Percentage of World Records

[johnlvs2run]

[johnlvs2run]

[johnlvs2run]

[JimR]

A starting point would be when you free your mind and open up to the methods that actually have a proven track record of results.

JimR,

I keep asking this and don't seem to be getting any answers.

What are your times and PERathlon scores?

John ... would it not be more accurate if you had said you aren't getting the answers you want to hear? In fact, wouldn't this go a long way to explain most of your interactions on this forum ... an endless search to find someone who will tell you what you want to hear?

In any event, as a person (like most) who needs to believe that I will receive something for my efforts perhaps you could help me think this question through ...

How will calcualting my "PERathlon scores" improve my performance on an erg? A clear answer to this might actually help me see why it is in my own self-interest to invest the time and effort to do this exercise you are asking me to do.

JimR

[johnlvs2run]

[JimR]

JimR,

Yes is is accurate to say that I'm not getting the answers that I'd like to hear from you.

How do you expect to get to where you'd like to be, when you don't know where that is, don't know how to get there, and don't know where you are to begin with?

Whether you figure your scores and whatever else you do is up to you though, and not a matter for me to decide for you. However I find it curious that you suggested I try some other method, that you've apparently been following yourself and yet you got lost when you did.

Yet again I see you giving a non-answer to the question ... "How does someone who wants to improve their performance on an erg use the information found by calculating their PERathlon scores?"

You, John, are the thought leader on the PERathlon topic. There are new people on the forum who have not had the benefit of reading the many, many (many) posts you have shared on the subject. There are also many people (I'm among them) who have yet to see how one's PERathlon scores would guide their training ... I see their questions yet never an answer.

John, could you please answer the question? When PaulS put out this S10PS and STM plans on this forum he went to great lengths (and still does) to explain how this information can be applied in real life to someone interested in training to improve performance. Mike Caviston has with respect to the Wolverine Plan (WP) as well. These two individuals have won the hearts and minds of many and I personally know that the concepts they so generously shared do yield results.

Do you consider it unfair of the forum to request that the person singularily accountable for developing the PERathlon tool also explain how it can be used to improve performance on the erg? Perhaps you could package this information in a website to make it useful?

I'm searching for answers and though I (we the forum actually) have access to the leading authority on the PERathlon subject I still can't grasp how I use the information in real life.

Please help ...

JimR

[Francois]

When PaulS put out this S10PS and STM plans on this forum he went to great lengths (and still does) to explain how this information can be applied in real life to someone interested in training to improve performance. Mike Caviston has with respect to the Wolverine Plan (WP) as well. These two individuals have won the hearts and minds of many and I personally know that the concepts they so generously shared do yield results.
JimR

Very well said Jim!

John, your %WR is useless! It was devise to camouflage your abysmal decline in performance. Take your 10K for instance: your PB is 38:44.7, but this year, you only did 39:58.8, a decline of 1:14.1. Yet, your %WR went from 89.4% down to 88.6%, a 0.8% variation. The same thing could be said of your 6k: you are much slower now, yet the %WR has only decreased by 0.2%.

[whp4]

How do you expect to get to where you'd like to be, when you don't know where that is, don't know how to get there, and don't know where you are to begin with?

I don't know how JimR does it but my way is rather simple, yet effective:

1) row
2) look in my log book for comparable performances
3) did I improve on past performances?
3a) yes: pat self on back
3b) no: pat self on back for putting in the effort
4) in either case, rededicate myself to doing better next time
5) go to #1

No comparison to the world record required; my approach would be the same even if I held the world record. Perhaps at some point I won't be able to improve on past performances, and will need to seek out "adjustments" to give me a sense of self-worth. But with class acts like Bob Spenger to serve as role models, I expect that day will be a long time in coming.

Bill

[michaelb]

My theory is that JR's post are directly proportional to the replies he gets. I hadn't finished the mathematical models, but thought it was around a 3 to 1 ratio (so 3 bizarro posts per reply). Now we have 3 replies pending, so according to my theory, we will get 9 nonresponsive posts back.

This will be a good test.

[johnlvs2run]

The Perathlon scores are a competitive model comparing the Percentage of one's times to a World Record Quality Curve. Here are a few of the ways you can use your Perathlon scores:

1) To see the quality of your times based on World Record performances;

2) To compare the quality of one of your 10 events with the others;

3) To measure the relative quality of your times from year to year after age 35, for example how does your time at age 65 relate to your time at age 55;

4) To compare your results with various training programs;

5) To compare the results of various performers;;

6) As measurement of how your times for all 10 events improve based on certain methods of training and consistency;

The Perathlon shows you the way to perform in line with your personal goals and objectives.

[johnlvs2run]

[johnlvs2run]

[JimR]

As to the two plans you wish me to comment on, both of the proponents of those plans got slower after they started then. This could easily be seen by calculating their PERathlon scores. Again this shows why the PERathlon scores are a more useful training tool than their plans.

This is a very damning statement John ... if success is determined by improved performance of an individual then your training "plan" is not very good as I would assume your decreasing performance (as pointed out by yourself and others) is the direct result of following your plan exactly (given that you are the author of said plan).

None the less, perhaps your evasive answer was the direct result of my poor question. To improve I will ask a more specific question ... on Thursday I rowed for 30 minutes at a 2:04.7 pace with an average stroke rate of 24. Can you explain how to use the logic of my PERathlon scores to determine my next seven workouts? I would need the workouts to specify duration, pace and rate targets ... if your guidance would have me doing interval workouts then I would need repition and rest intervals as well.

I'm sure you have determined all this for yourself so surely an explaination of how to put your knowledge to use in my situation should not be difficult?

JimR

[johnlvs2run]

[JimR]

I have been asked a number of times why the PERathlon was calculated based on Times vs Watts. Time is more universally used, is how performances are measured in the rankings, and the calculations are direct and easy to use.

For those who would like to see their scores related in Watts, you can convert your PERathlon scores to WATTathon scores by cubing them, as is shown on this thread.

http://www.c2forum.com/viewtopic.php?p=1251#1251

Speaking only for myself (others can confirm if I am thinking this through correctly), when I calculate a PERathlon score based on time I learn how much I need to improve to meet the theoritical universal world record time as determined by John Rupp.

Because the calculations are based on time I do not get a true representation of how much harder I will have to work to perform at this theoritical wold record time ... which seemed to be the point of the PERathlon score in the first place.

All this aside, the reason the NONathlon (apologies for mentioning these two things in the same posting to Paul in particular) is clearly a more engaging solution than the PERathlon at this point is that it is a complete solution. Nothing more than entering times in a website is required to get feedback on relative performance with a group of peers who are also interested.

The relative nature of this solution is in stark contrast to your absolute calculations which provide neither amusement, direction or feedback. To simplify ... the PERathlon will become accepted by the larger forum community when others find it fills a need. At this point I don't believe you have offered anything to fill a need, others may feel differently.

Perhaps answering questions related to application of your theories would be useful to this end (assuming that is your goal).

JimR