Ranger's training thread

[Nosmo]

Not showing up for the awards ceremony was inexcusable and disrespectful, we need a word on this Rich, you wasn't laid out and unable to make it, what's the story? Did you congratulate the 2 medallists at all?

Really who cares if he didn't show up? If I won I wouldn't.
Leave it alone. We'd all be better off.

I dont quite understand that quote, so if you travelled somewhere, competed, won a medal, you wouldnt show at the ceremony?

I meant if I won I wouldn't care if the bronze medalist showed up or not. That is their choice and would not reflect on me in any way. If I went to England of course I would show up--but I'd never travel very far just to do an erg race.
I have won many races and didn't stick around to pick up my medals. (Granted they were a lot less prestigious then BIRC or the HOCR. )

[wgr]

Folks,

We need a reset here.

Everbody go the mall and buy something nice for someone.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SXh7JR9oKVE&feature=aso

[Bob S.]

Folks,

We need a reset here.

Everbody go the mall and buy something nice for someone.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SXh7JR9oKVE&feature=aso

Great! Thanks for passing it on.

Bob S.

[pmacaula]

Rich -
You might consider joining some of the regular long distance ergers on RowPro. There are a few whose regular sessions would match well with what you are looking to do. Most do little or no ergatta racing, so no fear of racing your training.

If you feel like having a go at a record on a given day, great. If not, no worries. There are people at widely differing paces in any given session. If you want someone to be a 'pace boat' for you, just say so in the chat session before the row. People are usually pretty happy to help out that way.

The other benefit is that C2 treats RP sessions uploaded to their server the same way they do IND_V sessions, so it simplifies the whole recording process. A workout only goes in the ranking if you decide to flag it as such.

Cheers. Patrick.

[Citroen]

PLEASE STOP FEEDING EVERYONE'S FAVOURITE TROLL.

He won't use RowPro, there's no point asking him to use RowPro - it's too technical.

[Carl Watts]

Rich -
You might consider joining some of the regular long distance ergers on RowPro. There are a few whose regular sessions would match well with what you are looking to do. Most do little or no ergatta racing, so no fear of racing your training.

If you feel like having a go at a record on a given day, great. If not, no worries. There are people at widely differing paces in any given session. If you want someone to be a 'pace boat' for you, just say so in the chat session before the row. People are usually pretty happy to help out that way.

The other benefit is that C2 treats RP sessions uploaded to their server the same way they do IND_V sessions, so it simplifies the whole recording process. A workout only goes in the ranking if you decide to flag it as such.

Cheers. Patrick.

Already sugested this to Rich a while back. It's the ideal training tool for someone that sits in the basement to get to actually row the metres he says he rows but clearly doesn't.

I will be one of the first to sign up and be on the starting line.

There are also numerous people using RowPro that can row a Sub 7 and a few names that come to mind that can pull a 6:30 pace row anytime they want without having to travel to the UK to prove it.

With the number of people using RowPro there is also some talk of a RowPro World Champs where you can race without the hassle of having to travel half way round the world. It has to be the way to go in the future.

[ranger]

Over the next month or so, the facility that I am going to try to regain/revive/recapture, now that I row well (13 SPI) at low drag (120 df.), is just everyday, steady state, UT1 rowing over long distances, at 24 spm, pushing that distance out to a FM.

When I first began rowing back in 2000, this was my normal session.

Rowing well at low drag vs. rowing poorly at max drag makes quite a difference, though--in pace, ratio, rhythm, skeletal-muscular and physiological demands, etc.

Back in 2000, rowing poorly at max drag (200+ df.), I pulled just under 10 SPI in my distance rowing, 1:54 @ 24 spm (9.8 SPI), 235 watts, in a 2-to-1 ratio, .8 seconds for the drive, 1.6 seconds for the recovery.

Now, rowing well (13 SPI) at low drag (120 df.), I pull 13 SPI, 1:44 @ 24 spm, 310 watts, in a 4-to-1 ratio, .5 seconds for the drive, 2 seconds for the recovery.

The difference?

At the same rate, I now pull 75 watts more, 10 seconds per 500m faster, at twice the ratio, and half the drag.

Pretty big change.

I am very comfortable with this new technique now.

I just need to do it every day until I can do long distances, all the way out to a FM, at 24 spm, with the same steady state heart rate that I used to maintain back in 2000, about 155 bpm.

If I do indeed succeed in reviving/regaining/recapturing this everyday, steady state UT1 rowing, my improvement will have nothing to do with fitness.

My fitness now is pretty much the same as it was back in 2000.

The improvement will be entirely technical.

I used to row poorly.

I now row well.

I now row with standard OTW technique.

24 spm is also a great rate to row at over long distances in a 1x, so this long distance erging should transfer directly to my OTW efforts when I get back out in my 1x in the spring.

ranger

[ausrwr]

You row exactly the same as you did, just slower.

Most people, after they'd gone so far south of potential, or a lock, or whatever, might have displayed a ilttle bit of humility, or acknowledged that they might not have been right.

You can't and won't do what you say. 1:44 at 24? My arse. You did 1:45.5 or so at a much higher rating than that. Get over yourself.

[ranger]

You row exactly the same as you did, just slower.

Most people, after they'd gone so far south of potential, or a lock, or whatever, might have displayed a ilttle bit of humility, or acknowledged that they might not have been right.

You can't and won't do what you say. 1:44 at 24? My arse. You did 1:45.5 or so at a much higher rating than that. Get over yourself.

My BIRC row was just a paddle. I was physically depleted, out of gas. It had nothing to do with my capabilities or training.

Other than a few more slaps at 2K lwt WRs this winter, I will no longer row as a energy-depleted lightweight.

I don't train that way; therefore, it is just too different, and too much trouble, to race that way.

At WIRC 2011, I will row as a 60s heavyweight, and therefore, charged up and ready, I can draw on my full stroking power and training.

There will be no mystery about what I can do or not.

I will race all of the distance events between now and the first of the year.

All of the distance events are interrelated 2K predictors, for me, at "double the d, add 3."

So, think what you want..

It's irrelevant.

Get over yourself.

Your opinion about my rowing doesn't matter a whit.

It just reflects your own inadequacies, loyalties, prejudices, misjudgments, insecurities, etc.

ranger

[ranger]

You row exactly the same as you did, just slower.

Nope.

Just factually incorrect.

Drag is now 120 df. rather than 200+ df.

Drive time is now .5 seconds rather than .8 seconds.

My natural stroke at all rates is now 12-13 SPI, rather than 9-10 SPI.

Peak force is now 125 kg.F rather than 90 kg.F.

Force curve is now a smooth, left-leaning haystack rather than a trapezoid.

Slide is now full rather than cut. The rollers on my seat come 8 inches from front stops. In that position, my shins are vertical.

Shoulders and core are now relaxed at the catch. My stroke is initiated by my legs. My core is not initiated until I swing my back. My shoulders are not used until I pull with my arms.

Back and core are now steady in their angle until the middle of my stroke. I push straight back at the catch rather than pulling up. I no longer sit on a towel so that I can pull up even harder and faster at the catch with my (tensed) back, core, and arms, pulling with all of my levers simultaneously.

Finish is now with my arms rather than my back (dumping the finish with my arms).

Recovery of my arms/hand and back are now quick in their return to prep position.

Slide is now controlled with my legs rather than with the momentum of my upper body, crashing into front stops.

Drive at the catch is still from the balls of my feet at the footplate, but my heels are now set when I swing my back.

Toes drive down when I pull with my arms, pushing the boat/wheel away. Finish is with pointed toes.

No 60s lwt has ever pulled anything like 13 SPI with their natural rowing motion.

Better, no 60s _heavyweight_ now rowing pulls 13 SPI with their natural rowing motion.

I supsect that Paul Hendershott pulled right around 13 SPI when he was 60 and pulled 6:24.

Jon Bone pulls 13 SPI.

Then again, Paul is, what, 6'4, 230 lbs.?

Jon is, what, 6'6", 270 lbs.?

As I remember, Paul's feet barely fit on the footplate.

Paul wears something like size sixteen shoes.

I wear size nine and a half shoes.

I have now rowed a couple of dozen official lightweight 2Ks at race venues.

ranger

[paul s]

Time for another Holiday reset. On Saturday, October 30, 2010, the Opera Company of Philadelphia brought together over 650 choristers from 28 participating organizations to perform one of the Knight Foundation's "Random Acts of Culture" at Macy's in Center City Philadelphia. Accompanied by the Wanamaker Organ - the world's largest operational pipe organ.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wp_RHnQ- ... re=related

Paul S

[JohnBove]

You row exactly the same as you did, just slower.

Then again, Paul is, what, 6'4, 230 lbs.?

Jon is, what, 6'6", 270 lbs.?
ranger

But you're a much bigger asshole.

[leadville]

(mindless drivel)

I now row well.

I now row with standard OTW technique.

(more mindless drivel)

ranger

rangerboy, 'standard OTW technique' does not include moving the oar handle in an oval, nor jerking the head back mid-drive, nor laying back past 30 degrees, nor coming forward on the slide before the hands are past the knees.

Interesting that after ten years you finally decided you can't compete as a lightweight. That's a mighty long learning curve, but it does show you CAN EVENTUALLY learn.

Perhaps you might even learn to scull OTW after enough abysmal performances show you how poor your technique really is.

That'll take, what, another decade?

[ausrwr]

You row exactly the same as you did, just slower.

Most people, after they'd gone so far south of potential, or a lock, or whatever, might have displayed a ilttle bit of humility, or acknowledged that they might not have been right.

You can't and won't do what you say. 1:44 at 24? My arse. You did 1:45.5 or so at a much higher rating than that. Get over yourself.

My BIRC row was just a paddle. I was physically depleted, out of gas. It had nothing to do with my capabilities or training.

Other than a few more slaps at 2K lwt WRs this winter, I will no longer row as a energy-depleted lightweight.

I don't train that way; therefore, it is just too different, and too much trouble, to race that way.

At WIRC 2011, I will row as a 60s heavyweight, and therefore, charged up and ready, I can draw on my full stroking power and training.

There will be no mystery about what I can do or not.

I will race all of the distance events between now and the first of the year.

All of the distance events are interrelated 2K predictors, for me, at "double the d, add 3."

So, think what you want..

It's irrelevant.

Get over yourself.

Your opinion about my rowing doesn't matter a whit.

It just reflects your own inadequacies, loyalties, prejudices, misjudgments, insecurities, etc.

ranger

Can you not see what what you did was a race, moron? You turned up and raced. All you had on the day was a 7:02. That's fine and dandy. But it demonstrated nothing of the "I'm much better now", or that you row any differently. I'm not talking about the drag you use.

Unfortunately, you still row with a stroke (the movement components) that is pretty much the same as your "hauling the anchor and rowing like shit".

Not to take anything away from your past achievements, but your present is woeful We were both a similar distance from our respective WRs. You were 26 seconds away, I was 28 seconds. And if we're looking at open WRs, you were 1 minute and 3 seconds away. But I don't pretend to be anything other than a lightly trained drunk and has-been who races for the fun and the mates I've made out of it.

Totally different than you. You claim to be world-beating, and innovating, and training 4 or 5 hours a day in complete control of your body. That's unless you were lying about the whole thing. My prejudices are obvious: I think you're a liar; that you have not an atom of sportsmanship in your body; and that the more you think you know about training, the less you've achieved. I'm well over myself. It's pretty clear that you're not. And if you were in any further doubt about the opinion that I hold of you (I shan't speak for anyone else), read the (entirely co-incidental, I assure you) initial letters of each paragraph.

[ranger]

Not to take anything away from your past achievements, but your present is woeful

No, it's not.

Individual performances don't mean anything at all, especially given the circumstances (a foreign venue, rowing at weight, etc.).

I had a similarly bad row in a USIRT trial in the fall of 2003, but I came back in the winter with seven straight successes, including three straight WR lightweight rows (6:30, 6:29, 6:28), the others being 6:36, 6:33, 6:32, and 6:32. Obviously, the failure in the fall performance had nothing to do with my capabilities or training.

In 2006, when I was 55, I had four very bad rows, struggling with my weight, trying to row with no energy, but then, rowing a few pounds over weight, I pulled sub-6:30.

Before all is said and done, I still think I'll row a 2K this year that is 20-25 seconds faster than I rowed last year, when I pulled 6;41, and in the light of this performance, the failure at BIRC 2010 will mean nothing at all.

ranger