Ranger's training thread

[Bob S.]

Don't know the cause, other than overtraining, I suppose, but my right side caved in today.

ranger

ranger...the master of hyperbole..."caved in."

What are the first symptoms of cirrhosis of the liver?

Bob S.

[snowleopard]

overtraining

Uh?

How can you overtrain on modest UT2 volume? Furthermore, your fitness is maximal; can't be developed. Your only improvement is through technique. Since training is irrelevant, overtraining is an impossibility.

[whp4]

overtraining

Uh?

How can you overtrain on modest UT2 volume? Furthermore, your fitness is maximal; can't be developed. Your only improvement is through technique. Since training is irrelevant, overtraining is an impossibility.

Probably a wrist injury incurred while "working with" a photo of Eskild

[ranger]

Gorgeous 4th of July morning here in Door County, WI.

The muscles I strained yesterday feel amazingly better today, so I think I can go right ahead and row lightly, both OTErg and OTW.

Perhaps I was just pushing the envelope a little bit on stroking power, etc.

Enough is enough, I guess.

ranger

[ranger]

How can you overtrain on modest UT2 volume?

As I have been explaining, for older folks, the major stress of rowing well, taking good strokes, is skeletal-muscular, not physiological.

That's why no veteran has ever done it.

I am not tired.

I strained some muscles.

In order to avoid this muscular strain, most 60s rowers just take 2/3 of a stroke (9 SPI rather than 13 SPI, 12 SPI rather than 16 SPI, etc.), reducing the muscular strain wherever they can in order protect themselves.

Most 60s rowers can't row well for more than a couple of minutes.

As I had to do, it would take _years_ of (re-)training for them to do otherwise.

If you row well, rowing is not primarily aerobic.

It is primarily skeletal-muscular.

ranger

[snowleopard]

I strained some muscles.

Since you are overly fond of giving [bad] advice, you should maybe brush up on the definition of 'overtraining'

[KevJGK]

Getting injured (or sick or stale) are the most dumb-ass things anyone can do in this sport.

You have to be a total stiff about training, and a total novice about rowing more generally, to injure (or otherwise incapacitate) yourself on an erg.

You said it.

[ranger]

I strained some muscles.

Since you are overly fond of giving [bad] advice, you should maybe brush up on the definition of 'overtraining'

No, _you_ should.

Rowing is primarily skeletal-muscular, not aerobic.

So, if you row well, real overtraining in rowing is skeletal-muscular, not aerobic.

By and large, those who get stressed out aerobically don't row well and try to compensate by raising the rate.

Big mistake, with serious consequences.

Rowing badly, but raising the rate to try to compensate for this inability to row well, is undertraining, with misplaced, ineffective strain, generated elsewhere.

If you are a lightweight and want to do 1:45 pace but need to rate 33 spm (9 SPI) with a TR HR to do it, sure, you'll strain yourself all over the place, if you do a lot of meters.

If you row well, though, you can do the 1:45 at 23 spm with a UT1 HR.

No strain at all.

ranger

[snowleopard]

Rowing is primarily skeletal-muscular, not aerobic.

You would like it to be but that doesn't make it so. There is no smaller minority than one.

Following your own agenda has led you to a 7:02.3. Enough said.

[ranger]

Naw.

Couldn't really row today.

I could only get 90 kg.F or so of peak pressure on my stroke without pain.

2:00 @ 25 spm (8 SPI), and such like, HR 109 bpm.

So I quit after 20 minutes or so.

Waste of time.

No reason to row badly, just to get some exercise.

Took a 25 mile bike ride instead.

Beautful morning for biking--brilliantly clear and 70 degrees F.

I'll ride my bike this afternoon, too, just to keep active until my muscle strain is better and I can get back rowing.

ranger

[ranger]

Getting injured (or sick or stale) are the most dumb-ass things anyone can do in this sport.

You have to be a total stiff about training, and a total novice about rowing more generally, to injure (or otherwise incapacitate) yourself on an erg.

You said it.

Yes.

And it's true.

That's why I think I didn't strain the muscles erging or rowing OTW at all.

I think I might have pulled the muscles lifting my son's jet ski hitch onto the car.

I suspect that the muscles that gave were tired, though, and that's why they gave.

The day before yesterday, I rowed both OTErg and OTW.

25K

The strain is not serious.

I'll be rowing again in a few days.

I am hardly "incapacitated."

ranger

[whp4]

In the meantime, you have all of the people and equipment necessary to publish a nice little fireside chat with your brother where you discuss your novel take on how rowing does not involve physiological stress, the science of muscle grease, etc. We could see your vaunted teaching skills in action as you attempt to educate your brother about his field

[ranger]

you are overly fond of giving [bad] advice

What you consider to be good advice or bad advice depends on who you are.

I am describing my training, reporting results, and so, sure, providing an example for those with similar abilities and goals who might be interested in similar results.

I assume that those who have different abilities and goals and are therefore interested in different sorts of results will look for examples elsewhere.

Many people have no interest in learning to row well or therefore go fast.

They are just rowing to get some exercise.

To each his own.

ranger

[JohnBove]

As I have been explaining, for older folks, the major stress of rowing well, taking good strokes, is skeletal-muscular, not physiological.

And bones and muscles, as we all know, have nothing to do with physiology. Jackass.

[Byron Drachman]

Since our intrepid hero has decided that his intercostal strain, often considered a precursor to a stress fracture, or stress fracture is not due to rowing but instead to lifting a jet ski, this will be of no interest to him. However, some of his devoted followers might find be interested in these excerpts from

http://www.hudsonboatworks.com/fileBin/ ... ea0932.pdf

--snip-- We have discussed some of the key the forces at play (see R&D Note #10) but the key proven factors of rowing rib stress fractures are increased long distance training and heavy stroke loading.

--snip--

There are also some key technique findings with rowers who have suffered stress fractures. These include a higher seat velocity, higher speed of initial drive phase with lower knee-extension to elbow flexion strength ratio (meaning a lot of power is coming from the arms relative to the legs) and a pronounced layback position at the finish.

High SPI OTW (accepting your dubious definition) means heavy stroke loading, and higher seat velocity, higher speed of initial drive phase... are related to the quest for the .5 seconds of drive time.