Strange Training Results At 100% Hr

[old] DannyBoy · Post by **[old] DannyBoy** » July 7th, 2004, 8:54 am

Hi all, I'm back into serious training after a long break. I'm running and rowing every day at different speeds/distances. I have a nice wooden training surface that takes about 5 or 6 minutes to run 1 lap. I did 6 laps last week and the last 2 were quite fast. My HR was at my maximum for over for 9 minutes, according to my pulsar watch (i'm 39yo: max: 181). It wasn't so difficult. I get on my Concept2 this morning and do my fastest 2kms in 6:51 minutes. The HR starts of at 136 the first minute and slowly goes up to the maximum 181 after 1600 meters. This was extremely difficult. I was only at 100% or more for only 400 metres. Does this indicate that I've got a good 'cardio system' but my muscularity/power slows me down when on a concetp2? Is this a normal sort of result? I'm training for the French Open C2 at Courbertin in Paris the 12th of december. Any ideas for a good program to get my power up before december? thanks for your help. Danny

[old] PaulH · Post by **[old] PaulH** » July 7th, 2004, 10:53 am

I believe it's pretty common for heart rates to be higher when running than rowing, so for them to be the same suggests you were actually working harder during the rowing. Also, my understanding is that 181 is not your max heartrate, as it isn't possible to maintain your max for 9 minutes. Cheers, Paul

[old] Cran · Post by **[old] Cran** » July 7th, 2004, 11:19 am

181 isn't your max heart rate. I'm guessing you are using the 220-age formula... forget it... I'm 38 and can quite easily (well not easily but you know what I mean) get my heart rate up to 195 and higher.

[old] yogieatspies · Post by **[old] yogieatspies** » July 9th, 2004, 6:39 am

I am at the opposite end of the scale, I am 23 and never get my HR over 187 bpm.

[old] DMH · Post by **[old] DMH** » July 9th, 2004, 8:51 pm

The 220 minus your age to = max heart rate only works for people who are really out of shape. The only way to really find out your Max HR is a stress test in a hospital done by a cardiologist. You can, though, get a good approximation at home. Also, the books I've read all say you'll have a different max HR for each type of exercise so you have to test it in each sport. For running, one test is to run at a moderate pace for 10 minutes and then go as fast as you possible can for 2. The highest rate you register during those 2 minutes is about the max. I'd think the same test on a C2 would give you the rate there. Another one is to run while increasing the speed or incline every 3 minutes. Start easy and then alternate between going up 1 mph one time and 1 degree the next. When you reach the top speed you're comfortable with, just increase the incline each 3 minutes. When you reach the interval where you can't take it anymore, that's the max HR. I'd guess a rowing correlary would be to increase the stroke rate and have a friend increase the resistance on the C2 every 2 minutes or so. Good luck.

[old] Canoeist · Post by **[old] Canoeist** » July 13th, 2004, 7:31 am

I find that I hit my highest recorded HR at the end of hard 5Ks, 6Ks, 30 min., and 10Ks. Yesterday, for example, I did a hard 30 min row. My heart rate was above 170bpm after 10 minutes, and above 180 bpm for the last 10 minutes. During the final 500m push to the finish line, my heart rate hit 186 bpm. 186 bpm is what I have observed to be my higest HR over the past three years. I am 48 years old, 210 pounds. (Notice the 220 - age formula says that I would have a max HR of only 172 bpm and thus would have been dead for more than 20 minutes of a 30 minute row.) Cheers, Paul Flack

[old] Ash · Post by **[old] Ash** » July 13th, 2004, 5:17 pm

According to that formula I'm 3 years old!

[old] ranger · Post by **[old] ranger** » July 22nd, 2004, 4:14 am

When I rowed my 60min pb a couple of years ago (at about 1:48 pace), my heart rate went up to 172 bpm after five minutes or so and stayed there for the remaining 55 minutes. When I kicked it up to 1:39 pace in the last 1K or so, my heart rate went up to 186 spm. I am 53. I no longer use a heart monitor. I think it is just a distraction. ranger

[old] Rocket Roy · Post by **[old] Rocket Roy** » July 22nd, 2004, 12:02 pm

I always row with a heart rate monitor, even in competition, this didn't really help at Evesham when the commentator , the great Jon Goodall, announced to the room that after 500m my hr was at 172 , but it didn't do much damage either, and I had the info to boot. heart rate training is the way to go in my opinion.

[old] ranger · Post by **[old] ranger** » July 22nd, 2004, 2:50 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td class='genmed'>QUOTE </td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>I had the info to boot. </td></tr></table> Roy-- So what did you do with the info? Did it help you? Did you say, "Wow, my heart rate is 172, I should slow down (or speed up)"? The biggest effect that I found with a heart rate monitor was this: When I was looking at the numbers and thinking about what they might mean, my heart rate went up! That is, the monitor got in the way of the real business at hand (concentration, relaxation, exertion, etc.). So I threw it away. ranger

[old] Sir Pirate · Post by **[old] Sir Pirate** » July 22nd, 2004, 3:17 pm

Ranger. Is this a 1st I have to agree with you on this one. You have to many things to do when you are wearing a HR Monitor. I find it a distraction. I have to also remember to start and stop it at the start/finish of an interval session, trying to maintain a split and spm while watching the monitor, it’s all too much for my tiny brain to handle. I just use it on the odd occasion during a 30 min piece just to see if my HR has improved over a period of time. Sir Pirate

[old] monkey · Post by **[old] monkey** » July 22nd, 2004, 3:30 pm

I'm an HR monitor convert, measuring HR enables my coach to assess how well I'm coping with the sessions he's giving me so they can be adjusted accordingly. So I use mine all the time, as I believe you should be shouldn't you Mr Pirate!!

[old] Sir Pirate · Post by **[old] Sir Pirate** » July 22nd, 2004, 3:55 pm

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td class='genmed'>QUOTE (monkey @ Jul 22 2004, 07:30 PM)</td></tr><tr><td class='quote'> So I use mine all the time, as I believe you should be shouldn't you Mr Pirate!!  </td></tr></table> Don't worry Monkey, I did as I was told. Not using it now though. Did find it a bl**dy pain. Number of times I forgot to start it 300m into a 750m interval Sir Pirate

[old] Coach Gus · Post by **[old] Coach Gus** » July 22nd, 2004, 4:17 pm

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td class='genmed'>QUOTE (Sir Pirate @ Jul 22 2004, 11:55 AM)</td></tr><tr><td class='quote'> Number of times I forgot to start it 300m into a 750m interval  </td></tr></table> You should get the C2 HR interface. If you use it, all your concerns about stopping and starting and being able to look at it will be solved even for your little brain. Actually if you're using it correctly, it's the exact same amount of things to watch. Instead of pace you watch HR. Pace will be whatever HR allows. Those of you who consider it a distraction, a crutch, more stressful, etc. are likely not using it correctly or didn't give yourselves enough time to get used to training with it. There are lots of different ways to guide your training, but HR based training is THE way to go.

[old] ranger · Post by **[old] ranger** » July 23rd, 2004, 3:48 am

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td class='genmed'>QUOTE </td></tr><tr><td class='quote'> HR based training is THE way to go.  </td></tr></table> Coach-- I am still confused about this. If training is done by looking at a HR monitor and only doing what HR allows. How does this tranfer to racing? When you are racing, do you only do what HR allows? One of the most important things about successful racing, I think, is a feel for pace relative to level of exertion and the ability achieve a maximal level of relaxation while working at high intensity. This is a very introspective matter, I think, that doesn't depend on external intrumental feedback much at all. When I race, I often don't even look at my split time for large periods. I blur out my vision and (virtually) close my eyes. I race by "feel." I also train by "feel." The HR monitor interferes with these (good?) habits. IMHO, the feedback that is most important when you are rowing (or running or biking or swimming or...) comes from your body, not from gizmos attached to it. ranger

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