plus some leg weights.
3/29 I arrived at the gym with a fully charged phone plus a charger/cable, just in case. I essayed 20 x 250m r32ish on 1 min:
I tried to concentrate on stroke-to-stroke consistency while negative-splitting the reps and building up to a trademark last rep. I submit that the above graph is about as consistent as it's possible to get under the circumstances. If I could only put 8 of those together I'd be sub-6
3/29 I arrived at the gym with a fully charged phone plus a charger/cable, just in case. I essayed 20 x 250m r32ish on 1 min:
I tried to concentrate on stroke-to-stroke consistency while negative-splitting the reps and building up to a trademark last rep. I submit that the above graph is about as consistent as it's possible to get under the circumstances. If I could only put 8 of those together I'd be sub-6
67 MH 6' 6"
Re: [In]decent Intervals
That control makes me warm inside. You're very motivated.
32M 5'7" 170LBs
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- NavigationHazard
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Re: [In]decent Intervals
3/31, 4/1, 4/2 long outdoor cycle rides on my Specialized to take advantage of the advent of spring here in Wroclaw. All three days I did variations on a round-the-central-city loop, averaging about 26 miles each time out. The flowering trees are all blooming, particularly along the paths paralleling the Odra River embankments. It was objectively glorious, except for the pedestrians in what are supposed to be dedicated bike paths and (worse) the dog owners who let their animals cross the bike path on 10-meter leashes. I managed to avoid the leashes, somehow, but I saw three or four collisions while I was riding.... And the 30 kph wind in my face for the last third of Tuesday's ride was ... challenging....
4/1 I also attempted the Team Oarsome April Challenge: 4 x 750m r24/26/28/30, on 3' rest. I failed on account of needing an emergency bathroom break after the second rep. I finished out the session but won't count it as I took more than the allotted 3 minutes between reps 2 and 3.
Back to the usual gym cycle today, meaning erging.
4/1 I also attempted the Team Oarsome April Challenge: 4 x 750m r24/26/28/30, on 3' rest. I failed on account of needing an emergency bathroom break after the second rep. I finished out the session but won't count it as I took more than the allotted 3 minutes between reps 2 and 3.
Back to the usual gym cycle today, meaning erging.
67 MH 6' 6"
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Re: [In]decent Intervals
4/3 was 30 x 1' r20 on 30" in 1:47.2 average pace.
4/4 was a rest day
4/5 I did 8 x 500m r24 on 2', the idea being to do the first 7 at around 1:44.5 pace and then kill rep #8. I averaged 1:42.9, with rep 8 in 1:35.7 (couldn't hold the 1:34.6 that I was for 3/4 of it).
4/6 I did 1 x Ikea visit with Ms. Nav. Exhausting.
4/7 I did 21.4 road miles on the Specialized to get to the gym. It was objectively glorious weather-wise, except for the officially unhealthy air-quality forecast (mostly large soot particles and airborne dust). I was around 21 mph on the relatively deserted stretches next to the motorway. Around the zoo it was closer to 2.1 mph. A pox on people who think that the dedicated bike paths are for strolling and dog walking, just like the dedicated strolling path running parallel....
I essayed 8 x 500m r30 on 2 mins at the gym. The idea was to go around 1:42 for the first 4, 1:40 for the next 3, and then kill rep 8. I >started< rep 8 with a nominal HR of something like 178 bpm. It dropped into the 160s for most of the first 250m. But with 200m / 20 strokes to go the HR was tracking at 195 bpm. Out of fear of a-fib or a fatal stroke, I decided to handle down.... 1:40.8 average pace for the 7 reps I did complete; I was on about 1:32 pace with 200m to go on rep 8 when the displayed HR scared me into handling down.
NB: I checked the stroke data saved by ErgData in my logbook. On what would have been stroke #23 of the last rep, I theoretically had a HR of 201 bpm. I was on 1:31.8 pace, to be sure, but even still, it was unlikely at my advanced age...
4/4 was a rest day
4/5 I did 8 x 500m r24 on 2', the idea being to do the first 7 at around 1:44.5 pace and then kill rep #8. I averaged 1:42.9, with rep 8 in 1:35.7 (couldn't hold the 1:34.6 that I was for 3/4 of it).
4/6 I did 1 x Ikea visit with Ms. Nav. Exhausting.
4/7 I did 21.4 road miles on the Specialized to get to the gym. It was objectively glorious weather-wise, except for the officially unhealthy air-quality forecast (mostly large soot particles and airborne dust). I was around 21 mph on the relatively deserted stretches next to the motorway. Around the zoo it was closer to 2.1 mph. A pox on people who think that the dedicated bike paths are for strolling and dog walking, just like the dedicated strolling path running parallel....
I essayed 8 x 500m r30 on 2 mins at the gym. The idea was to go around 1:42 for the first 4, 1:40 for the next 3, and then kill rep 8. I >started< rep 8 with a nominal HR of something like 178 bpm. It dropped into the 160s for most of the first 250m. But with 200m / 20 strokes to go the HR was tracking at 195 bpm. Out of fear of a-fib or a fatal stroke, I decided to handle down.... 1:40.8 average pace for the 7 reps I did complete; I was on about 1:32 pace with 200m to go on rep 8 when the displayed HR scared me into handling down.
NB: I checked the stroke data saved by ErgData in my logbook. On what would have been stroke #23 of the last rep, I theoretically had a HR of 201 bpm. I was on 1:31.8 pace, to be sure, but even still, it was unlikely at my advanced age...
67 MH 6' 6"
- NavigationHazard
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Re: [In]decent Intervals
4/8 36 road miles on the Specialized, plus 1500m r20 for the CTC in 5:12.9/ 1:44.3 pace.
4/9 Team Oarsome Challenge: 4 x 750m on 3', r 24/26/28/30. My idea was to try to do them all at 1:40 pace, effectively trading rate for pace systematically.
Mission accomplished. I ignored the nominal 175 bpm Hr value on rep 3. I couldn't get ErgData to connect for love or money. I may need to do a firmware update on the PM, or maybe replace the batteries....
4/9 Team Oarsome Challenge: 4 x 750m on 3', r 24/26/28/30. My idea was to try to do them all at 1:40 pace, effectively trading rate for pace systematically.
Mission accomplished. I ignored the nominal 175 bpm Hr value on rep 3. I couldn't get ErgData to connect for love or money. I may need to do a firmware update on the PM, or maybe replace the batteries....
67 MH 6' 6"
- NavigationHazard
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Re: [In]decent Intervals
On the 2% chance that anyone wonders where I've been: we're moving into a new flat in Wroclaw and I've been putting in 10-12 hr days dealing with that. Deliveries, unpacking, packing, and [of course] the dreaded, deadly Ikea runs....
I have received [finally] my trusty Model D and my BikeErg from the US, and have unpacked/assembled them to the detriment of doing the same with other necessities. Normal workouts will resume one of these days....
I have received [finally] my trusty Model D and my BikeErg from the US, and have unpacked/assembled them to the detriment of doing the same with other necessities. Normal workouts will resume one of these days....
67 MH 6' 6"