Ranger - News To Shock

[[old] ranger]

<!--QuoteBegin--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->"no free lunch" </td></tr></table><br /><br />I don't expect any free lunch, Paul. For the same price, I would just prefer steak to salami!<br /><br />Again, my impression is that much of the increased duration of the drive at high drag is just more hanging on the handle, at 188 df., right into the finish, which isn't (in itself) that stressful at all. It is just flying the rail rather than riding it! <br /><br />I have plenty of time (six weeks) to keep tinkering with this technically and testing my endurance with it at various distances. Some hard 5Ks should tell the story, as should 4 x 2K.<br /><br />At the moment, though, my first impression is that my technique and efficiency is fine at high drag, with very little additional energy cost. <br /><br />In addition to developing more leg strength and speed, which is just a natural spin off from rowing a lot of low rate meters at high stroking power, as I have been doing, I think my major technical advance over last year has been in the sequencing and rhythmicization of the levers in the drive, including the big hang on the handle from the middle of the drive into the finish. If the levers in the drive are sequenced smoothly and precisely, I think that rowing at high drag is tolerable and the results substantial.<br /><br />ranger

[[old] ranger]

<!--QuoteBegin--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Well whatever works for you I suppose. But I can't help thinking : he is changing a lot at the last moment. </td></tr></table><br /><br />This isn't the last moment. There are six weeks of sharpening left before WIRC.<br /><br />Yes, this switch does indeed work for me. This is exactly the switch I made in the fall of 2003, and at just the same time, just as I was starting to sharpen. Result: two world record rows (USIRT, BIRC) and two major championship golds (BIRC, EIRC).<br /><br />It is hard to argue with success.<br /><br />ranger

[[old] PaulS]

<!--QuoteBegin-ranger+Jan 10 2006, 07:09 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(ranger @ Jan 10 2006, 07:09 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I have plenty of time (six weeks) to keep tinkering with this technically and testing my endurance with it at various distances. Some hard 5Ks should tell the story, as should 4 x 2K.<br /><br />At the moment, though, my first impression is that my technique and efficiency is fine at high drag, with very little additional energy cost. <br /><br />ranger <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />A single 2k will be what tells the story. <br /><br />You are finding no trouble with the transition to "erg tricks" just as has been discussed many times, just don't forget that it's due to the other training and doesn't require a lot of time. i.e. Rowers don't practice teh wrong thing, they just do it for Erg Tests (if they choose to).<br />

[[old] ranger]

<!--QuoteBegin--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->A single 2k will be what tells the story.  <br /><br />You are finding no trouble with the transition to "erg tricks" just as has been discussed many times, just don't forget that it's due to the other training and doesn't require a lot of time. i.e. Rowers don't practice teh wrong thing, they just do it for Erg Tests (if they choose to). </td></tr></table><br /><br />Yes, what I am doing to race has nothing to do with why the change is working. It is working because my (good, new) technique is strong, stable, and (now) fully mastered. When I tried doing this last year for BIRC, my technique collapsed.<br /><br />A single 2K will tell the story?<br /><br />Not necessarily. I will be racing six times this winter, over the six weeks left for sharpening in the run up to WIRC. Over a sharpening period, I usually get about 10 seconds better in the 2K. So the first 2K might not tell the whole tale at all. There might be even more adjustment to make this time between training and racing, too, given how long it has been since I raced and the technical advances I have made during that time, but I am looking forward to working through problems as they arise. <br /><br />ranger

[[old] PaulS]

<!--QuoteBegin-ranger+Jan 10 2006, 07:44 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(ranger @ Jan 10 2006, 07:44 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->A single 2k will be what tells the story.  </td></tr></table><br /><br />A single 2K will tell the story?<br /><br />Not necessarily. I will be racing six times this winter, over the six weeks left for sharpening in the run up to WIRC. Over a sharpening period, I usually get about 10 seconds better in the 2K. So the first 2K might not tell the whole tale at all. There might be even more adjustment to make this time between training and racing, too, given how long it has been since I raced and the technical advances I have made during that time, but I am looking forward to working through problems as they arise. <br /><br />ranger <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />Follow me now. You said a 4 x 2k would "tell the story", and I responded, "A single 2k will be what tells the story", NOT that "A single particular 2k will tell the story".<br /><br />You have yet to do a recent single 2k (at race pace, without breaks), which is of course, a VERY LONG STORY.

[[old] hjs]

A single 2K will tell the story?<br /><br />Not necessarily. I will be racing six times this winter, over the six weeks left for sharpening in the run up to WIRC. Over a sharpening period, I usually get about 10 seconds better in the 2K. So the first 2K might not tell the whole tale at all. There might be even more adjustment to make this time between training and racing, too, given how long it has been since I raced and the technical advances I have made during that time, but I am looking forward to working through problems as they arise. <br /><br />ranger <br />[/quote]<br /><br /><br />Lets say a single finished 2 k will tell the story. reading this post a get the feeling you are not al that selfconvident. Improving 10 sec in 6 weeks sharpening seems a lot. But maybe it logical. Reading your postings you never do (maybe you do, but you never post them) some test trainings. For me personally is't almost al the time just doing the race and the time that come's out is never far from what my training is telling me. <br />10 sec. 2,5 on the split. pfff that's a lot.

[[old] ranger]

<!--QuoteBegin--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->10 sec. 2,5 on the split. pfff that's a lot. </td></tr></table><br /><br />The size of this improvement is just a product of the way I train. I build a big foundation during which I avoid racing. Then I sharpen and race--repeatedly. Many rowers are always sharpening; therefore, test pieces are usually close to their potential. Not so for me. For me, the story this winter won't be fully told until the last of the six races: WIRC. <br /><br />ranger

[[old] ranger]

<!--QuoteBegin--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->You have yet to do a recent single 2k </td></tr></table><br /><br />I don't think it matters, Paul. I have a lot of sharpening to do still. A 2K rowed now, without proper sharpening, would say very little. The foundation is there--like a rock. But the gem still needs to be cut and polished. I will be taking my mountainous foundation to the jewelers over the next six weeks!<br /><br />ranger

[[old] PaulS]

<!--QuoteBegin-hjs+Jan 10 2006, 08:09 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(hjs @ Jan 10 2006, 08:09 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Lets say a single finished 2 k will tell the story. reading this post a get the feeling you are not al that selfconvident. Improving 10 sec in 6 weeks sharpening seems a lot. But maybe it logical. Reading your postings you never do (maybe you do, but you never post them) some test trainings. For me personally is't almost al the time just doing the race and the time that come's out is never far from what my training is telling me.  <br />10 sec.  2,5 on the split.  pfff that's a lot.  <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />Well, the real question is "where to start?"<br /><br />Ranger says "max potential is 6:16"<br />But also "goal is 6:24, or so"<br /><br />6:16 + 10 is 6:26, but maybe that's not a great place to start.<br /><br />6:24 + 10 is 6:34, but that would be his slowest 2k in 5 years, so that's probably not good either.<br /><br />6:27 would be his fastest 2k in the last 5 years, even beating his Overweight Crappy technique chain yanking that go this whole thing started, so perhaps that would be a reasonable goal.<br /><br />11 seconds slower than at least one "max potential" (there was something about a 6:08 somewhere), so with even a 50% of normal increase in speed, it would leave him at a 6:22.<br /><br />Sounds like a great story, but we still need a happy ending, and a lot less drama.

[[old] gw1]

<!--QuoteBegin--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Well, the real question is "where to start?" </td></tr></table><br /><br />I thought the first race target pace was going to be 1:36 and see how things were going at the 1500m mark.<br />That seems like a good starting point! <br /><br /><br />

[[old] PaulS]

<!--QuoteBegin-gw1+Jan 10 2006, 08:37 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(gw1 @ Jan 10 2006, 08:37 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Well, the real question is "where to start?" </td></tr></table><br /><br />I thought the first race target pace was going to be 1:36 and see how things were going at the 1500m mark.<br />That seems like a good starting point! <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />You mean like, "Do I need a break, or not?" <br /><br />That would sure come in under Sir Pirates 6:16 (gold brick production) requirement, if that's when things blow up. (I'm sure he meant a full 2k, but that's not what he said, exactly.) <br /><br />A 6:24 target right out of the gate could be a bit aggressive given the "normal course of sharpening". (not normal by anything I've ever seen, anyway.)

[[old] John Rupp]

<!--QuoteBegin--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->you want a DF that's going to take you through a 2k feeling relatively good all the way </td></tr></table><br /><!--QuoteBegin-ranger+Jan 10 2006, 12:18 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(ranger @ Jan 10 2006, 12:18 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Ebbeson and Luini are not 50. </td></tr></table><br /><br />Who can more easily carry a 100 pound weight down the street, a 25 year old or a 55 year old.<br /><br />There is your answer.<br />

[[old] John Rupp]

<!--QuoteBegin-ranger+Jan 10 2006, 01:36 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(ranger @ Jan 10 2006, 01:36 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->This is would be great for my goal of getting more and more continuous with 1:46 @ 20 spm (14.7 SPI). </td></tr></table><br /><br />1:46 is the pace for a 7:04 in the 2k.

[[old] PaulS]

<!--QuoteBegin-John Rupp+Jan 10 2006, 08:50 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(John Rupp @ Jan 10 2006, 08:50 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->you want a DF that's going to take you through a 2k feeling relatively good all the way </td></tr></table><br /><!--QuoteBegin-ranger+Jan 10 2006, 12:18 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(ranger @ Jan 10 2006, 12:18 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Ebbeson and Luini are not 50. </td></tr></table><br /><br />Who can more easily carry a 100 pound weight down the street, a 25 year old or a 55 year old.<br /><br />There is your answer. <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />It depends. But what's that got to do with anything? Please explain.<br /><br />Are you saying that 55yr olds are inherently weaker than 25 year olds? Very strange.

[[old] John Rupp]

<!--QuoteBegin-ranger+Jan 10 2006, 06:21 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(ranger @ Jan 10 2006, 06:21 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I now know how to row well. I am just choosing not to in this case. Why? In order to go as fast as I can on the erg. </td></tr></table><br /><br /> <br /><br />Great stuff! <br />