Whats An Easy Run On An Erg

[old] GeorgeD · Post by **[old] GeorgeD** » November 8th, 2004, 4:07 am

If we go for a run we can choose the pace we run at and the terrain and the speed, but we cant change the amount of weight we have to carry around. So if we have a flat 10k course we run over then we vary the intensity by the pace we travel at and this generally involves (give or take a bit of stride length) adjusting our cadence. Now excuse me for being obtuse, but on the erg we can adjust the pace by either pulling less hard on the handle, or reducing the spm or a combination of both. You could even up the spm but reduce the power applied and still go slower. So my thought is that if we wanted to introduce a constant into the equation it would be either a constant SPI or a constant meters/stroke (and I dont want to argue which is better) then vary the stroke rate to make it easier or harder. Or is it as simple as reducing the 'average watts' or by lowering the 'working heart rate' - and the combination of power and rate by which this is achieved is imaterial (within reason). Any thoughts? - George

[old] tow rope · Post by **[old] tow rope** » November 8th, 2004, 9:08 am

George, Great subject; I was wondering about the same thing this morning but with a slightly different twist. My new C-2 D was delivered last month so let me preface what I say by letting you know that I am very new to this side of the equation. I remember reading in one of the running rags that the difference in fitness level required to run a 06:00 mile vs. a 09:00 mile wasn’t really that great; but the difference in the level of fitness to run a 05:00 vs. a 06:00 minute mile was huge. So in a slightly different way I have the same question about rowing. At what pace does the ordinary become elite? In distance running there is a formula for predicting your time in a race based on the results of a race at different distance. As a runner I found this to be relatively accurate and wonder whether you should toy with exponent value to better fit the ERG environment. I am certainly interested to hear comments. T2 = T1 x (D2/D1)^1.0707: So a 20:00 5K time predicts ((20:00*((10000/(5000))^1.0707) = 42:01 10K Regards Bert

[old] bw1099 · Post by **[old] bw1099** » November 12th, 2004, 10:43 pm

Bert, I was somewhat intrigued by the formula that you presented for predicting time for running a race, and your inquiry as to how it might apply to erging. Your equation was: T2 = T1 x (D2/D1)^1.0707: So a 20:00 5K time predicts ((20:00*((10000/(5000))^1.0707) = 42:01 10K The Concept2 website actually provides the database that we need to figure it out for erging. I went to the "Rankings" section connected with the "Personal Training Log" and took the 50th percentile time for different distances 500, 1000, 2000, 5000, 6000 and 10000m. Then I plotted them to see what exponent I would get. Mens Heavyweight - all ages --> 1.0708 Mens Heavyweight - 40-49 --> 1.0729 Mens Heavyweight - 30-39 --> 1.0718 (R-squared values for the regression were 0.9997 to 0.9998 if you care about those things) For running, you gave an exponent of 1.0707. Not much different from the 1.0708 that I got for all ages. This approach seems justified because I have noticed that as my personal best for different distances gets better, I end up at about the same percentile for each distance. I assume that everyone else does too. bw

[old] jkeehan · Post by **[old] jkeehan** » November 15th, 2004, 9:45 pm

Bert, I'm interested in your question RE the fitness levels required in running a 5min mile v. a 6 min mile--as it relates to improving from the ordinary to something better than that on the C2. To this end, I've taken to analyzing my workouts using WATT (power) analysis. If you chart out WATT calculation for the C2, (In Excel this would be "=2.8(POWER((seconds for 500m/500),3))" or to calculate for a 2:00, 500m split, "=2.8(POWER((120/500),3)" will give a result of 202.55 WATTs. To improve an erg from nine minutes to eight minutes, you'll need to increase your power output from 142 WATTs to 202 WATTs--an increase of 42%. A jump from eight minutes to seven minutes requires an power increase of 49% (to 302 WATTs)--so incremental improvements get progessively more difficult. Olympic level men seem capable to generating about 500 WATTs for the duration of an erg (sub six minute pace). Ordinary becoming elite--I don't know, but sustaining loads of > 300 WATTs for an erg impresses me.

[old] GeorgeD · Post by **[old] GeorgeD** » November 16th, 2004, 12:30 am

It is all relative to distance - I know I can hold just on 600watts for 500m but to date my max for 2k is about 380watts, disappearing down to the mid 250's for an hour. I think this is what our training is all about is it not, looking to hold higher and higher outputs for longer periods of time in our conditioning phase. Then as we enter pre-comp mode we seek to compact that thru altering our training sessions into 6 - 8 minutes of concerted effort over 2k. - George