Ski Erg for Max Cardio-How To Maximize?

[hjs]

Thanks for all the advice.

Didn't do much for about five days with the Ski Erg, but yesterday did two 2000m pulls in about ten minutes and didn't get much cardio benefit.

Did try to upping the rpm to 50+ based on that video above, with very short strokes, last week. The nordic guy had it at 60+.

Maybe that is the way to proceed. Put the rpm to 60+, even if that means incomplete pull downs like the nordic guy, but double down and focus on speed for 2000, 5000, or 10000m.

Again, it's not a "workout" I'm looking for, which you can get from anything -- it's a cardio benefit. Two different things.

You simply go way to slow, 10min over 2k is super easy for an average man. I seldom go above 1.55/57 pace. Go faster!

[kini62]

Thanks for all the advice.

Didn't do much for about five days with the Ski Erg, but yesterday did two 2000m pulls in about ten minutes and didn't get much cardio benefit.

Did try to upping the rpm to 50+ based on that video above, with very short strokes, last week. The nordic guy had it at 60+.

Maybe that is the way to proceed. Put the rpm to 60+, even if that means incomplete pull downs like the nordic guy, but double down and focus on speed for 2000, 5000, or 10000m.

Again, it's not a "workout" I'm looking for, which you can get from anything -- it's a cardio benefit. Two different things.

You simply go way to slow, 10min over 2k is super easy for an average man. I seldom go above 1.55/57 pace. Go faster!

Based on my just having come back from a 14 day trip to the greater los angeles area the average man I saw couldn't do 500m on the skierg without having a coronary or stroke.

[kini62]

Thanks for all the advice.

Didn't do much for about five days with the Ski Erg, but yesterday did two 2000m pulls in about ten minutes and didn't get much cardio benefit.

Did try to upping the rpm to 50+ based on that video above, with very short strokes, last week. The nordic guy had it at 60+.

Maybe that is the way to proceed. Put the rpm to 60+, even if that means incomplete pull downs like the nordic guy, but double down and focus on speed for 2000, 5000, or 10000m.

Again, it's not a "workout" I'm looking for, which you can get from anything -- it's a cardio benefit. Two different things.

Just did a 5K today after a 14 day break and my heart rate was just as high or higher than it would've been had I run a 5k with the same effort. This was at 36spm. It sounds like your simply not pulling hard enough and/or your technique is poor where you're not using all the muscles you should be using.

[johnlvs2run]

You simply go way to slow, 10min over 2k is super easy for an average man. I seldom go above 1.55/57 pace. Go faster!

Good grief.

[hjs]

You simply go way to slow, 10min over 2k is super easy for an average man. I seldom go above 1.55/57 pace. Go faster!

Good grief.

Just numbers, but if we ski and you get no training you need to go faster.

[Jeremy44]

3 10,000m is pretty good.

Heart rate monitor should do it, as far as I'm concerned. I'll try to find a way to get 80-95% of max heart rate.

[johnlvs2run]

Yes, heart rate is good. And going by feel too, which is maybe even better.

I did 3x 10' skierg motion yesterday at 46, 48, 50 spm. My breathing and rhythm are feeling much better.

[Jeremy44]

Yes, heart rate is good. And going by feel too, which is maybe even better.

I did 3x 10' skierg motion yesterday at 46, 48, 50 spm. My breathing and rhythm are feeling much better.

Good that your breathing and rythm are feeling better. That's a good workout.

I've been doing 5,000m and going to a 10,000m tomorrow.

[johnlvs2run]

I've been doing 5,000m and going to a 10,000m tomorrow.

Great. I put the skierg together yesterday then did my first 2k. It was 80 degrees and felt good.
This morning I did 2x 2k, both easily faster than yesterday. The 6 days of pre-practice helped a lot.
I don't feel sore at all anywhere. My injured hamstring was hurting yesterday but I think something else
was the case of that. It feels fine on the Skierg. I'm being conservative, want to get up to 10k and then more.

[Paul N]

Stroke lenght, don,t go to long, keep the strokes snappy and don,t squat much. The lats upperback do the work.

I've definitely been doing it wrong. I knew the theory about not reaching too high with the arms, starting the stroke with the handles near head level and elbows at 90 deg etc, but beyond that, I still end up unconsciously thinking during the workout that the longest possible stroke is best and extend my arms practically fully. As I'm short with longish arms, my hands end up near the floor, and I frequently reach the limit of travel of the cords! I'm wasting energy into a hard stop and not getting any useful power from it! I even thought about standing on a Reebok step to get round this problem

I'm amazed at the Olsson videos posted (here and in another thread) - he has a very short stroke and seems to always keep his elbows at 90 deg, even at the end of the stroke. Seems extreme! However the shorter the stroke the quicker it can be and not surprisingly, he has a (very) high spm - high 60s to 70 showing on the monitor there. I don't know why his way is more efficient (than a longer stroke/lower rate technique).

The other intriguing thing to me about Skierg action (compared to rowing) is the drive to recovery ratio - it's 1:1 on the Skierg (or seems that way to me). When rating at 40+ with a 1:1 ratio, what on earth is the breathing pattern supposed to be? I find myself inhaling at various points, but I'm not sure there's much of a pattern to it. I did try one novel experiment of a deliberately irregular stroke pattern - two very quick strokes, then a longer recovery, then another two short bursts. Not sure if that just gave me a short term "break", or if it has any merit over a longer duration.

[johnlvs2run]

As I'm short with longish arms, my hands end up near the floor, and I frequently reach the limit of travel of the cords! I'm wasting energy into a hard stop and not getting any useful power from it! I even thought about standing on a Reebok step to get round this problem

That's definitely an issue with the handle heights, not with you. I wouldn't change anything you're doing as long as you feel it's right. The solution is handle cord extensions that attach above the handles with stops at the top so the cords won't come out any more but the handles will hang lower, and also be easier to reach. Probably about 6 inch extensions should work fine. The regular cords should not be pulled out any farther as that would not work and you'd still hit the bottom. I'd email to C2 and see what they say or give them a call tomorrow. My friend is 5'1" and would definitely need to have extensions like this.

Olsson and Dahl are top level skiers so their stroke rates are naturally much higher than most people's would be. I slowed Dahl's down to 45spm (3/4 speed) on Youtube and it looked really slow, but would be a fast rate for me. Your times are good for your size and weight. Whatever feels most efficient for you is the best.

The breathing took me a few days to get used to but now it feels fine. Just try different patterns and you'll get used to it.

[hjs]

Stroke lenght, don,t go to long, keep the strokes snappy and don,t squat much. The lats upperback do the work.

I've definitely been doing it wrong. I knew the theory about not reaching too high with the arms, starting the stroke with the handles near head level and elbows at 90 deg etc, but beyond that, I still end up unconsciously thinking during the workout that the longest possible stroke is best and extend my arms practically fully. As I'm short with longish arms, my hands end up near the floor, and I frequently reach the limit of travel of the cords! I'm wasting energy into a hard stop and not getting any useful power from it! I even thought about standing on a Reebok step to get round this problem

I'm amazed at the Olsson videos posted (here and in another thread) - he has a very short stroke and seems to always keep his elbows at 90 deg, even at the end of the stroke. Seems extreme! However the shorter the stroke the quicker it can be and not surprisingly, he has a (very) high spm - high 60s to 70 showing on the monitor there. I don't know why his way is more efficient (than a longer stroke/lower rate technique).

The other intriguing thing to me about Skierg action (compared to rowing) is the drive to recovery ratio - it's 1:1 on the Skierg (or seems that way to me). When rating at 40+ with a 1:1 ratio, what on earth is the breathing pattern supposed to be? I find myself inhaling at various points, but I'm not sure there's much of a pattern to it. I did try one novel experiment of a deliberately irregular stroke pattern - two very quick strokes, then a longer recovery, then another two short bursts. Not sure if that just gave me a short term "break", or if it has any merit over a longer duration.

We can,t compare us with a top skier. They are extremely fit and have the technique from snow. There you can,t overreach, so their body is used to short stroking.
Reaching high is no problem, does not waste much energy, but bending very deep does, also overly using the triceps, a relative small muscle is not efficient.

Ratio can,t be compared to rowing, very different, shorter stroke, higher spm.

I never think about breathing, let it come as it comes. I do find the skier a bit strange, aerobicly it feels easy for a long time but a bit faster and its very tough. Max ski work is very uncomfortable, maybe even worse than rowing.

Recovery wise the skier is much easier, the rower can drain me, the skierg a lot less, I think? Not using/loading the spine is the difference.

[johnlvs2run]

As I'm short with longish arms, my hands end up near the floor, and I frequently reach the limit of travel of the cords! I'm wasting energy into a hard stop and not getting any useful power from it!

C2 has these handle cord extensions for the Skierg1, and here are instructions to install them. You can probably adjust them for the length that you want. The handles on my Skierg2 go 6 inches from the floor, which is better, although extending them down from the top would make them easier to reach and to use.

Here's a video of Andrea (on left), who looks rather tall, hitting the bottom on a Skierg1. IMHO her form is much better than the other competitor.

[kini62]

As I'm short with longish arms, my hands end up near the floor, and I frequently reach the limit of travel of the cords! I'm wasting energy into a hard stop and not getting any useful power from it!

C2 has these handle cord extensions for the Skierg1, and here are instructions to install them. You can probably adjust them for the length that you want. The handles on my Skierg2 go 6 inches from the floor, which is better, although extending them down from the top would make them easier to reach and to use.

Here's a video of Andrea (on left), who looks rather tall, hitting the bottom on a Skierg1. IMHO her form is much better than the other competitor.

The skier on the left looks ridiculous. Very poor form, excessive bending at the waist etc...

The skier on the right has more of a crossfit style that emphasizes a long stroke. That's how my stroke was. It works well as you go at a lower stroke rate which can be aerobically less demanding.

[hjs]

As I'm short with longish arms, my hands end up near the floor, and I frequently reach the limit of travel of the cords! I'm wasting energy into a hard stop and not getting any useful power from it!

C2 has these handle cord extensions for the Skierg1, and here are instructions to install them. You can probably adjust them for the length that you want. The handles on my Skierg2 go 6 inches from the floor, which is better, although extending them down from the top would make them easier to reach and to use.

Here's a video of Andrea (on left), who looks rather tall, hitting the bottom on a Skierg1. IMHO her form is much better than the other competitor.

We really should not make fun, but boy that guy has zero feel for movement. The other is a bit better, but has a very soft stroke, no power at all. This vid should be burned

https://www.instagram.com/garageathlete/?hl=en

For a good skierg technique look at Justin s profile. Short stroke, and fast speed. He is no sprinter.