Ranger's training thread

[Citroen]

You will never post them because the times are nowhere near where you claim they will be. You will claim having never done them because you can't post average results.

No. If I do the sessions, I'll post the results.

And when that happens I'll be tucking in to a nice dinner of battered and deep fried C2 seat pad topped with monterey jack cheese, served with french fries and a side of onion rings.

Quite simply put you won't do it, because everything you post is deliberately out of focus, shows a minimal display or is obscured so that we can't interpret what it's telling us.

[whp4]

You will never post them because the times are nowhere near where you claim they will be. You will claim having never done them because you can't post average results.

No. If I do the sessions, I'll post the results.

And when that happens I'll be tucking in to a nice dinner of battered and deep fried C2 seat pad topped with monterey jack cheese, served with french fries and a side of onion rings.

Quite simply put you won't do it, because everything you post is deliberately out of focus, shows a minimal display or is obscured so that we can't interpret what it's telling us.

This is ranger we are talking about, I think Hanlon's Razor shouldn't be ruled out.

[ranger]

In rowing, the difference between the physical capacities of a 20-year-old and a 60-year-old translates into about 15 seconds per 500m over 2K.

The difference between doing a 2K unsharpened vs. sharpened is about 3 seconds per 500.

So, if you want to row fast as a 60-year-old, which of these areas would you rank as a higher priority?

For instance, what if the difference in physical capacity between a 20-year-old and a 60-year-old were reduced to 5 seconds per 500m over 2K rather than 15 seconds?

The gain would be 10 seconds per 500m.

A gain of that magnitude overwhelms any gain that can be achieved by sharpening.

ranger

[ranger]

Quite simply put you won't do it, because everything you post is deliberately out of focus, shows a minimal display or is obscured so that we can't interpret what it's telling us.

How is that?

I did 3.5 hours of physical work this morning--an hour OTErg, an hour OTBike, and an hour OTW.

On my trainer, I biked at 21 mph for 90min.

On the erg, I rowed 1:50 @ 20 spm (13.2 SPI) for various distances for a total of 15K.

OTW, I pulled 7 SPI, at various rates for various distances, for a total of 10.4K.

This is clear as a bell.

ranger

[ranger]

BTW: Rich: I did two non-stop 10ks in 45' & change today (well below AT)

Sure.

Just a bunch of rowing at 24 spm.

No problem.

Are you going to rate 30 spm this year at the Head of the Charles?

Even at a lowly 7 SPI, that's 1:58.5 pace.

ranger

[NavigationHazard]

On the erg, I rowed 1:50 @ 20 spm (13.2 SPI) for various distances for a total of 15K [in one hour's erg time].

Let's see. That's 30 x 500m @ 1:50 r20/10" rest. 15 x 1k @ 1:50 r20 on 20" rest. 6 x 2500m @ 1:50 r20 on 50" rest. 3 x 5k @ 1:50 r20 on 1:40 rest. Any of those sound likely? Any combination thereof, e.g. 15 x 500m @ 1:50 r20/10" rest followed immediately by 3 x 2500m @ 1:50 r20 on 50" rest? Didn't think so.

Using the 70% of watts association, 30' r20 @ 1:50 would indicate something around a 6:30 2k. Nope. 2 x 30' @1:50 r20/5' rest didn't happen either.

Hmm..... And then ther's the question of precisely when this all happened, inasmuch as you posted at 1:27 am; 2:41 am; 2:45 am; 2:53 am; 3:00 am; 3:22 am; 3:25 am; 3:54 am; 4:07 am; 4:11 am; 4:28 am; 4:30 am; 4:33 am; 4:43 am; 4:45 am; 4:47 am; 6:40 am; 6:48 am; 7:03 am; 7:44 am; 7:46 am; and again at 9:45 am when you wrote "I did two loops today, after 15K on the erg and 90min on the bike (at 20.8 MPS)."

Coulnd't have been much time for breakfast in there. Not to mention sleep, although since you're apparently in a manic stage you may not require it....

[mikvan52]

BTW: Rich: I did two non-stop 10ks in 45' & change today (well below AT)

Sure.

Just a bunch of rowing at 24 spm.

No problem.

Are you going to rate 30 spm this year at the Head of the Charles?

Even at a lowly 7 SPI, that's 1:58 pace.

ranger

Rich: (ARE YOU LISTENING?) Spi is not a measure of anything on the water because no timing device estimates watts... Therefore spi cannot be calculated (as spi is watts/stroke rate)...

Pace/500m cannot be interpolated because of not being able to factor in wind effects..
For instance: I was sculling at even pressure today.... for long periods my pace varied because of the wind .....2:04 to 2:30...
If there really is a sculling spi how would I ever be able to calculate my spi?

Even w/o an answer to my question... It is clear that OTW rowers focus on maintaining pace not an abstruse marker such as watts/ stroke rate.

If you read my blog you can see that I vary stroke rate at a variety of speeds... so... why bother to ask what I am doing when it's all written down elsewhere for anyone to read at will?
I will try to maintain 2:03/500m pace for the HOCR this year (if it's flat or near flat calm)....

What will you try to maintain at the Head of the Grand in your boat, The WindSucker?

[ranger]

Pace/500m cannot be interpolated because of not being able to factor in wind effects

Sure.

I just mean in calm conditions, no current--rowing on a lake some glassy morning.

It's just an ideal.

Conditions will always affect this ideal, one way or another, in terms of timing.

Nothing to be done about that.

But it really doesn't change what _you_ can do and/or am doing.

You can't control conditions!

ranger

[ranger]

I will try to maintain 2:03/500m pace for the HOCR this year (if it's flat or near flat calm)....
What will you try to maintain at the Head of the Grand in your boat, The WindSucker?

Who knows?

I have never timed myself over any pieces.

In my training, I am just starting that process.

I haven't been racing.

I have been learning to row.

If I hold my technique together and rate 27 spm, I'll go 2:03.

But it might take me a few dozen 5Ks in training before I do that successfully.

Both OTErg and OTW, the major task in a 5K, I think, is to get the rate up, and keep it up for the 20min, without losing your technique.

I want to get the rate up to 30 spm and hold it there.

For me, that means a 2-to-1 ratio, give or take a bit.

So, that's what I'll be drilling on (in as many ways as possible) over the next month or so, both OTW and OTErg.

Then I'll move on to anaerobic work at a 1-to-1 ratio, 40 spm, give or take a bit, to prepare for BIRC.

ranger

[ranger]

Mike--

If what you have been reporting about your OTW SPI is right (7.6 SPI, etc.), in good conditions, your pace target of 2:03 for the Head of the Charles means your rate target is 24 spm.

Is that right?

That's a pretty low rate.

I am not working that hard at all when I am rating 24 spm, certainly not AT.

I need to rate 30 spm to get to AT.

ranger

[ranger]

Mike--

You have a pretty big problem, one that I would work on with the erg, if I were you, where conditions are perfect.

If your aerobic capacity is indeed fine, as you say it is, then you should be able to row well at 22 spm with a UT2 HR (70% HRR).

For lightweights, rowing well OTErg is 12-13 SPI.

Rowing well OTW is 7-8 SPI.

So, OTErg, you should be able to row along, say, 1:48 @ 22 spm (12.5 SPI) for a couple of hours, perhaps even a FM, as I can, with a HR that is around 125 bpm, given that your maxHR is 163 bpm.

I really don't understand why you row well OTW (and therefore keep your rate down and your SPI up) but not OTErg.

If you row well OTErg, it will help, rather than hinder, your OTW rowing.

You don't want to row a FM OTErg at 2:00 pace pulling 9 SPI, e.g., at 23 spm, as most 60s lwts might do.

That will just avoid the work you need to do and ruin your technique for your OTW rowing.

You want to row a FM, 1:48 @ 22 spm (12.5 SPI).

Then, when you row OTW at 22 spm, your HR won't be pushing into AT, as yours is now, but will just be clunking along at UT2.

And then, when you race 5K, and raise your HR to AT, you can rate 30 spm, rather than 24 spm.

An AT HR is 30 bpm above a UT2 HR.

ranger

[macroth]

So, OTErg, you should be able to row along, say, 1:48 @ 22 spm (12.5 SPI) for a couple of hours, perhaps even a FM, as I can,

No you can't, you pathetic, miserable liar.

[Citroen]

Rich: (ARE YOU LISTENING?)

NEVER. He won't pay attention to anything you write (don't know why you bother). He's crap at math and particularly crap at grasping any new idea. He's also, constantly trying to apply those mythical SPI numbers to everything he does. It's a wonder he isn't measuring watts and cadence on his bike so he could get a bikeSPI from that.

There's also his complete lack of understanding on anything to do with physics, so your bleating about current and wind won't trigger any of his synapses - he doesn't have that stuff wired in his brain.

Then there's rangertime, which somehow has more than twenty four hours in his day and has an hour in which 15k of rowing can be completed despite the evidence of his posting crap on showing that it isn't possible.

He is the ultimate lying, fraudulent internet troll and we're all being sucked into his trolling vortex.

[ranger]

Rich: (ARE YOU LISTENING?)

NEVER. He won't pay attention to anything you write (don't know why you bother). He's crap at math and particularly crap at grasping any new idea. He's also, constantly trying to apply those mythical SPI numbers to everything he does. It's a wonder he isn't measuring watts and cadence on his bike so he could get a bikeSPI from that.

There's also his complete lack of understanding on anything to do with physics, so your bleating about current and wind won't trigger any of his synapses - he doesn't have that stuff wired in his brain.

Then there's rangertime, which somehow has more than twenty four hours in his day and has an hour in which 15k of rowing can be completed despite the evidence of his posting crap on showing that it isn't possible.

He is the ultimate lying, fraudulent internet troll and we're all being sucked into his trolling vortex.

Oh, bah.

If it isn' t already obvious, by the end of this indoor rowing season (2011), it will be clear that I am one of the best ergers in the history of the sport, if not the best, bar none.

I was four seconds under the 50s lwt WR in my first race, as a complete novice, pulling at max drag, not even knowing how to row.

I have three WR rows.

Last year, no one my age and weight (or older) came within 20 seconds of my 2K, even though I still pulled my 2Ks at max drag (albeit with better technique) without even preparing to race.

I have spent the last seven years learning to row well, both OTW and OTErg. This project is now complete.

This indoor racing season (2011), when I row well at low drag (118 df.) and am fully prepared/sharpened to race, no one my age and weight (or older) will come within 40 seconds of my 2K.

10 seconds per 500m!

At 60, I will outrow the best 40s lwts.

ranger

[ranger]

I have the best coach in the world.



Thanks, coach.

You're amazing!

ranger