Best intervals session for a sub 20m 5k?

[JonWalters]

All

My current 5k Pb is 20:24, and one of my short term goals is to get this below 20m.

I’ve been doing a number of interval sessions, and am interested in what those of you who are at, or above this level, would think was a good indicator of being able to do a sub 20m 5k.

For example, today I did 5*1,000m @ 1:59 split, with 1min recovery. I was pleased with this, but it was hard work for the last two intervals.

In previous sessions I’ve done 10*500m, 3*2,000m, etc... my logic so far has been to keep the pace constant at around 1:59, and to alternate between decreasing the recovery time and increasing the length of the interval...

All advice and suggestions welcomed

[hjs]

1500 m reps, 2k reps and around work best, use rest versus work 1 on 1 and use the rating you use during a 5 k.

Shorter reps work, even a lot, not so well, main reason is the non lactic anaerobic system, which helps a good bit during these. But hardly during a 5k

So 5x1500 4x2k 3/2.5/2k 5x5min. 6x1250 Rotate these. Twice a week a hard session us enough.

[JonWalters]

Thanks hjs - much appreciated.

So longer distance intervals, total distance of intervals greater than 5k, but recovery times equal to the time it takes to do the interval. I’m slightly surprised by the length of the recovery, as that would mean, if I was doing 2k intervals @ roughly a 1:59 split, the recovery between each interval would be just under 8 mins... However, will give it a go and see how it feels.

I like the idea of the 3k; 2.5k; 2k pyramid - suspect that would be blooming hard work, but I can see it would be a great way to build endurance (and mental strength) when already knackered!

[hjs]

Thanks hjs - much appreciated.

So longer distance intervals, total distance of intervals greater than 5k, but recovery times equal to the time it takes to do the interval. I’m slightly surprised by the length of the recovery, as that would mean, if I was doing 2k intervals @ roughly a 1:59 split, the recovery between each interval would be just under 8 mins... However, will give it a go and see how it feels.

I like the idea of the 3k; 2.5k; 2k pyramid - suspect that would be blooming hard work, but I can see it would be a great way to build endurance (and mental strength) when already knackered!

Keep the rest a bit shorter, limit it to 5min rest. On the 3 2.5 2 maybe 6.

These sessions, if you do them as good as you can, are hard, but will build your fitness rapidly. Paces are around 5k pace. The shorter ones a bit below, the longer a bit above.

But get used to them, at a first go, start out a bit slower, say 5k plus 2/3 seconds and keep a bit left for a faster last rep.

The longer recovery is needed if you want the quality of the session to stay high. Try to keep the pacing during the reps flat. Everybody will do this a bit differently, but roughly try to follow my tips.

If you do 2 of these sessions a week, have a few days inbetween, other training rowing or anything else should be relative easy. Let these sessions be your core and your main focus.

[nick rockliff]

Do as many 1Ks with 1 min recovery at target pace and rate as you can. You need to be able to get towards 8 reps.

[johnlvs2run]

Good question: what's your favorite session when aiming for a 5k PB.
Since you can do the 5x1k at faster than your goal pace, you don't need to take a longer recovery.
My last pace session before 18:57.4 at 143# was 40x 1 minute at goal pace (1:54) with 25 second recoveries.

Personally I would keep doing the same session that you're doing, and add more meters for endurance and recovery.

[JonWalters]

Good question: what's your favorite session when aiming for a 5k PB.
Since you can do the 5x1k at faster than your goal pace, you don't need to take a longer recovery.
My last pace session before 18:57.4 at 143# was 40x 1 minute at goal pace (1:54) with 25 second recoveries.

Personally I would keep doing the same session that you're doing, and add more meters for endurance and recovery.

Thanks John - did you really do 40 (four zero) 1min intervals at the goal pace for a 5k? With 25 seconds recovery? Doesn’t that mean you did just over 10,000m at 1:54?

If so, then that is a monster workout, and I suspect I’m miles away from being able to do the equivalent... which for me would be 40 reps of 1 min @ 1:59 (250m).

[hjs]

Good question: what's your favorite session when aiming for a 5k PB.
Since you can do the 5x1k at faster than your goal pace, you don't need to take a longer recovery.
My last pace session before 18:57.4 at 143# was 40x 1 minute at goal pace (1:54) with 25 second recoveries.

Personally I would keep doing the same session that you're doing, and add more meters for endurance and recovery.

Thanks John - did you really do 40 (four zero) 1min intervals at the goal pace for a 5k? With 25 seconds recovery? Doesn’t that mean you did just over 10,000m at 1:54?

If so, then that is a monster workout, and I suspect I’m miles away from being able to do the equivalent... which for me would be 40 reps of 1 min @ 1:59 (250m).

Really will be easy, every rep you get that free alactic energy. Big minus is 40 times a new start. If your back is ok no problem, but if not...

Still the biggest minus is you do not train longer stints with a more and more building fatique, which is very much needed during a hard 5k.

I myself at times did long short interval sessions. Have done 30x 1 min on, 1 min off rate 24 restricted 6/7 seconds below 5k pace, this never helped my endurance that much and also was very taxing.

[jamesg]

My current 5k Pb is 20:24, and one of my short term goals is to get this below 20m.

20.24 - 5k is 190 Watts, not bad at all.

To get to 203W (20') a lot depends on the rating you used in your last 5k. If high, you'll need to improve your stroke. If low, you'll have to increase the rating. Both can be tested and put in place in your intervals, or indeed in any other training you do.

[johnlvs2run]

Thanks John - did you really do 40 (four zero) 1min intervals at the goal pace for a 5k? With 25 seconds recovery? Doesn’t that mean you did just over 10,000m at 1:54? If so, then that is a monster workout, and I suspect I’m miles away from being able to do the equivalent... which for me would be 40 reps of 1 min @ 1:59 (250m).

Thanks for the compliment. The aim was to do 40 minutes at goal pace as easily as possible, while doing lots of kilometers. As the reps were shorter, they weren't that difficult compared to your 5x1k with 1 minute rests (25 percent), which I consider to be more intense. I had done them with 15s rests, and 10x1k at 5k pace with 1 minute rests, but the 1k's weren't easy. I usually take 2 minutes between them, which might be too much, but the main thing for me is averaging right at my goal pace, while keeping a reserve and being able to recover well between sessions.

[JonWalters]

My current 5k Pb is 20:24, and one of my short term goals is to get this below 20m.

20.24 - 5k is 190 Watts, not bad at all.

To get to 203W (20') a lot depends on the rating you used in your last 5k. If high, you'll need to improve your stroke. If low, you'll have to increase the rating. Both can be tested and put in place in your intervals, or indeed in any other training you do.

Thanks James - have just looked on my Concept2 logbook and the stroke rate for my 5k PB was 30. Not sure I can go much higher than that over the course of a 5k, so will need to focus on improving my stroke...

[Remo]

My favorite 5k builders:

(3 or 4)x2000m/2:00rest
4x1500m/2:00r
8x3:30/30sec rest (This is a weird one, but surprisingly effective. It is a good change of pace from the long, hard intervals that I mention above)

[goodie]

Runners would never do intervals that long for 5k. I know rowing is not running but 10 x 400 1min rest is the best middle distance workout ever.

[Remo]

Runners would never do intervals that long for 5k. I know rowing is not running but 10 x 400 1min rest is the best middle distance workout ever.

One of my go to intervals, particular approaching race season, is the 10x1:00/1:00rest. And I am not alone, there is man who post as "Navigation Hazard" who is very fast (he won the world championships this year for his age group). He does a lot of short interval work which he posts under the topic "[In]decent Intervals"

That said, I have seen some research by Dr. Stephen Seiler that strongly suggest that longer intervals, on the order of 5 to 10 minutes (with 2 min rest) twice a week, coupled with 4 LSD workouts a week, are very of effective on improving both VO2max and resiliency. And these mid-distant intervals have been in the quiver of rowing coaches since the early 1960s.

Rowing and running are different sports, but they do share many of the same characteristics such as being highly aerobic work. However, unlike running, rowing is a low rpm, heavy load sport. I don't know the numbers for rowing vs. running, but comparing rowing to a bicycling -- it is really difficult, in the short term, to put out similar Wattages. but as the pieces become longer, the differential shrinks

I personally have found that mid-distant interval workouts coupled with LSD workouts on easy days are highly effective in improving my speed over 5k -- which is what the question asked. Notwithstanding, I really like the 1:00/1:00. They sharpen my edge, including for the 5k. But I tend to save most of the short interval work I do until the approach of the 2k season.

[JonWalters]

I did another interval session yesterday, and attempted to do 4*1500m, at goal pace of 1:59.9, rate 30; and 2:00m recovery... I was toying with a longer recovery, but figured I would see how it felt at a ratio of 3:1 (6m effort, 2m easy)

Family life got in the way and I was interrupted, so ended up only doing 3 intervals. However, by the end of the 3rd rep I was up at 168hr, and suspect I would have seriously struggled to hold that pace and rating for a fourth one. Suspect next time I will try 2:1...

Today will be a nice lazy 21097m at below 152bpm!