Ranger - News To Shock

[old] ranger · Post by **[old] ranger** » January 28th, 2006, 9:59 am

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>Depends on what "is" is. or on this case, the definition of "indefinitely." If "indefinitely" = 2, maybe. If "indefinitely" >64, never. </td></tr></table><br /><br />Might be an interesting thing to try. I did 80 x 250 @ 1:36 and 40 x 500m @ 1:39 a few years ago rowing with bad technique at max drag. Rowing at low drag with good technique, I think I am now four seconds per 500m better on many workouts, and this might be one of them.<br /><br />A minute on, a minute off, for two hours. <br /><br />Hmm.<br /><br />Sure would be a great workout, if I could not only get it done but do it regularly.<br /><br />ranger

[old] FrancoisA · Post by **[old] FrancoisA** » January 28th, 2006, 12:02 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(ranger @ Jan 28 2006, 07:03 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>The kind of fitness that a regimen such as this maintains can be checked pretty easily with various tasks. Can you go out and run 10-15 miles at a good clip with little distress? Can swim a mile with no problem? Can you do 20-30 pull ups, 20-30 extension press ups, 50 or so jackknives? Can you jump rope double time for 10-15 minutes? Can you jump rope single time for an hour with no problem?[right] <br /> </td></tr></table><br />Swimming a mile with no problem? <br />Ranger, are you kidding?! This is just a little warm-up and doesn't measure fitness at all! <br />What about 100 x 100m on a 1:30 send-off pace? Now we are talking!

[old] John Rupp · Post by **[old] John Rupp** » January 28th, 2006, 1:11 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(FrancoisA @ Jan 28 2006, 08:02 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>What about 100 x 100m on a 1:30 send-off pace? Now we are talking! </td></tr></table><br /><br />100 x 1:30 would take 150 minutes, i.e. 2 hours and 30 minutes to complete.<br /><br />I like it! <br /><br />What pace do you do for the 100's?<br /><br />Have you done this session on the erg?<br />

[old] John Rupp · Post by **[old] John Rupp** » January 28th, 2006, 1:12 pm

Do you swim this type of workout every day?<br /><br />I've noticed that Mike Phelps usually does 9000 meters a session.<br /><br />x 3 this is equivalent of 27,000 meters on the erg, and his double sessions of 18,000 meters are equivalent of 54,000 meters or so on the erg.

[old] FrancoisA · Post by **[old] FrancoisA** » January 28th, 2006, 1:42 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(John Rupp @ Jan 28 2006, 05:11 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(FrancoisA @ Jan 28 2006, 08:02 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>What about 100 x 100m on a 1:30 send-off pace? Now we are talking! </td></tr></table><br /><br />100 x 1:30 would take 150 minutes, i.e. 2 hours and 30 minutes to complete.<br /><br />I like it! <br /><br />What pace do you do for the 100's?<br /><br />Have you done this session on the erg? <br /> </td></tr></table><br />John, I would do the intervals at a comfortable 1:25.<br />On the erg, it would be more like 100 x 330m on 1:30, which I have not done! <br /><br />I swim about 6k every day. The most I have done in one day was two workouts of 6k each. Although I have not done the 100x100m, last year, some of the varsity swimmers I train with, and that are about my speed and endurance level, did it.<br /><br />My point was to show that Ranger's criteria for fitness are rather Ranger-centric! <br /><br />Cheers!<br /><br />Francois

[old] kinley · Post by **[old] kinley** » January 28th, 2006, 1:55 pm

<br /><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'> My point was to show that Ranger's criteria for fitness are rather Ranger-centric! <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />This is a news flash?<br />

[old] John Rupp · Post by **[old] John Rupp** » January 28th, 2006, 2:07 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(FrancoisA @ Jan 28 2006, 09:42 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>John, I would do the intervals at a comfortable 1:25. </td></tr></table><br /><br />So you would take 5s rest between each?<br />

[old] Ducatista · Post by **[old] Ducatista** » January 28th, 2006, 2:13 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(ranger)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>The kind of fitness that a regimen such as this maintains can be checked pretty easily with various tasks. Can you go out and run 10-15 miles at a good clip with little distress? Can swim a mile with no problem? Can you do 20-30 pull ups, 20-30 extension press ups, 50 or so jackknives? Can you jump rope double time for 10-15 minutes? Can you jump rope single time for an hour with no problem? Can you jump up 10-15 times in a row, touching your toes, like a cheerleader? Can you do a V-sit, hanging on a bar, or a minute or so? Can you bike 100 miles at a good clip with no problem? Can you do 75 push ups? <br /><br />It seems to me that the first requirement of a top notch rower, at least at our age, is that they just be an exceptional overall athlete. </td></tr></table><br />Funny that you include swimming among your tests. Swimming doesn't give much credence to your "must do lots of everything" rule. <br /><br />Most things on your list are comically out of my reach. I doubt I could jump rope for more than 30 seconds. Even one unassisted pull-up is out of the question. Just started running last Monday, and for my first set of 3min run/2min walk, I ended the run <i>fifty seconds early.</i> Yup. Never could jump like a cheerleader, thank god, though in my pom-pon days I could high-kick behind my ear. Bike? Dunno, haven't owned one in years. And about the only time I row more than 8K in one sitting is during the HC.<br /><br />But... I can swim a mile in my sleep. Two miles at a good clip is a pleasant pick-me-up. The Ironman Wisconsin swim takes place a few blocks from my house. I love watching it, knowing that my slackass, vice-loving self could spank a decent percentage of those highly trained, shockingly fit elite athletes in the water. "Yo, splashy! Try a little body fat!" Heh.<br /><br />No offense to any Ironman-ers here. It's an amazing event. I love that we have a qualifier in town.

[old] FrancoisA · Post by **[old] FrancoisA** » January 28th, 2006, 2:13 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(John Rupp @ Jan 28 2006, 06:07 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(FrancoisA @ Jan 28 2006, 09:42 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>John, I would do the intervals at a comfortable 1:25. </td></tr></table><br /><br />So you would take 5s rest between each? <br /> </td></tr></table><br />Yes, 1:30 - 1:25 = 0:05

[old] FrancoisA · Post by **[old] FrancoisA** » January 28th, 2006, 2:33 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(Ducatista @ Jan 28 2006, 06:13 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>But... I can swim a mile in my sleep. Two miles at a good clip is a pleasant pick-me-up. The Ironman Wisconsin swim takes place a few blocks from my house. I love watching it, knowing that my slackass, vice-loving self could spank a decent percentage of those highly trained, shockingly fit elite athletes in the water. "Yo, splashy! Try a little body fat!" Heh.<br /><br />No offense to any Ironman-ers here. It's an amazing event. I love that we have a qualifier in town. <br /> </td></tr></table>Glad to know that you are a good swimmer Ducatista! <br /><br />I agree with you that most triathletes, even with the help of their wetsuits, are quite average swimmers. Swimming is very technical, and unless you've done a lot of it when young, it is almost impossible to excel at it as an adult.

[old] John Rupp · Post by **[old] John Rupp** » January 28th, 2006, 3:05 pm

I'd say Phelps could do 100x 100 on 1:30 in 60 to 65s or so.<br /><br />Swimming is a great background for rowing, as it develops the upper body, breathing etc. It might be a better background then anything else, except lots of resistance training. <br /><br />Swimming is highly dependent on body type, and body fat. Someone with a lot of body fat can float along on top of the water, and not worry about sinking or breathing etc. On the other hand, having a lot of muscle in the legs makes swimming very difficult. Technique aside, I think this is the primary reason runners have a harder time being able to swim well.<br /><br />Personally I would love to swim but, from concern the chlorine was going to do me in, had to give it up a few years ago.

[old] FrancoisA · Post by **[old] FrancoisA** » January 28th, 2006, 4:07 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(Ducatista @ Jan 28 2006, 06:13 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>The Ironman Wisconsin swim takes place a few blocks from my house. <br /> </td></tr></table><br />The Ironman Wisconsin was won by Dave Harju in 2003 and 2004. Dave lives in our region and I had the chance to see him training at our swimming pool. When you see him in the flesh, you know that you are in the presence of someone very special; he is a superb athlete who radiates with confidence and energy. Yet, swimming is not his best part of the triathlon, and quite frankly, I wasn't impress with his technique or his splits. I am sure he could be better if he would spend a lot more time in the pool, but that would probably be detrimental to his biking and running, and ultimately to his performance in the ironman.<br /><br />Which bring us to the question: how do you define fitness ?<br />In Joe Friel's <i>The Triathlete's Training Bible</i>, there are some enlightening paragraphs about specificity:<br /><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>Fitness is specific to training. In other words, you won't reach peak triathlon or duathlon fitness by jumping rope, doing aerobics or rock climbing. High levels of triathlon fitness require swimming, cycling and running. Some crossover may result from other endurance activities, primarily in the heart and lungs and their related structures, but this is minimal considering all that is necessary for multisport fitness.<br /><br />For the best results, the training stress must follow two maxims. First, it should have a pattern of joint and muscle coordination that is specific to the sport. Second, the exercise must place specific duration and intensity stresses on specific muscles. An example may explain these maxims. Running and cross-country skiing appear quite similar since many of the same muscles are used in almost the same manner. Yet scientific studies have shown that there is no relationship between the aerobic capacities of running and cross-country skiing. Aerobic capacity is one measure of endurance fitness. Someone trained for skiing who never runs is likely to have a high aerobic capacity when skiing, but not when running. To achieve peak fitness for running, you must run.<br /><br />Does this mean you should never do anything except swim, bike and run? No. There are good reasons to include other activities, especially during a period of preparation many weeks or months before the racing begins. These reasons may include mental breaks from the exercise routine, bad weather, injury avoidance, recovery and development of the most basic fitness element. But consider all such exercise a supplement to, and not a substitute for, multisport training. </td></tr></table><br />

[old] Ducatista · Post by **[old] Ducatista** » January 28th, 2006, 4:25 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(FrancoisA)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>In Joe Friel's <i>The Triathlete's Training Bible</i>, there are some enlightening paragraphs about specificity: </td></tr></table><br />Interesting stuff. It makes me feel ever-so-slightly better about my dismal first run on Monday. <br /><br />I'm perfectly happy on my Model C, but I know superfit runners who won't even make eye contact with the erg in the gym because "it's too hard." I, on the other hand, have always considered running "too hard" and have successfully avoided it most of my life. I do think the Holiday Challenge boosted my CV fitness enough that I didn't experience the dreaded Burning Lung on run #1. It was Burning Leg that brought me down. I improved measurably on Runs #2 & #3, I'm happy to say. Only 114 runs to go before the Chicago Marathon. Piece o' cake.

[old] FrancoisA · Post by **[old] FrancoisA** » January 28th, 2006, 5:38 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(John Rupp @ Jan 28 2006, 07:05 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>I'd say Phelps could do 100x 100 on 1:30 in 60 to 65s or so.<br /><br />Swimming is a great background for rowing, as it develops the upper body, breathing etc. It might be a better background then anything else, except lots of resistance training. <br /><br />Swimming is highly dependent on body type, and body fat. Someone with a lot of body fat can float along on top of the water, and not worry about sinking or breathing etc. On the other hand, having a lot of muscle in the legs makes swimming very difficult. Technique aside, I think this is the primary reason runners have a harder time being able to swim well.<br /><br />Personally I would love to swim but, from concern the chlorine was going to do me in, had to give it up a few years ago. <br /> </td></tr></table><br />John, <br /><br />Having some body fat helps with buoyancy. Also if one's muscles are too salient, it creates extra drag. That being said, I had the chance of spending one day at the World Championship this summer and in the following pictures that I took, you will find that swimmers are not anorexics, but lean nonetheless!<br /><br />Here is one of Crocker and Phelps in the 100m fly final:<br /><br /><img src='http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e260/ ... 100fly.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' /><br /><br /><br />Here is one of Reimer, a Canadian who finished 2nd in the 800m free.<br /><br /><img src='http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e260/ ... _Start.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' /><br /><br /><br />Here is another one of Micheal Klim during warmup:<br /><br /><img src='http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e260/ ... l_Klim.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' /><br /><br />And this last one of an unknown (to me) USA swimmer:<br /><br /><img src='http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e260/ ... er_USA.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' />

[old] NavigationHazard · Post by **[old] NavigationHazard** » January 29th, 2006, 10:42 am

According to the schedule, Ranger ought to be racing in Cincinnati as I type this. Anyone who has a result is invited to post it here....

Concept2 Forum

Ranger - News To Shock

Competitions

Competitions

Competitions

Competitions

Competitions

Competitions

Competitions

Competitions

Competitions

Competitions

Competitions

Competitions

Competitions

Competitions

Competitions