Split Times At 2000m's Competition?

[old] jfo · Post by **[old] jfo** » November 29th, 2005, 10:15 am

I am going to participate in my first competition. I can row 2000m in 7.20 minutes normally. When I have a coach shouting at me I can do it in 7.07 minutes but then I am almost dead afterwords. What should my pace be like at the competicion? -1.50/500 and then full speed for the last 300 meters? -Higher speed in the beginning? Please advice Jfo

[old] hjs · Post by **[old] hjs** » November 29th, 2005, 11:13 am

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(jfo @ Nov 29 2005, 03:15 PM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>I am going to participate in my first competition. I can row 2000m in 7.20 minutes normally. When I have a coach shouting at me I can do it in 7.07 minutes but then I am almost dead afterwords. What should my pace be like at the competicion? -1.50/500 and then full speed for the last 300 meters? -Higher speed in the beginning? Please advice Jfo </td></tr></table> a flat pace is best. start , settle within 10 strokes at your goal pace 147/48 en try to keep it there. Give it all you got the last 300 . that way you get the best result.

[old] Arno · Post by **[old] Arno** » November 29th, 2005, 11:21 am

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(jfo @ Nov 29 2005, 09:15 AM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>I am going to participate in my first competition. I can row 2000m in 7.20 minutes normally. When I have a coach shouting at me I can do it in 7.07 minutes but then I am almost dead afterwords. What should my pace be like at the competicion? -1.50/500 and then full speed for the last 300 meters? -Higher speed in the beginning? Please advice Jfo </td></tr></table> First competition! That's great. Important is that you feel great after it as well. Greatest danger is "fly and die" strategy. You know your potential quite well. You accomplish 7:20 by yourself and 7:07 with a shouting coach. Quite a difference. You should be confident with an even pace of 1:48 during the three first 500's. Do the last one a bit faster if you can. You will feel great afterwards. Avoid doing the first 500 in 1:45. It could kill you and your time will suffer and not only that..... mentally your next competition would be even more difficult. It is important that you can do it again and again with great confidence. good luck!

[old] Ray79 · Post by **[old] Ray79** » November 29th, 2005, 1:47 pm

Im a firm believer in the flat paced 2km as well. Decide on a target pace, get to it, stick to it and then empty the tanks in the last 300m. Others like to negative split throughout a 2km i.e speed up the 500m splits by a second per 500m. So you start at 1:49/500m, then 1:48/500m, 1:47/500m and 1:46/500m for the last. This is a 7:10 2km. Im not a fan of doing this because I dont seem to be able to pick it up like this, but is really is personal preference. Best of luck with your competition. Just come up with a plan and try to stick to it throughout your race.

[old] jfo · Post by **[old] jfo** » November 30th, 2005, 5:12 am

Thanks for your advice. How about the draft-factor. I have it at 110 but am concidering raising it a bit to lower the stroke-rate? Would that be a good idea? (can't really test it as copetition is on Saturday) What draft do you use? Jfo

[old] Ray79 · Post by **[old] Ray79** » November 30th, 2005, 6:57 am

Stick with the drag factor that you have been training at, especially since the race is on saturday or try out some small changes for a session or 2 and see how it feels. Just dont be tempted to jack up the drag too much. Upping the drag wont necessiarly allow you to lower the stroke rate. The erg re-calculates your pace every stroke and takes the drag factor into consideration when doing this so upping the drag will probably just make the machine feel heavier to you and will tire you more quickly.

[old] jfo · Post by **[old] jfo** » November 30th, 2005, 10:14 am

Ok...last question I have been told (by a very experienced rower) that you should not quite follow the instructions from Concept2: The Drive Begin the drive by pressing down your legs. Keep your arms straight and hold your back firm to transfer your leg power up to the handle. Gradually bend your arms and swing back with your upper body, prying against the legs until you reach a slight backward lean at the finish. He recommends to let your hips get slightly in front of your shoulders (towards the flywheel) just before the drive starts. I don't see why? Maybe in order NOT to involve the back in the work? Is that a good or a bad advice? Any experiences with this? Jfo

[old] Citroen · Post by **[old] Citroen** » November 30th, 2005, 3:17 pm

Mike Caviston gave this advice (on the Wolverine plan thread): 800m @ RP+1, 600m @ RP, 400m @ RP-1, 200m @ RP-2 To give 2000m @ RP average. I was all set to try that for BIRC, I ended up pulling 1:46.5 for 2000m just about as steadily as I could - with lots of encouragement from the coxswain behind me (she was brilliant). Result 7:04.9 PB (down from 7:10.0) I rowed mine at df 110, 32-34SPM So the plan was negative splits, the actuality was flat pace. I'd go flat paced again next time - it was easier to do that. The atmosphere at BIRC was very dry, so trying to concentrate on anything remotely complex when you're gasping for breath with what feels a knife wrapped in sandpaper down your throat would take a lot of effort. It may get easier to do the more fancy stuff with more racing experience.

[old] little weed · Post by **[old] little weed** » December 1st, 2005, 11:42 am

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(Citroen @ Nov 30 2005, 02:17 PM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>Mike Caviston gave this advice (on the Wolverine plan thread): 800m @ RP+1, 600m @ RP, 400m @ RP-1, 200m @ RP-2 To give 2000m @ RP average. </td></tr></table> i used this plan at home for my recent 2k pb. the idea of doing most of the distance at race pace and slower was appealing. it gave me a lot of confidence that i would be able to deal with the pain of the last 600m. i set the pm3 to 200m splits so that i could check how well i'd stayed on target (very well, i'm pleased to say!); this broke the race down into small chunks of under 1min each, which again was a psychological help. it was easy to keep to the plan as i was at home and familiar with my surroundings - i don't know if i would have kept my head in a competition. i'm going to keep using this plan. it suits me well so far. jane

[old] Gilesyb · Post by **[old] Gilesyb** » December 5th, 2005, 3:53 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(Arno @ Nov 29 2005, 04:21 PM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(jfo @ Nov 29 2005, 09:15 AM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>I am going to participate in my first competition. I can row 2000m in 7.20 minutes normally. When I have a coach shouting at me I can do it in 7.07 minutes but then I am almost dead afterwords. What should my pace be like at the competicion? -1.50/500 and then full speed for the last 300 meters? -Higher speed in the beginning? Please advice Jfo </td></tr></table> First competition! That's great. Important is that you feel great after it as well. Greatest danger is "fly and die" strategy. You know your potential quite well. You accomplish 7:20 by yourself and 7:07 with a shouting coach. Quite a difference. You should be confident with an even pace of 1:48 during the three first 500's. Do the last one a bit faster if you can. You will feel great afterwards. Avoid doing the first 500 in 1:45. It could kill you and your time will suffer and not only that..... mentally your next competition would be even more difficult. It is important that you can do it again and again with great confidence. good luck! </td></tr></table> Hi there, first poster here: I have always wanted to get people's views on this question. I am trying to break 6:40 for the 2k, and 16000 for the hour, and I have a feeling that my approach is all wrong; I tend to try to build up a reserve of X seconds ahead, and then see if I can last the third quarter, before trying to recover into the last. So 1:37, 1:43, 1:44, 1:40 would be typical of my pattern. Similarly for the hour: first 5k at 1:52, the next at 1:53.5, then see what is left. Have I been doing it all wrong? Is this "set a target, keep at that pace" approach better? Gilesyb 1k: 3:12.2. 2k: 6:44.6. 5K: 17:49.7 10k: 36:53.6 1hr, 15785

[old] hjs · Post by **[old] hjs** » December 5th, 2005, 4:35 pm

[quote=Gilesyb,Dec 5 2005, 08:53 PM] [quote=Arno,Nov 29 2005, 04:21 PM][quote=jfo,Nov 29 2005, 09:15 AM]I am going to participate in my first competition. I can row 2000m in 7.20 minutes normally. When I have a coach shouting at me I can do it in 7.07 minutes but then I am almost dead afterwords. What should my pace be like at the competicion? Hi there, first poster here: I have always wanted to get people's views on this question. I am trying to break 6:40 for the 2k, and 16000 for the hour, and I have a feeling that my approach is all wrong; I tend to try to build up a reserve of X seconds ahead, and then see if I can last the third quarter, before trying to recover into the last. So 1:37, 1:43, 1:44, 1:40 would be typical of my pattern. Similarly for the hour: first 5k at 1:52, the next at 1:53.5, then see what is left. Have I been doing it all wrong? Is this "set a target, keep at that pace" approach better? Gilesyb 1k: 3:12.2. 2k: 6:44.6. 5K: 17:49.7 10k: 36:53.6 1hr, 15785 [/quote] Pfff opening in 1.37 and then back to 1.44? thats seems almost een walk in the park I always start relatief easy. That means start fast and settle on racepace within 10 strokes. And I try to maintain that pace as long as possible. If I feel I can,t I let it eas very lightly, never 7 second. For me is slowing down more than 2 seconds the same as quiting. For the longer distances I would even start on a slower pace than I want to row. I always try to row the second half faster. But here also not to much. For example if I a wanted to row a 6 K in 1.42 I would start at 1.43 /43,5 for the first 2 k and after 3 k I would try to speed up a bit. To make it short, set a pace for yourself witch is not to hard and don't let it eas off. If it feels to hard just let I slow down a little and do this on time so you don,t have to slow down to much.

[old] mpukita · Post by **[old] mpukita** » December 5th, 2005, 4:58 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(Citroen @ Nov 30 2005, 03:17 PM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>Mike Caviston gave this advice (on the Wolverine plan thread): 800m @ RP+1, 600m @ RP, 400m @ RP-1, 200m @ RP-2 To give 2000m @ RP average. I was all set to try that for BIRC, I ended up pulling 1:46.5 for 2000m just about as steadily as I could - with lots of encouragement from the coxswain behind me (she was brilliant). Result 7:04.9 PB (down from 7:10.0) I rowed mine at df 110, 32-34SPM So the plan was negative splits, the actuality was flat pace. I'd go flat paced again next time - it was easier to do that. The atmosphere at BIRC was very dry, so trying to concentrate on anything remotely complex when you're gasping for breath with what feels a knife wrapped in sandpaper down your throat would take a lot of effort. It may get easier to do the more fancy stuff with more racing experience. </td></tr></table> I also did this Saturday for a 2K PB -- plan was: <table width='95%' cellspacing='1' cellpadding='3' border='0' align='center'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>CODE</div></td></tr><tr><td class='code'><div> 7:29 @ 1:52.25 2000 - 1500 01:53.0 01:53.0 1500 - 1000 01:52.5 03:45.5 1000 - 500 01:52.0 05:37.5 500 - 0 01:51.5 07:29.0 </div></td></tr></table> ... and I was right on target until the last 200 meters, finishing in 7:29.8. I liked the negative splits better than flat pace. Made me feel as if I was saving something for the sprint, whether I was or not. It was also motivating to be able to pick it up after 500M and then again at 1,000M and 1,500M. Made the last 500M seem easier than previous trys. You might want to try different strategies in some "tests" before a race, and see how they work for you. I train this way as well (negative splits for intervals), so it seemed "familiar".

[old] tnrower36 · Post by **[old] tnrower36** » December 5th, 2005, 6:41 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(mpukita @ Dec 5 2005, 03:58 PM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(Citroen @ Nov 30 2005, 03:17 PM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>Mike Caviston gave this advice (on the Wolverine plan thread): 800m @ RP+1, 600m @ RP, 400m @ RP-1, 200m @ RP-2 To give 2000m @ RP average. I was all set to try that for BIRC, I ended up pulling 1:46.5 for 2000m just about as steadily as I could - with lots of encouragement from the coxswain behind me (she was brilliant). Result 7:04.9 PB (down from 7:10.0) I rowed mine at df 110, 32-34SPM So the plan was negative splits, the actuality was flat pace. I'd go flat paced again next time - it was easier to do that. The atmosphere at BIRC was very dry, so trying to concentrate on anything remotely complex when you're gasping for breath with what feels a knife wrapped in sandpaper down your throat would take a lot of effort. It may get easier to do the more fancy stuff with more racing experience. </td></tr></table> I also did this Saturday for a 2K PB -- plan was: <table width='95%' cellspacing='1' cellpadding='3' border='0' align='center'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>CODE</div></td></tr><tr><td class='code'><div> 7:29 @ 1:52.25 2000 - 1500 01:53.0 01:53.0 1500 - 1000 01:52.5 03:45.5 1000 - 500 01:52.0 05:37.5 500 - 0 01:51.5 07:29.0 </div></td></tr></table> ... and I was right on target until the last 200 meters, finishing in 7:29.8. I liked the negative splits better than flat pace. Made me feel as if I was saving something for the sprint, whether I was or not. It was also motivating to be able to pick it up after 500M and then again at 1,000M and 1,500M. Made the last 500M seem easier than previous trys. You might want to try different strategies in some "tests" before a race, and see how they work for you. I train this way as well (negative splits for intervals), so it seemed "familiar". </td></tr></table> even paced is usually the best for optimal results... sometimes thou, you can get a little "jump" at the start by going hard for 15 or 20...not too much thou or you will pay... honestly thou - the adrenaline of the thing usually GEEKS me till about 700 or 800 into it - then I usually just rely on the experience of doing so many of these blasted things (2k's) over the years to get me to the last 500m... then it's usually just a matter of will... I don't remember the last 30 or 40 strokes of my PB - had the serious tunnel vision going... perhaps If I'd been a bit more measured in my approach, I would have broken 6:10... but 6:11 was pretty good back in 94...ahhh the good ole dayz !!! best of luck with it - Rob

[old] Gilesyb · Post by **[old] Gilesyb** » December 6th, 2005, 4:50 am

[quote=hjs,Dec 5 2005, 09:35 PM] [quote=Gilesyb,Dec 5 2005, 08:53 PM] [quote=Arno,Nov 29 2005, 04:21 PM][quote=jfo,Nov 29 2005, 09:15 AM]I am going to participate in my first competition. I can row 2000m in 7.20 minutes normally. When I have a coach shouting at me I can do it in 7.07 minutes but then I am almost dead afterwords. What should my pace be like at the competicion? Hi there, first poster here: I have always wanted to get people's views on this question. I am trying to break 6:40 for the 2k, and 16000 for the hour, and I have a feeling that my approach is all wrong; I tend to try to build up a reserve of X seconds ahead, and then see if I can last the third quarter, before trying to recover into the last. So 1:37, 1:43, 1:44, 1:40 would be typical of my pattern. Similarly for the hour: first 5k at 1:52, the next at 1:53.5, then see what is left. Have I been doing it all wrong? Is this "set a target, keep at that pace" approach better? Gilesyb 1k: 3:12.2. 2k: 6:44.6. 5K: 17:49.7 10k: 36:53.6 1hr, 15785 [/quote] Pfff opening in 1.37 and then back to 1.44? thats seems almost een walk in the park I always start relatief easy. That means start fast and settle on racepace within 10 strokes. And I try to maintain that pace as long as possible. If I feel I can,t I let it eas very lightly, never 7 second. For me is slowing down more than 2 seconds the same as quiting. For the longer distances I would even start on a slower pace than I want to row. I always try to row the second half faster. But here also not to much. For example if I a wanted to row a 6 K in 1.42 I would start at 1.43 /43,5 for the first 2 k and after 3 k I would try to speed up a bit. To make it short, set a pace for yourself witch is not to hard and don't let it eas off. If it feels to hard just let I slow down a little and do this on time so you don,t have to slow down to much. [/quote] A walk in the park? What happens when you run? Good advice, chaps. I have learnt two things in the last few weeks, having been overtaken by a savvier rival. One, "training" at 1:52 pace is no good - you are neither here nor there. So now I either do 1:58-2:00 where my HR is 145-9, or I do shorter bursts, like 6k in 1k pieces of 1:40-5 pace. Two, what you guys have told me here, which is to try to improve my pace through the race. I will try for my 6k record tomorrow along those lines - want to do 1:48 pace, so keeping it at 1:49 for first 2k, then 1:48 next 2k, then see what happens . . .. Cheers

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