Power Vs. Weight

[[old] SanguineRane]

Hey everyone,<br /><br />I was wondering if a lighter person with slower erg scores would have an advantage on the water over a heavier person with faster erg scores.<br /><br />For example,<br />I weigh 131 lbs and have a 7:06.8 2k score (from last year at crashbs) and a 22:56.0 6k score. Would I have an advantage on the water over a 160 lb person who has a score of.. lets say.. ten seconds better? (assuming that the technique and all other conditions are the same)<br /><br />How much does the issue of weight v. erg score affect speed on the water?<br /><br />I was also wondering if colleges consider power to weight for lightweights, not just power?<br />I have heard that colleges are looking for lightweights who have 2k scores of 6:40s, and recruit lightweights with 6:30s heavily.<br />If i remain around the same weight when i apply to college next year and get a 6:49 would i be considered more than someone who weighed exactly 165 and had a 6:44?<br />I would like to continue rowing in college and i would like to row with the best, so I'm just a little anxious about that subject... <br /><br />okkay... i hope ppl reply to this thread<br /><br />Yup, thanks!

[[old] c2jonw]

sanguinerane, Check out this link: <br /><br /><a href='http://www.concept2.com/05/training/com ... ht_adj.asp' target='_blank'>http://www.concept2.com/05/training/com ... asp</a><br /><br />We recommend that coaches use this formula for comparing erg scores......Jon

[[old] slo_boat]

Good question! Heavier rowers ought to sit lower in the water (everything else being equal), and that should create more drag which should offset the gain from the extra strength from more muscle mass. <br /><br /><i>Here are two questions for the rest of the forum that relate to the original post. </i><br /><br />With the changes in materials technology, are most boats fairly similar?<br /><br />Are there wide variations in length overall, length at water line, beam, freeboard, etc. in boats used for competition? <br /><br />I'm asking because it seems to me that a boat builder would build a different boat for a heavy than for a light, and with different boat designs, rowers' weight differences should not be as big an issue.<br /><br />It's been a long time since I was in college, and my program was a club program not a varsity program (meaning no money). I remember getting hammered by schools with better boats. Ours were old and heavy and we got a workout just getting from the trailer to the dock!

[[old] PaulS]

<!--QuoteBegin-slo_boat+Sep 22 2005, 06:12 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(slo_boat @ Sep 22 2005, 06:12 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Good question! Heavier rowers ought to sit lower in the water (everything else being equal), and that should create more drag which should offset the gain from the extra strength from more muscle mass. <br /><br /><i>Here are two questions for the rest of the forum that relate to the original post. </i><br /><br />With the changes in materials technology, are most boats fairly similar?<br /><br />Are there wide variations in length overall, length at water line, beam, freeboard, etc. in boats used for competition? <br /><br />I'm asking because it seems to me that a boat builder would build a different boat for a heavy than for a light, and with different boat designs, rowers' weight differences should not be as big an issue.<br /><br />It's been a long time since I was in college, and my program was a club program not a varsity program (meaning no money). I remember getting hammered by schools with better boats. Ours were old and heavy and we got a workout just getting from the trailer to the dock! <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />There is a FISA minimum weight standard for each boat class, and most boats are built very near that specification, as the general perception is "light = fast", regardless of the lack of any form of substantiation.<br /><br />Hull design has not made any signifigant advances in many years, and frankly there probably is not much that can be done there after the many years that it evolved into what it has.<br /><br />Some Boat builders do have distinct moulds for various weight ranges, a matter of accurately scaling the "standard design". This is a very expensive way to go, but a worthwhile pursuit for the top of the line performance.<br /><br />The winning times in World Class competition (M8+, the fastest boat class) have remained statistically Flat for the last 20 years. (pretty much the same time that the lighter materials have been in comon use).<br /><br />Another experiment that was reported on in The Rowing News, that was testing 'Equipment from different eras', resulted in the fastest time being done by the lightest rower using the heaviest and oldest equipment. Overall conclusion was that there was a bit of an edge to the most modern equipment, however more importantly, "It's the horse, not the Chariot."<br /><br />Stephen Sieler had done some good comparisons between hwt and lwt boats, and the speed difference is very small, as you suggest, due to equalizing factors, being heavy is an obvious disadvantage on the water however I have yet to hear of a hwt ever suggest that there should be some form of "adjustment factor" regarding that.

[[old] Porkchop]

<!--QuoteBegin-PaulS+Sep 22 2005, 08:37 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(PaulS @ Sep 22 2005, 08:37 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I have yet to hear of a hwt ever suggest that there should be some form of "adjustment factor" regarding that.  <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><b><span style='color:red'><span style='font-size:21pt;line-height:100%'>N-O-O-O-O! Why would you tempt fate like this Paul?</span></span></b>

[[old] PaulS]

<!--QuoteBegin-Porkchop+Sep 22 2005, 07:10 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(Porkchop @ Sep 22 2005, 07:10 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin-PaulS+Sep 22 2005, 08:37 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(PaulS @ Sep 22 2005, 08:37 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I have yet to hear of a hwt ever suggest that there should be some form of "adjustment factor" regarding that.   <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><b><span style='color:red'><span style='font-size:21pt;line-height:100%'>N-O-O-O-O! Why would you tempt fate like this Paul?</span></span></b> <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />Because of a lot of faith in hwts being happy with accepting their place in the speed orders... The Top. <br /><br />And of course, I can't help but niggle lwts, who only have a 'special' class due to the benevolence of hwts that had enough compassion to allow the lighties an opportunity to earn shiney bits of metal of their own. (Aside from the coxies) <br />

[[old] Porkchop]

<!--QuoteBegin-PaulS+Sep 22 2005, 10:33 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(PaulS @ Sep 22 2005, 10:33 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin-Porkchop+Sep 22 2005, 07:10 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(Porkchop @ Sep 22 2005, 07:10 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin-PaulS+Sep 22 2005, 08:37 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(PaulS @ Sep 22 2005, 08:37 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I have yet to hear of a hwt ever suggest that there should be some form of "adjustment factor" regarding that.   <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><b><span style='color:red'><span style='font-size:21pt;line-height:100%'>N-O-O-O-O! Why would you tempt fate like this Paul?</span></span></b> <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />Because of a lot of faith in hwts being happy with accepting their place in the speed orders... The Top. <br /><br />And of course, I can't help but niggle lwts, who only have a 'special' class due to the benevolence of hwts that had enough compassion to allow the lighties an opportunity to earn shiney bits of metal of their own. (Aside from the coxies) <br /> </td></tr></table><br />Yes, all of that is true, but now we'll have to supplement the "Slide Fund" with a substantially larger "Boat Fund" in order to keep the peace.

[[old] PaulH]

On a related note, any thoughts on the coxswain slide available on Kaschper's 8s? Innovating for speed, or cheating?

[[old] PaulS]

<!--QuoteBegin-PaulH+Sep 22 2005, 11:34 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(PaulH @ Sep 22 2005, 11:34 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->On a related note, any thoughts on the coxswain slide available on Kaschper's 8s?  Innovating for speed, or cheating? <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />My vote goes for "Comical". <br /><br />Seriously, a 55kg cox slamming about to dampen the effects of a 700kg Crew? our coxie would get a sore back from the boat "punching" him just after the catch, I can't imagine him wanting to slam back any harder.

[[old] SanguineRane]

<!--QuoteBegin-c2jonw+Sep 22 2005, 07:09 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(c2jonw @ Sep 22 2005, 07:09 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->sanguinerane,  Check out this link:  <br /><br /><a href='http://www.concept2.com/05/training/com ... ht_adj.asp' target='_blank'>http://www.concept2.com/05/training/com ... asp</a><br /><br />We recommend that coaches use this formula for comparing erg scores......Jon <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />ooo<br />Your weight factor is 0.852<br />Adjusted Score:<br />Your adjusted time in hh:mm:ss format: 06:03.3<br />Adjusted Score:<br />Your adjusted distance in meters is: 2,348.3<br />so.. that means, if there were 8 of me rowing a perfect 2k, i should be able to get a 6:03.3??<br />do coaches at colleges calculate with these formulas when recruiting?<br />

[[old] csabour]

Your weight factor is 0.870<br /><br />Adjusted Score:<br />Your adjusted time in hh:mm:ss format: 06:16.6<br />Adjusted Score:<br />Your adjusted distance in meters is: 2,299.5

[[old] Peter S]

Personally I love the weight adjuster especially because I row on a team of mostly heavyweights and it gives me a chance to be on top =P. <br /><br />Your weight factor is:0.875<br /><br />2k<br />Adjusted Score:<br />Your adjusted time in hh:mm:ss format: 05:56.9<br />Adjusted Score:<br />Your adjusted distance in meters is: 2,285.6<br /><br />6k<br />Adjusted Score:<br />Your adjusted time in hh:mm:ss format: 19:16.8<br />Adjusted Score:<br />Your adjusted distance in meters is: 6,856.7

[[old] fergie]

hey, don't mean to hijack, but anyway...<br /><br />I'm from New Zealand, planning on going to University next year (Tertiary education - your College??)<br />Does anyone know of any scholarship programs that US colleges offer for LWT rowers?<br />I'm keen as to go to the US for education (if i go to a NZ uni, i'm gonna go on a exhcange for a year) and thought i could use my Sporting performances to help me do so!<br /><br />I'm 18 (just turned) 74.5kg (prolly a few kgs of fat tho!) whats the limit for LWT outdoor rowers?<br />1k time = 3.07<br />2k = 6.39<br /><br />Your weight factor is 0.896<br />Adjusted Score:<br />Your adjusted time in hh:mm:ss format: 05:58.2 (I WISH!)<br />Adjusted Score:<br />Your adjusted distance in meters is: 2,233.3

[[old] Peter S]

You won't find any "scholarships" for lightweights in the United States, but you will find schools that will "give you help" if you go to their schools as far as weight works, its 165.0 lb. usually with no average but for juniors it ranges from 155-160 in the fall then in spring everything changes. Also most crews race open in the fall if they do any head races. For varsity and jv spring races its 160lbs max with a 155lbs average throughout the boat. For some reason i want to say freshman are 150lbs average and 155 max but I am not sure on that one, the only thing im sure on is the Varsity and JV squads are 160 max and 155 average. Try row2k.com and go to links and browse through the colleges and email the coaches