New American 500m record and questioning dogma

[Shawn Baker]

Ok am fasted rowing- not great but better sleep last night

1k easy wu row- then on to target the 40+ American 500m record (1:17.7)- felt I could do it at 35 spm (was hoping to go around 1:17.2 today)


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=r8p0VG4i-TA



So managed to take record with a fairly decent effort row with not too bad pacing, using max drag and a fairly long stroke (which seems to suit me well)- pleased to get this record (from 2002 held by John Stenard at age 40) I'm 49.5)- also I'll point out I don't nor never have used any drugs or hormone replacement as this is becoming more of an issue unfortunately- Also I'll point out I did this on a low carb high fat diet and this was done after about 18 hours of fasting and so the dogma that carbs are essential for high intensity glycolitic performance is in my mind questionable- also fro a training standpoint I did basically zero steady state work over last several months and so the common advice to do ample steady state work I also question (especially for the 500m row)- I'm going to keep going the rest of the summer in this vein and see where it leads.

Finished up with a few easy "low rate" 100m sprints- again using long powerful stroke- pleased to hit a 1:10 and effort felt quite easy



Tonight going to play 2hr of touch rugby with a bunch of old guys out here in California- haven't touched a rugby ball in over 20 years (when I used to play Semi-professionally in New Zealand) - should be fun and hopefully no stupid injuries

[hjs]

Very nice, congrats, relative good pacing to. I saw your vid. And re your question about the recovery. After the stroke you are leading with your hips instead of you hands/shoulders. So when the upperbody rocks over, it has little time, making it a bit rushed and hasty. If the shoulders should come first, you could get a more calm recovery.

Re glycogeen, a 500 meter is pretty short, how many cal, mayby 30, that would only be 7/8 gram of glycogeen. If you eat enough protein, which you do, the conversion to glycogeen will easily cover that.

I myself have raced one season over a few 2k and pulled pretty ok races. With only coffee and a few eggs as breakfast. With one race after a 2 hour drive at forehand.

Hard interval work I found tough, I really felt the lack of glycogeen and burn you get was worse. But instead of 1 500 that means 8, of 4 x 1k. Those sessions you are familiar with. Instead of 30, those mayby take 25 cal, say 6 gram per set. Which would be 50 ish for a training set. Numbers are ofcourse give or take, but not a million miles off.

Back to your 500, sub 1.17 should be possible, if you get everything right.

[Shawn Baker]

Henry, I wonder about the long term (years) adaptation to lower carb diets and say the efficiency of gluconeogenesis, also I find the diet to significantly reduce muscle and joint inflammation (coupled with getting good sleep and cold immersion) in my experience helps with recovery and allows me to go relatively hard fairly frequently despite my "old age".

[hjs]

Henry, I wonder about the long term (years) adaptation to lower carb diets and say the efficiency of gluconeogenesis, also I find the diet to significantly reduce muscle and joint inflammation (coupled with getting good sleep and cold immersion) in my experience helps with recovery and allows me to go relatively hard fairly frequently despite my "old age".

You certainly seem to do well. But you are a n1 test.
To really get an idea about gluconeogenesis, you proberly need muscle bioptie. Can,t see that work. And my hypothesis would be, that on a low carb diet the body would get better on using protein to carb. Conversion.

Other point is ofcourse the kind of fats, lots of omega 6, very likely leads to weak cells, with this instable fat being used in our body for recovery and building of cells.

Other point, read a story today about the oldest woman in the world. 115, from age 10 she daily eat 3 raw eggs, now she still eats 100 raw minced meat a day, with cookies. and does not like vegetables/fruits. She had 2 sisters also in the plus 100 club.
Her doctor was a bit puzzled with all that cholesterol , she had very low bloodpressure though Haha. "Despite" all that cholesterol.

[Shawn Baker]

Well, you and I are certainly aware of the absolute debacle the low fat high carb diet (to include plenty of Omega 6 vegetable oils) has been for the general populations health, the relatively new phenomenon of "fat" adapted endurance athletes are starting to be studied and some of them are setting endurance world records. Glycolitic stuff, which a 500m row undoubtedly largely is, has not received much attention other than a few short term studies- It is also starting to become clear that we can only access a portion of our muscle glycogen reserves during exercise and thus "topping them off" via carb loading may not be as effective as we once thought. I'm inclined to believe that in the long term efficiency of converting ingested protein into glucose via liver gluconeogenesis may improve with very long term fat adaptation and it allows us to avoid the often inflammatory effects of certain carbohydrates. As you can see from my workouts I don't "just do a 500m sprint, often I'll add additionally sprinting or weightlifting (sometimes in a second session) but still on minimal carbs- I think the longer term adaptation is what allows this. Peter Defty, of Vespa nutrition, believes his long term "fat adapted" athletes just take less inflammatory damage when training in low carb states- so interesting as science is not really in my opinion settled about this stuff (especially when we look at very long term adaptations(not studied) versus strict short term fuel partitioning studies)

[jackarabit]

Wow!! Got to start chugging that salmon oil.

[left coaster]

Hey Shawn, sweet pull big fella -- that's impressive!!

Do you feel the low carb diet prevents excessive muscle hypertrophism?

I puffed up like the michelin man for about 7 days after hitting that 1 minute PR. Something about the one minute duration that my body responds strongly to. I don't care for the feeling of excessive hypertrophic muscles and after trimming down from rowing and buying a bunch of smaller shirts I started to bust out of them again -- not the goal

I ramble, but I ask because I understand much of the hypertropic muscle mass is water that has been pulled in to fix and store glycogen. I think we need 3-4 grams of water for every gram of glycogen or something close to that. If you're always glycogen depleted do you avoid the "that guy must be on GH" phenomenon?

[Shawn Baker]

Certainly when you replete glycogen store you hold more water and look bigger and carbs are the fastest way to do it. I don't doubt a 1 minute hard row is more anabolic compared to a 60 min slow slog but I can't see anyone turning into the hulk from just doing a few 1 minute rows here and there- lots of heavy, hard work is required, low carb diet makes it more difficult especially if not enough protein

[Carl Watts]

Great effort and sensible ratings to match, congratulations.

Pretty good pacing as well, you may have gone a few 1/10th of a second faster, maybe 1:17 flat with a slightly slower start but the finish is hell and its hard not to begin to fade on the 500m event.

[left coaster]

I'm actually asking about your current state, Shawn. You do a tone of sprints and heavy lifts, do you think you would be more hypertrophic if eating a higher carb diet or do you feel you would look about the same?

It took me a lot of short distance work to finally hit 353 and that final effort left some visible effects. Wifie thinks it's pretty amusing, I went from chubby to pumped in about 6 months the sprint work shows with my body type.

[Shawn Baker]

Carl thanks, hopefully as I do some more stuff at this pace my fitness will allow me some improvement, but yes some fade is pretty much expected- not too disappointed with a 1:20 for the last 100

Lefty- while I do quite a bit of heavy/explosive stuff most of it is in a low rep range and that tends to not be particularly hypertrophic- If I were to switch back to a high carb diet for a month I would likely pick up about 15lbs of bodyweight (most of it being water, some fat and very little if any muscle- I'd be a little bit stronger- but I'd likely have more joint pain, my guts would hurt from bloating and I'd spend far too much time on the toilet- likely my training frequency/intensity would decrease a bit and I'd require more recovery time- some of this might get better with time as I re-adapted to a higher carb intake, but not worth it in the long run for me.

[hjs]

Well, you and I are certainly aware of the absolute debacle the low fat high carb diet (to include plenty of Omega 6 vegetable oils) has been for the general populations health, the relatively new phenomenon of "fat" adapted endurance athletes are starting to be studied and some of them are setting endurance world records. Glycolitic stuff, which a 500m row undoubtedly largely is, has not received much attention other than a few short term studies- It is also starting to become clear that we can only access a portion of our muscle glycogen reserves during exercise and thus "topping them off" via carb loading may not be as effective as we once thought. I'm inclined to believe that in the long term efficiency of converting ingested protein into glucose via liver gluconeogenesis may improve with very long term fat adaptation and it allows us to avoid the often inflammatory effects of certain carbohydrates. As you can see from my workouts I don't "just do a 500m sprint, often I'll add additionally sprinting or weightlifting (sometimes in a second session) but still on minimal carbs- I think the longer term adaptation is what allows this. Peter Defty, of Vespa nutrition, believes his long term "fat adapted" athletes just take less inflammatory damage when training in low carb states- so interesting as science is not really in my opinion settled about this stuff (especially when we look at very long term adaptations(not studied) versus strict short term fuel partitioning studies)

I think looking at top runners, cyclist etc, higher carb is still the norm, but those people have there energy intake in balance, when a top cyclist is 7% fat he is being made fun of with his chubby ass every pound counts uphill.
Most people on the hflc wagon come from being very overweight situation. And like you know, keeping a very calm insulin level in our blood is the key of not feeling hungry. Its a breeze loosing fat that way.

On the very highest level in top endurance sports I have not seen anyone using a low carb approach. And finding people who are willing to take the test always comes from students etc. topathletes have to much to lose to take the chance.
The general population still is clueless mostly, I sometimes start talking about stuff like this, but seldom you come accross people who are a bit in on the subject, and like you know doctors are in this just the general population.

Btw, a point you don,t mention is skin, I found the skin to become very calm and smooth on a low carb diet. So could also be a remedy for people with spots.

[Balkan boy]

Well done, Shawn.
Very impressive power and a nice long stroke.

How long have you been doing the low-carb-high-fat diet?

On the very highest level in top endurance sports I have not seen anyone using a low carb approach. And finding people who are willing to take the test always comes from students etc. topathletes have to much to lose to take the chance.

Tennis player Novak Đoković is allegedly on HFLC and it was that change that brought him to top. I don't know the details, though.
A few endurance motorcyclist (Dakar and similar races) are on HFLC, and are getting good results.

Like you said, it's risky business for top athletes. Most of them are reluctant to talk about diet and specific training.
Their 50-60 year old coaches are probably a big barrier.

[hjs]

Well done, Shawn.
Very impressive power and a nice long stroke.

How long have you been doing the low-carb-high-fat diet?

On the very highest level in top endurance sports I have not seen anyone using a low carb approach. And finding people who are willing to take the test always comes from students etc. topathletes have to much to lose to take the chance.

Tennis player Novak Đoković is allegedly on HFLC and it was that change that brought him to top. I don't know the details, though.
A few endurance motorcyclist (Dakar and similar races) are on HFLC, and are getting good results.

Like you said, it's risky business for top athletes. Most of them are reluctant to talk about diet and specific training.
Their 50-60 year old coaches are probably a big barrier.

I know, but those are not real sports, tennis and motorsports don,t need 100% fitness. Technique is the dominant factor. Serena W. can even be the best while always being 5/10 kg overweight. She is a great tennisplayer, but she never is 100% fit, proberly because its not needed. Try to win something on the track while not being 100%... Zero chance.

[Balkan boy]

I knew you were going to say it's not real sport.

Maybe that's the path to the mainstream: overweight/health >> amateurs >> fringe sports >> top athletes.

HFLC works for me, but I'm really interested if we will all look at it as fad in 5-10 years.