Ranger's training thread

[mikvan52]

How about an 80% effort with your current form.

Sure.

All in good time.

Note to self:
Add the definition "never" next to the phrase "all in good time" for the wacky ranger lexicon.

[ranger]

Kev--

Can you do 50 jackknives, 25 extension press ups, and 30 pull ups?

If so, post a video for us.

ranger

[ranger]

do you think Mattais spent 7+ years getting ready to do his FM?

The issue isn't rowing a FM.

I've rowed scores of FMs. I have rowed 100K. I have rowed 167K.

The issue is how to get substantially better, despite getting older, after you are a world record holder, as Matthias is now.

Mattais' 1:47 for a FM at 40 is comparable to my FM at 1:54 at just shy of 53.

Sure, I think it would take Mattais _at least_ seven years to train himself now to do a FM at 1:41, six seconds per 500m faster, when he is 47.

[Then, if he could do a FM @ 1:41 when he is 47, he might still be able to do a FM @ 1:48 when he is 60, as I am.]

What I am aiming at is not just a WR.

The 60s lwt FM WR is 2:00 pace.

The 60s hwt FM WR is 1:54 pace.

A FM @ 1:48 is a dozen seconds per 500m under the 60 lwt FM WR, six seconds per 500m under the hwt 60s FM WR.

And the FM is just the beginning of race preparation for a 2K.

Sure, I think that it would take Matthais at least seven years to get a dozen seconds better over 2K by the time he is 47, as I am trying to do.

Given that Mattias' new 40s lwt WR is 6:17, that dozen seconds of improvement would push his 2K down to 6:05, below the present 30s lwt WR, just as a 6:16 for me would push my 2K down below both the present 50s and 40s WRs.

I am training myself to row faster than Mattias even though I am twenty years older.

ranger

[mikvan52]

Kev--

Can you do 50 jackknives, 25 extension press ups, and 30 pull ups?

If so, post a video for us.

ranger

Range'

Can you operate the Memory on your PM4

If so, post a video for us.

[ranger]

Jim--

Besides me, in the history of the sport, no male 2K WR-holder, 40-70, has ever gotten any better--at all--much less substantially better.

Could Rocket Roy train himself now to pull 6:26 for 2K, a dozen seconds better than he was when he was 55?

Sure.

But it might take him seven years.

He would have to get a lot better at rowing.

And he would have to transform certain aspects of his full-body fitness (e.g., his core and upper body strength, quickness, etc.).

ranger

[mikvan52]

With apologies to Byron who does a better job at this than I do:

(There were 40 hits on the following search)



Here are just a few

October 7th, 2009, 2:09 am
My foundational rowing is complete.
I no longer row at low rates and high stroking powers at all.
I am rowing at moderate to high rates, low to moderate stroking powers, and 10 MPS over long distances.
I am doing pre-sharpening, leading up to distance trials.
When I have completed my distance trials, I will sharpen.
I am also at weight, which puts that worry to rest

October 29th, 2009, 1:50 am
So, I have moved on to hard distance rowing.
When I am done with my hard distance rowing (and distance trials), I will sharpen and race.

November 16th, 2009, 3:17 am
I get a dozen seconds over 2K from both distance training and sharpening.
My foundational rowing is now complete.
I am again preparing to race.
I am now doing hard distance rowing.
When I am done with distance trials, I will sharpen.
I will be 60 years old in 14 months.

January 6th, 2010, 5:27 am
So far so good.
I am rowing right on my targets.
Distance rowing is complete and I am ready to sharpen (with distance trials, AT long intervals, and anaerobic short intervals).
I am at weight.

{editor’s note: He was at weight but didn’t “choose” to go to Boston a month later}

February 21st, 2010, 5:28 pm
I will be sharpening, racing, and doing distance trials for the next 10 weeks. During this time, I will establish a complete set of current--lightweight--pbs. I will do the rows IND_V and enter them in the 50s lwt rankings.

[ranger]

Could MIke VB now get a dozen seconds better over 2K than he was when he was 55?

Could he train himself to pull 6:32?

Not likely.

You only get better by workng on your weaknesses.

But Mike is a rowing snob.

Snobs don't believe they have any weaknesses.

They think they only have strengths, and so spend all of their training time parading their strengths.

If you spend all of your training time parading your strengths, you just get worse and worse.

ranger

[mikvan52]

Shall we stick to substance instead of name-calling?

Could MIke VB now get a dozen seconds better over 2K than he was when he was 55?

Could he train himself to pull 6:32?

Substance:
I am not training for 6:32 on the erg. I am training to win the HOCR (3 miles OTW in the 1x) in 2012 (60+ men). You know that.
note: To be effective "Smack talk" should be on-topic.

And your training?
You don't seem to be training as you say you do. You won't post anything that verifies HR/pace/and unbroken duration

This year's record:
My best 2k time this year is 6:55 . Yours is 7:02.

ranger assessment of progress in his program:
Do you want to erg a 2k at 80% of your watt goal this week (UT1)? That would be a 6:44...
See the problem people have in believing 6:16 is an attainable goal for a 60+ man?

Conclusion:
ranger training is all smoke and mirrors

My training zones:
Even though I am doing mostly UT meters now, I could break 6:50 for 2k. I weigh less than 165 lbs 365 days a year, 24/7.

Weight:
What's your average daily weight? Mine's 158 lbs
Do you realize that if I can generate 6:50 erg wattage OTW at 158 lbs while you muster 6:40 wattage at 175 lbs what the ramifications will be on boat speed ?

hmmmm.....

Reality:
Get real.

[NavigationHazard]

Besides me, in the history of the sport, no male 2K WR-holder, 40-70, has ever gotten any better--at all--much less substantially better. (snip)

Factually wrong.

At the 1995 Crash-Bs, the great Paul Hendershott (52) took 10 seconds off his own 50+ MHW record. And John Doyle broke his own 50+ MLW record but finished 2nd to a new WR set by the dieted-down Jean-Paul Tardieu. That was over 2500m, with heats. In 1996 they switched to 2k; perforce the year's best times were new WRs. At the 1997 Crash-Bs, Paul Hendershott took 4 seconds off his year-old WR in the 50+ HWs.

You've been reminded of this at least ten times. And if you expand the list to include WR-holders in other standard distances, there are others. Me for example, over 1k. The second time I set the 50+ MHW 1k record (since broken), I took 4 seconds off what was then the record and 4.5 seconds off my previous WR for the distance.

[KevJGK]

Kev--

Can you do 50 jackknives, 25 extension press ups, and 30 pull ups?

No.

[Citroen]

Kev--

Can you do 50 jackknives, 25 extension press ups, and 30 pull ups?

No.

Why would you want to, since this is RANGER'S TRAINING THREAD? Should this thread be retitled "Ranger's complete lack of any evidence of any form of training at all thread"

[hjs]

Kev--

Can you do 50 jackknives, 25 extension press ups, and 30 pull ups?

No.

You can Kev, with breaks but that is not the issue

[snowleopard]

Kev--

Can you do 50 jackknives, 25 extension press ups, and 30 pull ups?

No.

Good for you Kev. It only points to a 7:02 2K. Ruinous

[Gus]

ranger's response to any reasonable request for proof of any of his claims about the training he is doing on the erg, the performances he claims he is able to currently do, or that he is capable of a 6:16 2k or a FM at 1:48.

Can you do 50 jackknives, 25 extension press ups, and 30 pull ups?

If so, post a video for us.

ranger

[ranger]

Kev--

Can you do 50 jackknives, 25 extension press ups, and 30 pull ups?

No.

Good for you Kev. It only points to a 7:02 2K. Ruinous

No, it underpins what I have done for the last decade, including three WR rows, sub-6:30 when I was 55, and pulling WR pace the past two years, when I was 58 and 59, at max drag, without even preparing for it.

Full body, skeletal-motor fitness is the first prerequisite for quality 2K racing.

The second prerequisite is effectiveness, rowing well at low rates (13 SPI for lighweights, 16 SPI for heavyweights).

The third prerequisite is efficiency, rowing smoothly and easily at low drag over long distances at the limits of your aerobic capacity for the effort (distance rowing and racing).

The fourth prerequisite is sharpening, anaerobic training.

(4) is useless/pointless without (3).

(3) is useless/pointless without (2).

(2) is useless/pointless without (1).

The worst way to train is to jump to (4) without attending to (1), (2), and (3).

It is almost as bad to jump to (3) without attending to (1) and (2).

And it is also bad to jump to (2) without attending to (1).

ranger