How many Gym users vs Erg owners ? - Apps potential ?
- jackarabit
- Marathon Poster
- Posts: 5838
- Joined: June 14th, 2014, 9:51 am
Re: How many Gym users vs Erg owners ? - Apps potential ?
While we wait for Edward:
There is wear and tear owing to deferred maintenance. Unlubed and rusty chains stretch and wear the gullets on the sprocket. Eventually the chain rides on top of the sprocket teeth and skips. Shock cords deform and stretch and aren't adjusted or replaced resulting in slow chain return at recovery.
There is wear and tear owing to misuse or abuse. Some folks get a bit rammy and release the handle with chain extended because they find their own performance offensive or they've mistaken erging for inhaling fly spray thru a TP tube and think they're entitled to take the machine down right before they pass out. The result is what ergmeister (another C2 wrench) termed a bowed chain. A laterally bowed chain saws away at the sides of the sprocket teeth. Bowed chains are also the mark of those dear souls who think the erg is a GP cable row machine with a fan instead of a weight stack. Their weird oblique stretching routines shred the black plastic in the chain gate. That is only the tell for the chain deformation that produces the scrubbing/sawing noise that says a relatively new machine is succumbing to premature and unnecessary wear. My favorite is clickedy-clacking over a respectable divot in the stainless rail about 1200 times per medium distance workout. This can happen where heavy objects are used to check that gravity is working properly.
I got no use for apes OR brain-dead yoginis but without them gymworld would be just too perfect and we'd need something else to complain of. Jack
There is wear and tear owing to deferred maintenance. Unlubed and rusty chains stretch and wear the gullets on the sprocket. Eventually the chain rides on top of the sprocket teeth and skips. Shock cords deform and stretch and aren't adjusted or replaced resulting in slow chain return at recovery.
There is wear and tear owing to misuse or abuse. Some folks get a bit rammy and release the handle with chain extended because they find their own performance offensive or they've mistaken erging for inhaling fly spray thru a TP tube and think they're entitled to take the machine down right before they pass out. The result is what ergmeister (another C2 wrench) termed a bowed chain. A laterally bowed chain saws away at the sides of the sprocket teeth. Bowed chains are also the mark of those dear souls who think the erg is a GP cable row machine with a fan instead of a weight stack. Their weird oblique stretching routines shred the black plastic in the chain gate. That is only the tell for the chain deformation that produces the scrubbing/sawing noise that says a relatively new machine is succumbing to premature and unnecessary wear. My favorite is clickedy-clacking over a respectable divot in the stainless rail about 1200 times per medium distance workout. This can happen where heavy objects are used to check that gravity is working properly.
I got no use for apes OR brain-dead yoginis but without them gymworld would be just too perfect and we'd need something else to complain of. Jack
There are two types of people in this world: Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data
M_77_5'-7"_156lb
M_77_5'-7"_156lb
Re: How many Gym users vs Erg owners ? - Apps potential ?
I have an original 28 year old Model B (PM2) and a used (barely, when I bought it)) 13 year old Model C (PM3) on slides. I also have access to four Navy base gym ergs. All the comments about gym ergs and the users above are true, except the Navy replaces them about every two or three years, so they are not in really bad shape, usually just very dirty. Not many dedicated erg workout types in the Navy gyms either.
My motivation to train (read: endure pain) for the 2K races has waned, but the desire is still there, so I approached a Crossfit box to maintain their ergs and monitors with the idea that maybe I could find a training partner that would push me. They were receptive, but not really enthusiastic. I gave their instructors a short seminar on proper form, but their main interest was in the "rerow" feature on the PM3 and doing 1000 meter pieces as a warmup. Didn't find a training buddy.
As far as apps go, I can't see the typical gym goers using any dedicated rowing apps. They would first have to learn how to properly use the erg, then get excited about it, discover the competitions, and then start looking around for training tools. The apps I see being popular for the general public would be music or video player apps built into the monitor, which would be wifi and Bluetooth capable, and allow individual login so they could use their own playlists. Sort of like an iPhone capability in the monitor, which would have a larger screen for visuals. I'd go for something like that on my own ergs; right now I just use a TV/DVD/CD player with headphones.
I'm not a really tech-savvy guy however, so I'm probably behind the curve here, but I have seen Smartphone apps and devices being fit to the erg, so maybe it is a coming thing. C2, are you doing anything along these lines? (I see ErgData, but that isn't built into the monitor, yet).
My motivation to train (read: endure pain) for the 2K races has waned, but the desire is still there, so I approached a Crossfit box to maintain their ergs and monitors with the idea that maybe I could find a training partner that would push me. They were receptive, but not really enthusiastic. I gave their instructors a short seminar on proper form, but their main interest was in the "rerow" feature on the PM3 and doing 1000 meter pieces as a warmup. Didn't find a training buddy.
As far as apps go, I can't see the typical gym goers using any dedicated rowing apps. They would first have to learn how to properly use the erg, then get excited about it, discover the competitions, and then start looking around for training tools. The apps I see being popular for the general public would be music or video player apps built into the monitor, which would be wifi and Bluetooth capable, and allow individual login so they could use their own playlists. Sort of like an iPhone capability in the monitor, which would have a larger screen for visuals. I'd go for something like that on my own ergs; right now I just use a TV/DVD/CD player with headphones.
I'm not a really tech-savvy guy however, so I'm probably behind the curve here, but I have seen Smartphone apps and devices being fit to the erg, so maybe it is a coming thing. C2, are you doing anything along these lines? (I see ErgData, but that isn't built into the monitor, yet).
Mark Underwood. Rower first, cyclist too.
Re: How many Gym users vs Erg owners ? - Apps potential ?
Just got mine in July and am glad I did. One of the best pieces of equipment I own.
Re: How many Gym users vs Erg owners ? - Apps potential ?
Used to use the one in the gym. Averaged 70k / month. Had my own 6 weeks. Average 50k/ week. Time was the main factor.
Dean
2020 Season: 196cm / 96kg : M51
Training Log - ʕʘ̅͜ʘ̅ʔ -Blog
~seven days without rowing makes one weak~
2020 Season: 196cm / 96kg : M51
Training Log - ʕʘ̅͜ʘ̅ʔ -Blog
~seven days without rowing makes one weak~
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- Paddler
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Re: How many Gym users vs Erg owners ? - Apps potential ?
I bought a Model D in June and average 35k meters a week on it at home. Best thing I did.
Lesley
57 yo, Not so fat erg rower!
57 yo, Not so fat erg rower!
Re: How many Gym users vs Erg owners ? - Apps potential ?
My gym has three ergs, two model Es and a model D. The model D is pretty beat and makes a lot of chain noise, so I don't use it. I don't suppose anybody ever lubricates the thing, I don't know.
The dampers are always set to 10. People never seem to spend more than ten minutes on a machine. Thank goodness there is no TV in front of it or I would never get a shot at it.
The people on here have been wonderful at helping me get me started and giving me advice on how to row. I just wish I had a machine in my apartment. I know I would row more. Perhaps after I get a killer body from erging, my wife will let me get a machine for home.
The dampers are always set to 10. People never seem to spend more than ten minutes on a machine. Thank goodness there is no TV in front of it or I would never get a shot at it.
The people on here have been wonderful at helping me get me started and giving me advice on how to row. I just wish I had a machine in my apartment. I know I would row more. Perhaps after I get a killer body from erging, my wife will let me get a machine for home.
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- 10k Poster
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- Joined: March 7th, 2014, 11:34 pm
Re: How many Gym users vs Erg owners ? - Apps potential ?
Since Larry re-opened this thread I'd figure I'd give you guys an interesting update. I got hooked up with a fairly large local crossfit box, Mt Laurel Crossfit in southern New Jersey. They have (26) ergs and it got to a point where the owner (great guy!) asked me to stop in once a week and keep his machines up and running, they just stack the dead ones off to the side and I get 'em up and running.
But more to the point,one of their members, Larry(not the OP), an older guy (my age, 58) whose a real endurance freak got a group together that does a 10k every Sunday morning. It's to a point where you have to get there early to get a machine, 20-30 people every week! I usually drop in and row with them. I'll take a small bit of credit, I did two erg seminars about six months ago and Larry just took it and ran with it. He sends out a weekly email with a 10k and 15k club, listing everyone's times, and now he's doing HM's. He's got a sub 40min (10k) grouping.....it's this type of interest from one motivated guy that can drive this type of thing. And they're all rowing with pretty solid technique.
They have a bit of an expensive issue they're working through. All but two of the machines are "C" s and the PM2's are failing. About half of them have been replaced with PM3's, and now PM5's. We have about twelve more to work through. The owner was curious about some sort of "dumbed down" less expensive monitor for average crossfit use. Reality, the market is way to "niche" and narrow to support this type of thing. And most users want more features....not less. Or if they're serious they need the ability to down load and verify results, connect heart rate etc.
But more to the point,one of their members, Larry(not the OP), an older guy (my age, 58) whose a real endurance freak got a group together that does a 10k every Sunday morning. It's to a point where you have to get there early to get a machine, 20-30 people every week! I usually drop in and row with them. I'll take a small bit of credit, I did two erg seminars about six months ago and Larry just took it and ran with it. He sends out a weekly email with a 10k and 15k club, listing everyone's times, and now he's doing HM's. He's got a sub 40min (10k) grouping.....it's this type of interest from one motivated guy that can drive this type of thing. And they're all rowing with pretty solid technique.
They have a bit of an expensive issue they're working through. All but two of the machines are "C" s and the PM2's are failing. About half of them have been replaced with PM3's, and now PM5's. We have about twelve more to work through. The owner was curious about some sort of "dumbed down" less expensive monitor for average crossfit use. Reality, the market is way to "niche" and narrow to support this type of thing. And most users want more features....not less. Or if they're serious they need the ability to down load and verify results, connect heart rate etc.
- Carl Watts
- Marathon Poster
- Posts: 4702
- Joined: January 8th, 2010, 4:35 pm
- Location: NEW ZEALAND
Re: How many Gym users vs Erg owners ? - Apps potential ?
Have said this elsewhere but its time Concept 2 just made a smart tach pickup with Bluetooth.
It sits down by the flywheel on the left where the current one sits so you have no wires at all and then it connects to your device.
The gym users then supply their own device and monitor problem is solved.
With that many people rowing at the same time, a RowPro App would be perfect you would easily fill two full rows with all 16 lanes full in both as others would join if you made it a scheduled row. Rather than two general heats you split them by pace to keep the rowing close in both. In general under 2:00 and over 2:00 works quite well with the general users but you may need to have something faster with a bunch of fit people to evenly split the field.
The Android and iOS version is coming of RowPro, C2 need to start working on the smart pickup.
It sits down by the flywheel on the left where the current one sits so you have no wires at all and then it connects to your device.
The gym users then supply their own device and monitor problem is solved.
With that many people rowing at the same time, a RowPro App would be perfect you would easily fill two full rows with all 16 lanes full in both as others would join if you made it a scheduled row. Rather than two general heats you split them by pace to keep the rowing close in both. In general under 2:00 and over 2:00 works quite well with the general users but you may need to have something faster with a bunch of fit people to evenly split the field.
The Android and iOS version is coming of RowPro, C2 need to start working on the smart pickup.
Carl Watts.
Age:56 Weight: 108kg Height:183cm
Concept 2 Monitor Service Technician & indoor rower.
http://log.concept2.com/profile/863525/log
Age:56 Weight: 108kg Height:183cm
Concept 2 Monitor Service Technician & indoor rower.
http://log.concept2.com/profile/863525/log
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- Joined: March 7th, 2014, 11:34 pm
Re: How many Gym users vs Erg owners ? - Apps potential ?
Interesting ideas Carl. I actually have the race venue software, a USB hub, and the cables to set it up. I'm experimenting with some offerings to the crossfit boxes once I get it all sorted out. I'm a bit of a dinosuar with the IT type of stuff, takes me a while to figure it all out. In my trade (heating and A/C) the instrumentation is all moving in that direction.Sending units with all of the info on the smart device. Cool stuff! Right now we're just doing a row on your own type of thing, nobodies on the same page, no synchronized start. But it's a great start having that many people involved.
Re: How many Gym users vs Erg owners ? - Apps potential ?
Nifty stuff. I was hoping to use the Bluetooth connection with the model E at the gym but I discovered that it has a PM4 unit so I would need a connection kit. Besides that, the firmware has to have been upgraded to a certain level. I need to do some research on that.
Anybody know a good coach in NYC? Would a few lessons help me nail down my technique? I'm new to this game. I'm not into CrossFit because of the way they throw around weights but it is neat that they row.
Anybody know a good coach in NYC? Would a few lessons help me nail down my technique? I'm new to this game. I'm not into CrossFit because of the way they throw around weights but it is neat that they row.
- Carl Watts
- Marathon Poster
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- Joined: January 8th, 2010, 4:35 pm
- Location: NEW ZEALAND
Re: How many Gym users vs Erg owners ? - Apps potential ?
You can see where its going though and thats the point. You realize that if you got everyone on RowPro at your single CrossFit gym you would immediately have the largest regular online rowing event in the world ?Edward4492 wrote:Interesting ideas Carl. I actually have the race venue software, a USB hub, and the cables to set it up. I'm experimenting with some offerings to the crossfit boxes once I get it all sorted out. I'm a bit of a dinosuar with the IT type of stuff, takes me a while to figure it all out. In my trade (heating and A/C) the instrumentation is all moving in that direction.Sending units with all of the info on the smart device. Cool stuff! Right now we're just doing a row on your own type of thing, nobodies on the same page, no synchronized start. But it's a great start having that many people involved.
Then try and imagine all the other gyms across the world coming online, essentially what it would mean is that anyone could get online at anytime day or night and find a row with a full 16 lanes and others rowing at your pace or find others to race with. There would be so many online the rows could start to become more specialized, i.e "Race" or just "Training" and even set-up with pace bands if you get enough people because its so much more fun rowing besides someone than on your own in blue water.
This would have to be the ultimate rowing set-up. It will come but its taking way to long to align the right hardware and software.
There are a few souls that like thrashing away in their basement on their own but I believe these are the minority. Make it easy to get online and those coming through in their 20's will just carry it through, they have the tech savvy to make it happen.
Last edited by Carl Watts on February 13th, 2016, 5:46 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Carl Watts.
Age:56 Weight: 108kg Height:183cm
Concept 2 Monitor Service Technician & indoor rower.
http://log.concept2.com/profile/863525/log
Age:56 Weight: 108kg Height:183cm
Concept 2 Monitor Service Technician & indoor rower.
http://log.concept2.com/profile/863525/log
Re: How many Gym users vs Erg owners ? - Apps potential ?
Try starting a new thread in "Training" w/ a title something like "Recommend a technique coach in NYC?" This question is buried in a thread that may not attract the attention of the people who can best answer your question.LarryRow wrote:Anybody know a good coach in NYC? Would a few lessons help me nail down my technique? I'm new to this game. I'm not into CrossFit because of the way they throw around weights but it is neat that they row.
Just a idea,
Alissa
Re: How many Gym users vs Erg owners ? - Apps potential ?
Good point, Alissa. I'll do that once I get past an issue with my Achilles.Alissa wrote:Try starting a new thread in "Training" w/ a title something like "Recommend a technique coach in NYC?" This question is buried in a thread that may not attract the attention of the people who can best answer your question.LarryRow wrote:Anybody know a good coach in NYC? Would a few lessons help me nail down my technique? I'm new to this game. I'm not into CrossFit because of the way they throw around weights but it is neat that they row.
Just a idea,
Alissa