Realistic improvement in older athletes?

[Cyclingman1]

Actually, my immediate next goal is to pull some hard 1K's. I think 3:12 may be doable, which in turn may get me below 6:40, which is where I want to be at end of this season - Apr 30. But it is all in the doing - talk is cheap.

My different background makes predicting hard to do. Even I have no idea where I will end up, but I know I have a few more seconds in me.

[Robt.Lee]

I am the same height and weight as you and am a couple of years older. I have not rowed under 6'40" but I have worked at it. I think you need to work on form, get a good rowing coach so you can avoid stress injuries and get efficient; strength, work on leg presses in particular; and endurance, focusing on the erg. I used Eddie Fletcher's workout from concept2.co.uk. I also used Firstbeat Athlete to keep from overtraining. At our age it is critical to avoid injury, illness, and overtraining because we improve slowly and go down hill quickly. Good luck, I think you can definitely improve. I also think you will find erging will improve your hill climbing performace on the bike.

[Bob S.]

Congratulations, Jim! Good luck on your furthur improvement.

Bob S.

[johnlvs2run]

If the readers of this discussion do not find it too terribly forward, I would like to report that I was able to best the World Record at 2000m of 6:41.4 set in 2011 for 65+, by rowing a 6:40.7 (1:40.17) this afternoon, Apr 10.

Very nice rowing, and welcome to the forum.

[Cyclingman1]

Actually I'm happy with my rowing technique. I could use the cardiovascular system that I had 25 yrs ago. That is what would make a difference.

[Cyclingman1]

Couple of comments.
My last post seems a bit out of place. But that is what happens when someone submits a stream of posts that get deleted later. This particular person, age 61, was claiming to be able to row a sub 6:30 2k based on new and improved technique, training, etc. But he is never willing to post times with any kind of verification. Quite a strange guy. Not sure what the motivation is. Also, that person is not unwilling to give unsolicited advice that is not very helpful, hence my last post. For veterans of the forum, he is infamous.

I have some not great news to report concerning my progress, which is why I started the thread. I've had a respiratory infection for weeks and the cure, the anitbiotic Augmentin, causes diarrhea. Just great - talk about sucking the energy out. Secondly, I've had a bad L4 disc for 20 yrs. It has been acting up lately. I have been bouncing on the catch phase trying to get some momentum into the power phase. It was working, I would say, but at the cost of putting additional strain on lower back. I need to find my power in other way(s).

The bottom line is that I am in a regrouping phase now - trying to get well and healed. Don't count me out. I'm pretty sure that I will rebound. Right now my times really suck. Improvement is not linear - there are ups and downs.

[Robert Wildes]

Sorry to hear of your L4 and other problem Cyclingman1.

The best year I ever had running came after an injury that did not allow me to run more than four miles
a week for about a month or a bit longer. Maybe you will be as fortunate.

[Cyclingman1]

I see 6:42.1 posted for 2K in 2012.
But after 9 yrs of training and predictions of 5:44 for 2K, a posting of 6:42 leaves one baffled. Why bother? Why not post at least one of the fast times claimed? Seems strange to me.

[CONLEJM]

According to the C2 website, the world record for the 60 minutes is 18,221m; a pace of 1:38.8/500m. The record holder is Graham Benton from GBR, set in 2008 when he was 34 years old.

A pace of 1:36/500m would destroy the previous world record, resulting in 18,750m. And by a 60-something-year-old? That would be amazing. Good luck to you.

Sorry to butt in. I usually post over on the Timbuktoo Board, but I follow the Training Board and the Health and Fitness Board. My name is Jim Conley, age 45, been erging off and on since college, but have really begun in earnest just in the last six months for general health and fitness.

2013 stats:

[Cyclingman1]

Why does anyone ever reply to anything ranger says? He's more full of s*** that a port-a-john at a regatta.

I think for those who have been on the forums for several yrs, there is no doubt about bogus posting. But for those who are relatively new, the promise of improvement and a plan to do so moreover is hard to resist. But alas, it all plunges off into total fantasy. It is completely puzzling to me why anyone would make such claims when nary a shred of verification is supplied. A 5:44 2K may be pulled by a 60+ person some day, but it will come from someone who was pulling such times in his 50s, not someone claiming to improve from 6:42 to 5:44 in a relative short time. I suppose it is mildly irritating having to wade throught those posts. One would think they would simply not be allowed to be posted in the first place.

[PaulH]

Couple of comments.
My last post seems a bit out of place. But that is what happens when someone submits a stream of posts that get deleted later.

My apologies for that - there are certain conditions ranger needs to fulfil to be welcome here again, and I've left his username active so that he can comply with them. He hasn't, of course, and chooses instead to post anyway, knowing that I'll delete his posts. I took a little longer than normal this time, for which I apologize. I've banned him from a month, to give him a little more time to reflect on what he needs to do. We'll see if his return changes anything; if not I suspect my patience will be exhausted and a permanent ban will result.

Cheers, Paul

[Robert Wildes]

Maybe it would be less confusing if his or any other dubious posts were left on the board.

Many of us only check the board on an irregular basis. It would soon become apparent if
a poster lists performances that seem too good to be true.

I did not doubt Ranger's claims until I noticed a claim that 5:42 was all but in the bag for
a 61 year old lightweight.

[Cyclingman1]

Of all people I like to err on the side of open communication. In these discussion all kinds of ideas and beliefs are put forward and it is often hard to say what is right or wrong. The only thing that I want to see is that a person try to be honest in what they post, regardless of whether I or anyone else thinks it is correct. In the case of the semi-banned poster, one gets the distinct impression that a highly fabricated story of rowing has been constructed. There is a faint patina of factualness that makes some of it interesting. But ultimately it appears the poster is playing with us all and not in a good way. The posts defy the spirit in which most post. Unfortunately, I come down on the side of preventing that person from posting in the forums and in the rankings unless they are of the C2Log type. I think we all would like to see some data from him that is believable.

BTW, Robert, I just noticed that you are a GA boy. You participate in the Atl Erg Sprints at GA Tech?

[Robert Wildes]

No Cyclingman1 I do not participate in the sprints held at Georgia Tech.

Three reasons for the above.

1-Even though I registered in 2007, I only became serious about rowing this Spring, Possibly late Winter.
2-February is a terrible time for me due to work considerations. I could make a Sunday sprint, but never
a Saturday one at that time of year.
3-Most importantly, my times are not at all competitive at present.

[Cyclingman1]

It is most definitely not a lie to say that one wants to row faster. Don't we all want that.

What is untruthful is to go into elaborate detail about how one has the discovered the "secret" to rowing surpassing watts/stroke numbers of the best rowers at age 61. I don't recall all of the various claims, but the claim of being able to or being close to being able to row a 5:44 2K at age 61, when the person's previous best is 6:42.1 (self-reported, not verified), is simply not believable. It makes light of those who really have made considerable effort to improve - five seconds over, perhaps, weeks. I hope to improve about 8 seconds over the next 8 months for 2K. I don't want to see flippant remarks about improving 58 seconds in a few weeks or even months and criticisms of others because they do not see the true light to improvement.

I don't feel the person is a dastardly transgressor. But I do think that he demeans serious efforts by others with his fabrications and exaggerations. The guy was once a good rower and still is. The turn to exaggeration is hard to understand.