Ranger's training thread

[ranger]

Yea.

Envy is the major sin of our age.

Lots of green around here.

Hey.

You folks need to get over yourselves.

If you want to be good at rowing, you have to earn it.

There are no short cuts.

ranger

[ranger]

If you are rowing well at low drag, prove it.

Post a digipic of your force curve.

If you are getting 120 kg.F. and 12 SPI with a drive time of .5 seconds, then, sure, you are rowing pretty darn well.

if not, then, hey, shut up and get to work.

You've got a lot to learn.

ranger

[ranger]

Pretty pathetic stuff, folks.

You are embarrassing yourselves.

ranger

[ranger]

Wow.

In his Standley Cup Playoff game today, Johan Franzen, a Detroit Red Wing, was knocked out and had to have his face put back to together with 23 stitches before he could stop the bleeding and get back out on the ice.

You should wear a mask, his coach advised.

The hell with the mask, he said.

Let me back out on the ice.

And off he went.

Tough stuff.

ranger

[Steve G]

Wow.

In his Standley Cup Playoff game today, Johan Franzen, a Detroit Red Wing, was knocked out and had to have his face put back to together with 23 stitches before he could stop the bleeding and get back out on the ice.

You should wear a mask, his coach advised.

The hell with the mask, he said.

Let me back out on the ice.

And off he went.

Tough stuff.

ranger

Bet he wouldn't handle down, or travel across the pond and not compete.
Different league to you, bet he isnt a braggart too!

[atklein90]

Pretty pathetic stuff, folks.

You are embarrassing yourselves.

ranger

You're the one that flew halfway around the world to row a 7:02 2K. Talk about embarrassing.

To follow it up, you couldn't even race at a single other race this year (after claiming you would race 6 times).

Talk about embarrassing.

You may be one of the most pathetic human beings I've seen.

Loser.

[ranger]

To follow it up, you couldn't even race at a single other race this year

This year?

No need to race _any_ year, really.

I have three WR rows, golds in all of the major championships, etc.

You might try to doing anything at all first before passing judgment on those who have done plenty.

My goal now is to be a dozen seconds better over 2K than I was 8 years ago, when I held the 50s lwt WR.

Ambitious goal, no?

So, it isn't a simple row to hoe.

I am bucking up to the task with everything that I have to give.

I'm not sure you understand at all.

Will you be training for a 6:16 2K 25 years from now?

Perhaps.

But if you will be, you'll have to be someone entirely different from who you are now.

Good luck with it.

ranger

[atklein90]

To follow it up, you couldn't even race at a single other race this year

This year?

No need to race _any_ year, really.

I have three WR rows, golds in all of the major championships, etc.

You might try to doing anything at all first before passing judgment on those who have done plenty.

My goal now is to be a dozen seconds better over 2K than I was 8 years ago, when I held the 50s lwt

ranger

You don't have any WR's.

And it was you who claimed over and over how many times you would race this year to "parade your strengths."

Then, after one humiliating performance, you chickened out of everything. Pussy.

[Fred]

one thing you cant do is a 36:00 10k

My goal is now 1:42 @ 29 spm, 34:00 for 10K.
ranger

Whatever your goal is, the simple truth is you cant do a 36:00 10k

[PaulH]

PaulH--

It seems that you need to get over yourself, too.

Sorry that you're no good at rowing either.

But, hey, so it goes.

Deal with it.

ranger

Already dealt with - I was never very good, and I'm a lot worse than that now. Though interestingly I rowed well enough that I've never rammed another shell, despite covering more miles around other boats than you.

So, how about my question - if you row 6:40ish at 60 does that mean you're not as good as you think you are?

[macroth]

April 16,2011: If I pull a sub-6:00 lwt 2k at 60, there is nothing to get over. The estimations of my potential that I have suggested have been _enormously_ modest. And actually, I am much better than I think I am.

That's wonderful. Thanks so much for that quote. It made me chuckle and brightened my day.

Me too! It's great to start the day with a laugh. The "you're all just jealous, neener neener" stuff was just sad, but THIS was perfect. Just think of the possibilities! "I'm much better than when I thought I was much better than how good I was in 2003". I mean, ranger's VPB could be in the low 5:30s before he hits the next age group!

[ranger]

If your first rule of training is that you hold your technique together, no matter what, and you are training to row a FM, which is done with pretty close to a UT2 HR, at 26 spm, then you indeed need to get used to doing most of your daily distance rowing at 30-32 spm. You can't row for 2.5 hours at some rate and pace unless it is _very_ easy rowing. And like anything, a task only feels easy if you are used to doing something that is quite a bit harder.

And so it is evident why ratio is so important.

If you rowing well, not taking half strokes, or whatever, 30-32 spm only feels like comfortable UT1 rowing if the ratio is high, e.g., 3-to-1. Because you are working so briefly and resting so much, a high ratio creates the illusion that the rate and pace are low. But of course, if you row well and you are rating 30-32 spm, the rate and pace are not low at all. You are blasting along at something close to 1:40 for lightweights and 1:34 for heavyweights.

If you are 60 years old, as I am, that is under WR 2K pace.

Interesting situation.

If you row well, learning how to row so that you can do most of your daily distance meters at 30-32 spm, with no trouble or damage, rather than 20-22 spm, is quite a trick.

Then again, it is pretty clear:

You are not going to row a FM, 1:46 @ 26 spm (11 SPI), like Matthias, if you row most of your daily meters 2:02 @ 20 spm (9.5 SPI).

It just ain't gonna happen.

You're gonna miss it by 15 seconds per 500m, a minute every 2K, 21 minutes over the FM as a whole.

Matthias is gonna beat you to the finish by over 5K, by over a mile every hour.

ranger

[hjs]

You have been claiming to row 6.16 for years and you also say with age there is a decline, but dispite this you still claim every year hat your potentential is stilntht same 6.16.
if your potential has been 6.16 you can do the math, you potential now is lots and lots slower. Precisely what your results are showing.
And altough your say aging gives a average decline reality is different, at your age the decline goes faster and that also shows in your results.
you still rowed 6.30 age 55, unprepared as you say, you now rowed 7.02 this year..... and after this you could not get yourself racing again, we all know why......
face it, it's over and out, your pb s are far out of reach, simple fact of nature.

why are you still claiming to row 6.16 every year? After all you are aging

I am not claiming to row 6:16 every year.

I am claiming that the limit of my potential is 6:16.

Sure, my aerobic capacity is declining with age, just like everyone else's.

No matter.

My improvement has been technical.

I have just learned to row.

At just shy of 53, I pulled a lwt 6:28 2K rowing badly (10 SPI) at max drag (200+ df.).

I was new to the sport.

I didn't know how to row.

If my experience is right, rowing well at low drag can be worth as much as 10 seconds per 500m over 2K.

I now row well (13 SPI) at low drag (95 df.).

There's your explanation of why I think the limit of my potential is 6:16.

ranger

[/quote]

[ranger]

Gorgeous base pace cadence now, 1:40 @ 32 spm (11 SPI).

I am _really_ getting the hang of this low drag rowing.

95 df.

No need to do anything else than this base pace in order to train for _all_ of the distance events.

It's perfect.

If I can do it for even 6K, I hit my target.

I don't know, but I think I might do it for a HM.

The light resistance (95 df.), quick drive (.5 seconds), and long recoveries (1.5 seconds) in this base pace rowing give it the illusion of being much lower in rate and slower in pace.

But it's not!

It's fast as hell.

For me, under WR 2K pace.

_Very_ relaxed stuff!

When I first took up rowing, I also rowed all of my distance meters at 32 spm, but rowing badly at max drag, short-sliding, diving at the catch, hauling anchor with my upper body, I only pulled 8 SPI.

Rowing well (full slide, leading with my legs, relaxing my upper body at the catch and then reversing the leverage in the middle of the drive, toes-heels-toes tapping on the footplate, etc.), at _very_ low drag (95 df.), I now pull 11 SPI for my distance meters.

Because of my better mechanics/technique and the low drag (95 df.), just stroking along easily, my normal stroke now does 40% more work at the same rate and level of effort.

ranger

[ranger]

You have been claiming to row 6.16 for years and you also say with age there is a decline, but despite this you still claim every year hat your potentential is still the same 6.16. If your potential has been 6.16 you can do the math, your potential now is lots and lots slower.

Sure, my aerobic capacity is declining, I suspect by the normal second per year over 2K.

On the other hand, making guesses about potential is divination, not science.

I have used the 6:16 as a target because it seems reasonable to me.

Is it accurate, exact, etc.?

Who knows?

We'll have to wait and see.

I now seem to be doing rowing that is zeroing in on this target, but I am certainly still a long way from racing a 2K at 1:34.

I am just training for distance trials!

I haven't even done one yet.

After a FM, I will need to do HM, 60min, 10K, 30min, 6K, and 5K.

Then, when I am done with distance trials, I will need to sharpen for a couple of months with anaerobic intervals before I am fully ready to race.

ranger