Ranger's training thread

[ranger]

I'm an IS an your're an IF... That speaks volumes...

Indeed it does.

For example, it might explain why, at the end of the day, I will have a slew of WRs OTErg, including 6:16 at 60, and row 17:50 at the Head of the Charles; while from here on out, you won't come within 30 seconds of a WR on the erg, or do better than 19:10 at the Head of the Charles.

What you can't imagine, you can't do.

ranger

[ranger]

For me 1:47 OTErg 5k + 12 would give me 1:59 at the HOCR...
I'll take it!~

Yes.

Encouraging, no?

19:10

ranger

[ranger]

I was wrong.
Meyer used to report 10k on the erg:

RANKING RESULTS 2006

Indoor Rower | Individual and Race Results | 10000m | Men's | Lightweight | Ages 50-59 | 2006 Season

Jack Meyer 56 West Rockport ME USA 35:34.7

Now, that was when he was 56... He was 60 when he sculled to third pace in the 60-69 group at the HOCR

3 Unaffiliated (Jack Meyer) 20:40.216 1.88% BEHIND 1ST PLACE
sculling at 2-4 spm higher than DIetz, the winner. I might add...

(his 2006 time was unavailable when I tried to look it up today... It was probably 19:xx...)

Interesting.

So, Meyer is _very_ good OTErg, at 56, a lwt 1:44 for 5K, 1:39 for 2K, WR stuff.

Even if he has slowed down four seconds per 500m since then, it suggests that he could still do 2:00 pace for the Head of the Charles, given good conditions and perfect rowing.

His 20:40 suggests something about eight seconds per 500m slower than that, 20 seconds per 500m slower his erg times rather than 12.

Some of that might be attributed to conditions, some to less than perfect rowing.

ranger

[Byron Drachman]

Where do you set the angle of the footplate on your Fluid--and why?

The question was for MikeVB, but I'll give an answer anyway. You won't believe the answer so I am merely talking to myself:

If you take the catch flat-footed around 39 degrees plus or minus a degree or two would typically be an angle that allows you to be comfortable at the catch with the height of the heels already set. You have better balance at the catch if your feet are firmly planted and you can initiate a stronger drive. If you prefer to start the drive with heels up a larger angle, say 40 to 43 degrees, is typically more comfortable. The C2 has angles and heel heights that do not correspond to boats so most people start the drive with the heels raised when erging.

At the catch you want your shins vertical and your hands at least over the gunwales or outside the boat at the catch.

[nysaag]

Ranger says: "at the end of the day, I will have a slew of WRs OTErg, including 6:16 at 60, and row 17:50 at the Head of the Charles."

Apparently Ranger's day never ends.

This another reason why Henry will ever receive a dime from Ranger, the liar, cheat and troll.

[ranger]

You have better balance at the catch if your feet are firmly planted and you can initiate a stronger drive.

Why do you get a stronger drive if your heels are firmly set.

Tom Bohrer recommends the opposite, rolling way up on your toes at the catch.

I prefer Tom's advice to yours.

Which advice should I take?

What do you do for 2K on the erg and what is your best time at the Head of the Charles?

ranger

[mikvan52]

I'm an IS an your're an IF... That speaks volumes...

Indeed it does.

(snip)


What you can't imagine, you can't do.

ranger

Let's add the corollary:
What ranger imagines, he never even tries to do.


Rich: I prefer the ladder analogy.. I attempt to climb it one rung at a time (aka intermediate goals).

It seems you stand at the bottom (6:40 2k erg) and try to leap to some spot that lies above the top rung.

How 'rung' can you be?
I'm sorry, it's the heat!

[ranger]

Mike--

Knowing that I am 60 years old, Gord Henry set my footplate for geriatrics, on the highest hole.

Is that where he set yours?

He said he set it there because I was an old fart and might have trouble with flexibility.

Younger rowers, he said, might prefer a larger angle.

On the adjustment for the footplate angle on the Fluid, there are six holes.

It looks as though the footplate can be set at an angle as high as 75 degrees.

I will need to experiment with this.

The more you drive off the balls off your feet, and only then transition to the middle of your foot and then to your heels, the more you engage your quads, rather than your hams.

I used to row _entirely_ on my toes.

Well, you don't want to do that.

But I think I might like a footboard that was at close to a maximal angle.

I don't have any problem with balance.

ranger

[mikvan52]

You have better balance at the catch if your feet are firmly planted and you can initiate a stronger drive.

Why do you get a stronger drive if your heels are firmly set.

Tom Bohrer recommends the opposite, rolling way up on your toes at the catch.

I prefer Tom's advice to yours.

Which advice should I take?

What do you do for 2K on the erg and what is your best time at the Head of the Charles?

ranger

Rich: I think you'll find a full range of advice about foot plate angle and how to articulate the feet.

BTW: Hudson's introduction of the BatLogic system ensures that your full foot stays anchored to the plate for the entire stroke cycle... It is quite effective and should be tried to be appreciated.
I have it in my old 2004 Hudson... IT seems to allow me to go faster!

I do not need two boats though... Anybody want to buy it?... Only $5,000 w/the system.

Back to the angle question... There's no hard and fast rule as to where it should be set.. One needs to set it according to one's personal biomechanical profile.

[mikvan52]

Mike--

Knowing that I am 60 years old, Gord Henry set my footplate for geriatrics, on the highest hole.

Is that where he set yours?

He said he set it there because I was an old fart and might have trouble with flexibility.

Younger rowers, he said, might prefer a larger angle.

On the adjustment for the footplate angle on the Fluid, there are six holes.

It looks as though the footplate can be set at an angle as high as 75 degrees.

I will need to experiment with this.

The more you drive off the balls off your feet, and only then transition to the middle of your foot and then to your heels, the more you engage your quads, rather than your hams.

I used to row _entirely_ on my toes.

Well, you don't want to do that.

But I think I might like a footboard that was at close to a maximal angle.

I don't have any problem with balance.

ranger

I'm thinking you may be mixing two concepts:
1: foot plate height
2: foot plate angle

Now, naturally, the angle will change if you raise or lower the plate on the assembly. But, consider this, the angle can also be changed independently of how high your heels are from touching the bottom of the hull.

If a sculler locks down his legs early in the power phase, he will engage his hamstrings, even if he started way up on his toes.... Or, those with flexible ankles can get their heels down early.

As a coach, I have not noticed that one form is predominant when it comes to top-end speed. It seems to be a matter of how one can best get a strong and smooth catch/drive. Personal geometry and other features of boat rigging are huge factors in these choices

[mikvan52]

I will have a slew of WRs including (a) 17:50 at the Head of the Charles.


ranger

17:50 IS IT?


FROM WIKIPEDIA:
COURSE RECORDS FOR ALL 1X DIVISIONS:

"Championship Singles Men: John Biglow 17:29.8 (1982) Women: Virginia Gilder 18:45.6 (1982)'

What a lunatic raves about is always entertaining.

I was talking to John a few days ago at a birthday party, he didn't look worried about your having threatened to emerge on the OTW scene. Go figure.

Why not try for Ginny Gilder's 18:45 first?

or, how about this? Think about eclipsing the 70's mark in 11 years... Far more probable... 1 in a million.

"Senior Veteran Singles Men: R. Kendall 20:31.75 (adjusted) (2001)"

[ranger]

What ranger imagines, he never even tries to do.

Yea.

That's why I have three WR rows on the erg, shaving four seconds off the WR in all, and you haven't come within a couple of seconds per 500 of a WR on the erg.



To row 6:16, the first task is to row a HM, 1:45 @ 25 spm (or a FM 1:48 @ 22 spm).

So that's what I am working on, the first task.

Not trying?

Hmm.

The sweat for three feet on each side of my erg never dries.



Mike--

You do a HM on the erg at about 1:53.

So, how do you get to 1:45?

Got any ideas?

Right now, you miss it by 8 seconds per 500m (at the same rate).

At the moment, you can barely do 2K @ 1:45 rating 30 spm.

You pull under 10 SPI when you rate 25 spm for a HM; you need to pull 12 SPI.

You know how to row well.

Why row like shit?

ranger

[ranger]

Now, naturally, the angle will change if you raise or lower the plate on the assembly.

That's all I was asking about.

Sure, I have been working on the other stuff for years.

I do the stroke cycle in 16 beats in a 4-beat meter.

On the footplate, the first four beats as do them now are:

Toes, foot, heels, toes

This action is _very_ fast!

About a .1 of a second for each beat/gesture, when the rate gets high.

I swing my back on the fourth beat and pull with my arms on the fifth beat.

Therefore, I push through with my heels well before I swing my back and push the boat away with my toes as I swing my back and pull with my arms.

The recovery is 11 beats.

Ratio?

11/5

2.2

ranger

[mikvan52]

What ranger imagines, he never even tries to do.

Yea.

That's why I have three WR rows on the erg, shaving four seconds off the WR in all, and you haven't come within a couple of seconds per 500 of a WR on the erg.



To row 6:16, the first task is to row a HM, 1:45 @ 25 spm (or a FM 1:48 @ 22 spm).

So that's what I am working on, the first task.

Not trying?

Hmm.

The sweat for three feet on each side of my erg never dries.



Mike--

You do a HM on the erg at about 1:53.

So, how do you get to 1:45?

Got any ideas?

Right now, you miss it by 8 seconds per 500m (at the same rate).

You pull under 10 SPI when you rate 25 spm for a HM; you need to pull 12 SPI.

You know how to row well.

Why row like shit?

ranger

As the sun sets over the fetid Huron River, cocktail time arrived at Chalet Ranger. Just in time too. The flagging sense of self worth was deflating rapidly.

[whp4]

What ranger imagines, he never even tries to do.

Yea.

That's why I have three WR rows on the erg, shaving four seconds off the WR in all, and you haven't come within a couple of seconds per 500 of a WR on the erg.

Uh, no. You have no world records. You have a trio of rows which were once fast enough to be the world record, but Mike has also rowed fast enough to match some long-ago beaten records. You haven't threatened a lightweight WR since 2003, and your only hope to ever do so again is in the year that you change age group brackets.

Why row like shit?

Indeed, why do you row like shit? Could it be that your coach is incompetent?