Rowing 2K sub 7 min or running 10K flat sub 40 min?

[Griparn]

3/13

800m x 4, rest 2 min

Looking at previous interval sessions my aim was to hold avg 1:48.8 for three rounds and then see if I could go all out on the last one. After first interval I thought this will be tough to manage the speed, but I manage to get in some steady state I could hold on to.

Times for the intervals:

1:48.1 28
1:48.4 28
1:49.6 28
1:48.8 29

Next up is 7500 m.

I would like to get in some workouts with higher spm to get used to the higher rating which will be the case in the 2k. Any ideas of how to build a workout like this?
Maybe try out the one of the below?

https://thepeteplan.wordpress.com/sprint-hiit/

[Griparn]

Yesterday I bought some new running shoes, zero drop. Did a 1k test run in the evening just to get a feel. Now ice is starting to melt, so I might do some more running. Focus is still on the erg though.

Todays workout. Felt good.

7500m
29:23 (1:57.5)
Avg Hr: 159 max: 177
Spm: 20
Df: 99

Next up is probably a 7500m or interval work of some kind.

[Griparn]

20/3

Running 4.3 km, slow pace ~ 5:30/km

22/3

7500m
29:15.7 (1:57)
Avg Hr:162 max: 178
Spm:20
Df:99

Did a ss instead of interval. Next one will be interval work.

[Anth_F]

I actually missed this thread. Just been catching up on all of your work updates... some fine work man, very well done thus far.

[Griparn]

Thanks Anth, I hope it will be easy to follow.

I thought I might share an intresting podcast session I listened to this week. It's called Taming the darkside - lactate tolerance training. It's an anerican running/ocr coach giving some insights about this subject. I think It's worth listen to even if you aren't in to running. Here's the link for those interested:

http://www.naturalrunningnetwork.com/ta ... -training/


24/3

Interval work. I have felt a need for getting used to the higher spm as most work I do is steady state training at around 20-21.I had some time constraints, but managed to do some 500 m's with 2 min rest inbetween. After first interval I decided to aim for 30-32spm and pull more controlled. It felt good until the last interval when my quads was on fire. Overall happy with workout, will try to gradually build more reps and really focus on tempo.

Avg: 1:42.6. 31spm

1:42.5 33spm
1:41.5. 31spm
1:42.7. 31spm
1:43.6. 31spm

Df:101

Next week is vacation in Gran Canaria, might do some bw training.

[optimuswolf]

Hi Griparn,

I'm just chiming in as we have some uncanny similarities. I too would like to achieve your exact goals (must be something attractive about the combination)

I am like a slightly worse version of you -

- my times are not as good (45:00 10k run and not attempted a 2k since I started rowing proper)
- I'm a year or two older
- my first kid was born a few months before yours
- we're almost exactly the same height and weight
- I am starting to go thin on top

I'll be following your progress and picking up tips. Cheers and god luck.

Optimuswolf

[Griparn]

Optimuswolf, thats cool! Yes seems like we have quite some similarities. We should help and push each other to reach these goals!
How are you approaching your goals at the moment? Are you training both at the same time? You should do a 2k test and see where you stand.

I had a planned 8k distance workout yesterday, but I caught some illness in my throat so I cancelled the workout. I had been looking forward to start erging again after some days of no real training, but I guess I just have to be patient and wait until fully recovered.

[optimuswolf]

Optimuswolf, thats cool! Yes seems like we have quite some similarities. We should help and push each other to reach these goals!
How are you approaching your goals at the moment? Are you training both at the same time? You should do a 2k test and see where you stand.

I had a planned 8k distance workout yesterday, but I caught some illness in my throat so I cancelled the workout. I had been looking forward to start erging again after some days of no real training, but I guess I just have to be patient and wait until fully recovered.

With time constraints I'm limited to 3 erg sessions a week (I'm reporting my sessions on the PP thread), a brisk 5k run and a longer run, currently around 10k but working up to 13-14k (will check back here on the running front). .There's v little research gone into my approach.

Ideally I'd like to add one swim and one long cycle to cover all 4 major aerobic activities, but not got the time right now.

Shake that lurgy soon fella.

[Griparn]

Optimuswolf, It's really good you can put in that amount of work. A good week for me would be three training sessions, more normal being two. I will try to follow your work on the PetePlan thread.


11/4

Yesterday I was erging for the first time in a long time, at least it felt so. I didn't know what to expect, but I knew I would not be where I left off. Plan was to do a SS 8K. For fun I have been looking at when HR exceeds 170 bpm. Normally this have occured at around 19 min, yesterday It happend already at 11:15. So I knew this would be tough. At around 4 K in I was thinking of calling it a day as pace was dropping. But somehow I decided to at least be under 2:00 pace and 4 km, became, 3,2,1 and somehow manage to complete the session.

It's tough mentally to see such a drop in performance, but Im very happy I never gave in. Better to be honest and see where Im at.

8000m
31:48.3 (1:59.2)
Avg Hr:167 max: 180
Spm:19
Df:101


Now I will do the 8k until I reach around 1:57:5 avg split.

[optimuswolf]

Optimuswolf, It's really good you can put in that amount of work. A good week for me would be three training sessions, more normal being two. I will try to follow your work on the PetePlan thread.


11/4

Yesterday I was erging for the first time in a long time, at least it felt so. I didn't know what to expect, but I knew I would not be where I left off. Plan was to do a SS 8K. For fun I have been looking at when HR exceeds 170 bpm. Normally this have occured at around 19 min, yesterday It happend already at 11:15. So I knew this would be tough. At around 4 K in I was thinking of calling it a day as pace was dropping. But somehow I decided to at least be under 2:00 pace and 4 km, became, 3,2,1 and somehow manage to complete the session.

It's tough mentally to see such a drop in performance, but Im very happy I never gave in. Better to be honest and see where Im at.



8000m
31:48.3 (1:59.2)
Avg Hr:167 max: 180
Spm:19
Df:101


Now I will do the 8k until I reach around 1:57:5 avg split.

Great to be back in the saddle. Any reason you're not following something like the PP with speed and endurance work built in? I was doing sonething similar to you with my SS work but after advice have throttled right down to recovery pace (2:06) on those sessions, working harder on my intervals and my weekly 5k run. I imagine that with only 3 sessions per week you want to push a bit harder but worth thinking about it.

Other thing I notice is that your SR is v low for your HR. Are you naturally v strong or are you pulling v hard each stroke?

I'm no expert but if you easily pull that pace at 19SPM you should just be ready for close to 7m now. Just up the SR to near 30. I've struggled to get my SR down to 21-22 and for that to be smooth my pace is over 2.05. Yet I can pull smoothly at sub 1.50 just by speeding up the recovery.

[Griparn]

Orginally when starting rowing this year I planned to do a modified BPP. My plan was to do the distances 2 times and then increase with 500 m. And also do some interval work from time to time. The first distances I did was 5000m at around 19-21 in rating and maybe 1:59 avg. As I understood PP I should just up the metres gradually and keep the same stroke rate. As distances have increased I have been able to increase both the speed and lowering the rating a bit. So I have drifted away from the PP quite a bit.

Maybe it would be better to decrease speed more, I dont know. But as long as I feel I progress I will keep doing this.

Do you mean strokerate considering heartrate or something else? For me this is just a strokerate I feel comfortable with doing the longer distances. I dont feel im pulling very hard each stroke or I would not be able to keep the distances.

Yes, a rate around 28-30 would be possible for a sub 7, but the problem I guess for me is to have the endurance to keep at it for 2000 m.At the moment Im not there yet. That's why it's very important for me, as I train mostly at lower rating to be working the higher ratings. My plan is to keep my current rating/speed up to 10 K, then start all over from 5 k at a higher rating, say between 22-24 and then gradually increase the distances. I must also do the higher rating stuff at race pace or above. When I can hit 6x500m intervals at 2 min rest with 30-32 in rating I will have a go at the 2K.

I dont know for how long you have been rowing, but with time I think your rating will go down as your technique/strength/endurance for rowing improves. It seems like you have an easier time rating higher than me.

Enough rambling by me, dont know if I make any sense. Btw a good read if you havent read it already is this:

http://q-power.co/30r20__1_of_3_.html

I did these workouts last year and they definitely help me focusing on keeeping the rate lower and focusing on technique and strength of each stroke. They also give a good explanation of why this kind of training is good for the rowing performance.

[JadeMerrett]

Have been following this thread with interest having a running background and recently taking up the ERG!

Just wondering if you have thrown in the odd test at targeted pace i.e. ERG 1k @ 3:30 followed by running 5k @ sub 20mins?? Even shorter periodic testing would assist with reinforcing a positive mindset towards your training efforts.

Have no real focus or targets as such myself but attempted a 2k ERG @ 90% followed by running an 8k loop from my house last Sunday just to gauge your targeted pace:

ERG: 2000m R32 A/HR 160 = 6:54.9
Run: 8k A/HR 162 = 31:50

Anyway, keep up the good work, consistency will pay off.....

[Griparn]

Hey Jade! Great to see more people with interest in both these goals. You seem to be very close though, almost doing them right after each other is very impressive.

No I havent thought about doing the odd test at targeted pace. At the moment I focus almost entirely on the erg. Doing them back to back would be an ultimate goal,but as you said half the distance might be good to start with. Btw whats your age, height,weight?

14/4

8000m
31:33.6 (1:58.3)
Avg Hr: 168 max:180
Spm:19
Df:101

Felt improvements since last session, but had some troubled holding pace first km's. Next session is 8 or 8,5K.

[JadeMerrett]

Hey Griparn "sorry I missed your name".......

Current stats:
42 yrs
73 kg's
176 cm

Current focus, getting my half marathon time down on the ERG, have a goal time in mind but will just keep building the K's at this stage while throwing in the odd test session at targeted pace "5k @ target pace weekly".......

Anyway, all the best and I look forward to watching your progress!!

Cheers

[optimuswolf]

Orginally when starting rowing this year I planned to do a modified BPP. My plan was to do the distances 2 times and then increase with 500 m. And also do some interval work from time to time. The first distances I did was 5000m at around 19-21 in rating and maybe 1:59 avg. As I understood PP I should just up the metres gradually and keep the same stroke rate. As distances have increased I have been able to increase both the speed and lowering the rating a bit. So I have drifted away from the PP quite a bit.

Maybe it would be better to decrease speed more, I dont know. But as long as I feel I progress I will keep doing this.

Do you mean strokerate considering heartrate or something else? For me this is just a strokerate I feel comfortable with doing the longer distances. I dont feel im pulling very hard each stroke or I would not be able to keep the distances.

Yes, a rate around 28-30 would be possible for a sub 7, but the problem I guess for me is to have the endurance to keep at it for 2000 m.At the moment Im not there yet. That's why it's very important for me, as I train mostly at lower rating to be working the higher ratings. My plan is to keep my current rating/speed up to 10 K, then start all over from 5 k at a higher rating, say between 22-24 and then gradually increase the distances. I must also do the higher rating stuff at race pace or above. When I can hit 6x500m intervals at 2 min rest with 30-32 in rating I will have a go at the 2K.

I dont know for how long you have been rowing, but with time I think your rating will go down as your technique/strength/endurance for rowing improves. It seems like you have an easier time rating higher than me.

Enough rambling by me, dont know if I make any sense. Btw a good read if you havent read it already is this:

http://q-power.co/30r20__1_of_3_.html

I did these workouts last year and they definitely help me focusing on keeeping the rate lower and focusing on technique and strength of each stroke. They also give a good explanation of why this kind of training is good for the rowing performance.

Thanks for this Griparn - I read the article you linked and have decided to incorporate a sub 20 SPM session into my schedule, replacing a normal PP 8k SS (I usually do these at 21-22). I still think that if you can pull that pace at a slow SPM then you should be much faster at 30SPM. Might want to check your technique stays consistent?

Did some running this weekend but right now I'm only doing a 5k at any decent pace - not far off 20mins. Then I'm doing a longer slower run weekly to build some endurance. I'm planning my first ever 2k erg test for 2 weeks time and hoping to get around 7:15-7:18.

If you had to bet, which of the goals do you think you will achieve first? You can't be far off the 2k target now.