New Model D

[psychoswim]

Hi,

I bought a new model D rower from amazon about a month and a half ago. I have a couple of questions I haven't been able to find solutions to by reading the forum.

1) My seat has seemed stiff from the beginning. It just sits at whatever spot it stops at on the rail and doesn't slide down even with a gentle push, it needs a pretty forceful push to travel down the length of the rail (in either direction). The bottom rollers are not touching the rail and I've cleaned the rail and top rollers with no effect. Would I then need to remove the seat, remove the bottom rollers and put them in the 3rd hole? Honestly, I don't care about the seat sliding or not when not in use, but would that not add some resistance when I'm using the machine?

2) The machine seems slower and harder at the same drag factor compared to every other machine I have used before (around 5 seconds / 500m). Drag factor at damper 1 is around 65 (after 5 strokes) while at damper 10 it's around 220 on the first 2 strokes before dropping to 180 on the next strokes.

3) Unrelated to my rower but is the drag factor the number you get after 2 strokes or after 5-10? I've seen both posted and I seem to get different numbers.

Any advice would be appreciated, thank you!

FYI: I mostly use my erg as cross training for outrigger canoe and dragon boat racing and thus have a love-hate relationship with it!

[aussieluke]

drag factor usually will vary for a couple of strokes and then settle on a consistent number - that will be the correct reading

check out this recent thread - maybe they really have made some changes that are affecting the new machines? Perhaps they don't want everyone chucking it on 10 as per standard gym behavior and injuring themselves!

Do you have your machine in the middle of a room? Or is any part of the fan cage etc up close to a wall or furniture?

viewtopic.php?f=10&t=151696

If the bottom rollers aren't touching the rail then moving them won't make any difference. This is the second time I've seen stiff rollers on a new machine mentioned recently too. Batch of bad bearings or something perhaps? Still, each machine would have been tested before shipping.

[Carl Watts]

The slide is angled towards the foot stretchers so on a level floor the seat should slide from the far end to the foot stretchers by just letting go of it.

There is quite a bit of tolerance between all the components in the seat assembly, its not exactly a precision setup so I would check that all 4 corners of the rollers touch the slide together without your weight on the seat.

Sounds like a bearing issue, however I would use it like it is for a couple of weeks and then recheck it. The bearings have grease in them, allow time for this to redistribute inside the bearing and the friction should drop.

[psychoswim]

@ aussieluke: thank you, I had already seen that thread which is why I tested the drag factors yesterday. I wrote to Concept 2 to ask if they thought that was a problem or not. There are a few feet of free space all around the cage, how much clearance would I ideally need? There is also a paddling erg machine in the same room..

@ Carl Watts: thank you, I will keep using it this way and see if it gets better while waiting to hear from Concept 2.

[aussieluke]

As long as it's at least a foot away from walls I'm sure it would be ok

[Bob S.]

Still, each machine would have been tested before shipping.

That applies to direct purchases from C2, but I wonder if a purchase from Amazon can be relied on.

Bob S.

[aussieluke]

Still, each machine would have been tested before shipping.

That applies to direct purchases from C2, but I wonder if a purchase from Amazon can be relied on.

Bob S.

Well I'd assume they're tested at the factory before being boxed up.

Is it possible they've made a change to the machines that affects the standard drag factor range? ...after all, no one really needs a df up to 200+ ...apart from Shawn Baker of course.

[psychoswim]

Here is the reply I received from Concept2..

"Thank you for contacting Concept2 directly about this.



We have seen seats that are a little tight like you describe before. We actually test row every machine before packing it to ship. You might get it to loosen up by slamming the seat to the front and then to the back. We actually do this at test rowing if we find a tight one. If that doesn’t work then you might need a replacement set of seat rollers.



About the drag factor: When we test the rowers at the 1 setting it has to be at 90 or below and at 200 at the 10 setting. If the machine is at high elevation, then that will affect the drag and make it lower. Are you living at elevation by any chance?



Please send a video of you rowing 10 strokes at the low and high settings while viewing drag factor. Can you also reply with the serial number of the rower."

So it appears they have not made a voluntary change. I will follow their suggestions once I get home.

[jackarabit]

Asking for serial might indicate a necessity and intent to investigate what sorts of mix-n-match, spraybooth refurbs Amazon resellers are respresenting as new product.

[Bob S.]

Asking for serial might indicate a necessity and intent to investigate what sorts of mix-n-match, spraybooth refurbs Amazon resellers are respresenting as new product.

My concern exactly. I have confidence in a machine tested and boxed at C2. If it shows up on Amazon, who is to say what its history has been in between.

[psychoswim]

Asking for serial might indicate a necessity and intent to investigate what sorts of mix-n-match, spraybooth refurbs Amazon resellers are respresenting as new product.

My concern exactly. I have confidence in a machine tested and boxed at C2. If it shows up on Amazon, who is to say what its history has been in between.

I'm not really worried about that honestly. I've seen issues with resellers on Amazon.ca but never when it is sold and shipped directly from the company itself. My erg came in the original packaging and nothing makes me think it is anything but new. Then again, maybe I'm being naive. It doesn't seem like I'm the only one experiencing my issues though.

[jackarabit]

If your machine was drop shipped from Morrisville VT, it should be the real deal.

[aussieluke]

Here is the reply I received from Concept2..

"Thank you for contacting Concept2 directly about this.



We have seen seats that are a little tight like you describe before. We actually test row every machine before packing it to ship. You might get it to loosen up by slamming the seat to the front and then to the back. We actually do this at test rowing if we find a tight one. If that doesn’t work then you might need a replacement set of seat rollers.



About the drag factor: When we test the rowers at the 1 setting it has to be at 90 or below and at 200 at the 10 setting. If the machine is at high elevation, then that will affect the drag and make it lower. Are you living at elevation by any chance?



Please send a video of you rowing 10 strokes at the low and high settings while viewing drag factor. Can you also reply with the serial number of the rower."

So it appears they have not made a voluntary change. I will follow their suggestions once I get home.

Interesting update, thanks

not sure 'slamming' the seat into the front and back stops is the best idea but I guess it can't do much harm. Another option may be to lay a thin cloth over the rail and then drive the seat over that back and forward a bit.

If you do take a video maybe post it up here too so we can see exactly what is happening? (might help others with the same problem too)

[psychoswim]

I tried "slamming" the seat, didn't do anything.

Haven't figured out how to get a decent video but tried the drag factors again. The highest numbers I could get after 5-10 strokes were 70 at damper 1 and 190 at damper 10. I'll try with a thin cloth on the rail see if it helps any.

Thanks for your input guys, hopefully there's a solution in sight besides buying new rollers to replace my barely used ones..

[aussieluke]

I tried "slamming" the seat, didn't do anything.

Haven't figured out how to get a decent video but tried the drag factors again. The highest numbers I could get after 5-10 strokes were 70 at damper 1 and 190 at damper 10. I'll try with a thin cloth on the rail see if it helps any.

Thanks for your input guys, hopefully there's a solution in sight besides buying new rollers to replace my barely used ones..

If a cloth wont work (just gets bunched up) maybe try a strip of paper or something - just anything to try and create a bit of tollerance between the bottom rollers and the rail

I'm sure if anything needs replacing they will send you new parts under warranty - take a video of the seat not rolling up and down freely too!