Fall Racing Series

[old] FrankJ · Post by **[old] FrankJ** » September 26th, 2005, 7:57 pm

<table width='95%' cellspacing='1' cellpadding='3' border='0' align='center'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>CODE</div></td></tr><tr><td class='code'><div> Here are the dates for the races subject to results of the poll: Weekend Type of race Oct 8 & 9 5k handicap Oct 15 & 16 5k straight Oct 22 & 23 6k handicap Oct 29 & 30 6k straight Nov 5 & 6 1k handicap Nov 12 & 13 1k straight Nov 19 & 20 10k handicap Nov 26 & 27 10k straight Dec 3 & 4 2k handicap Dec 10 & 11 2k straight </div></td></tr></table>

[old] FrankJ · Post by **[old] FrankJ** » September 26th, 2005, 7:58 pm

Rules for the Fall Racing Series. This will be a combination series with both handicap and straight races at each distance on alternating weekends for a total of 10 races. The 5 distances to be contested will be 5K, 6K, 1K, 10K and 2K in that order. The series will start on October 8 & 9 based on the pole that is currently running. Actually it is tied right now but I will go with whichever date is ahead by Thursday at 21:00 GMT. The first race will be a 5K contested on the weekend we choose. The only scoring for handicap races will be 10 points for participating and the top 3 finishers for the weekend will win 12, 6 and 3 points respectively. I see the handicap races more as tie breakers and tune ups for the following weekend. More on how to determine handicaps later. The second weekend will be a straight 5K. We can try to group people by speed but that may not be possible. The scoring will be based on the Nonathlon system. The only difference is that the Nonathlon score will be divided by 10. For example a Nonathlon score or 885 would be converted to 88.5. A score of 956 would be 95.6. There will also be bonus points awarded to the top 3 places for the weekend of 12, 6 and 3 points. We will follow this pattern for the whole series ending with a straight 2K on the 10th weekend. Scoring will be a combination of the individuals 4 best handicap and 4 best straight scores. This will allow rowers to miss one of each type of race with no impact on the final score. Note that this scoring system does not favor one distance over another and all distances have the same potential score. Handicaps will be based on the individuals best time for the current (2006) season. If the rower does not have a best from the 2006 season then the best from the 2005 season can be used. If neither time is available the individual should estimate a best time based on other distances. Once a rower has at least one quality time we will then use the Nonathlon to predict other times for this rower. It will be the responsibility of the rower to insure that the race master of the race they have entered has their best time preferably at least the day before the race. This will allow the race master some time to calculate the start delays needed for the race. I have a spreadsheet available to race masters for calculating the start delays in each race and would prefer that it be used for all races. If my spreadsheet is not used the race master will have to document how the start delays were calculated so that I can consistently score these events. The straight races will require that we know your age, light or heavyweight, and sex so that we can apply the Nonathlon score after the race. Note that age is your age at the time of each race so if you have a birthday it could change during the series. It will be your responsibility to inform me of this change. Also lightweights should weigh themselves within 2 hours of each event and inform me of any change in weight category. The Nonathlon score will be scored by me after the races and double checked by a volunteer since as yet I do not have an automated way to calculate Nonathlon scores. As with the handicap races there will be bonus points for the top 3 finishers for each weekend. Race masters can schedule races at anytime on the race weekend which will start at 12:00 GMT on Friday and end at 23:59 GMT on Sunday. A valid race will exist if there are at least 2 rowers entered in the race. If one rower is a no-show it is still a valid race. All results and handicap start delay calculations should be sent to me as soon as possible after the race. This is especially important with handicap races since I need to see the start delays to calculate accurate results. Anyone can be a race master in fact I encourage as many of you as possible to try your hand at it. That is one way to share the load. Now it's your turn to comment on these rules and suggest any changes before we start the series. Frank

[old] eparizeau · Post by **[old] eparizeau** » September 26th, 2005, 8:31 pm

Frank - Sounds great to me. Thanks for volunteering the time & energy to organize this. I will be happy to admin some races. Ernie

[old] bmoore · Post by **[old] bmoore** » September 26th, 2005, 8:41 pm

Sounds good. I'm in and will run a few races after I've seen a few more.

[old] michaelb · Post by **[old] michaelb** » September 26th, 2005, 10:17 pm

Looks great, sign me up. Thanks for doing this Frank. I still can't figure out how people can row for PBs for 10 weeks straight, but it seems to me that there is no real penalty if I loaf a bit on the handicaps (I bet other people will be back there in the "pack"). I haven't been rowing that much, so I don't know if I will even be faster than I was in the summer series. But Bill and I are going to have to go head to head in some of the straight up races and that is going to hurt a lot (I think he is now faster than me; but I am losing weight and may be a 40s lightweight by the end). 2006 PBs: 5k 18:40 6k 22:42 10k 38:30 How does the Nonathlon "predict" times for other distances? Do you figure out what percent of the standard they are for one distance, and apply that to all the others? I haven't done a 2k or 1k since 2003/2004, so I would be interested to see what predicts. My PBs for the those distances are 3:24 for the 1k and 7:11 for the 2k. Does the Nonathlon contain an adjustment for individual weights, or just the overall weight classes, light and heavy? I thought it was based on individual ages too. How were you thinking we split into "fields" for the straight races, or were you going to not do that? I would still prefer if we did some informal splitting up at least, so that instead of a lot of variations in the times of the races, we had some planned for Sat and/or Sun am that were targeted to a specific pace (but under these rules, anyone else could still sign up). To avoid chaos in scheduling, it might help to have that planned out in advance as to who is going to be race master for which general "class" or target.

[old] Sir Pirate · Post by **[old] Sir Pirate** » September 27th, 2005, 1:46 am

Top banana Frank sounds good to me, Count me in I will have to get back to you with my SB times though, will post them later tonight when I get home from work. Thanks for sorting all this out Sir Pirate

[old] mpukita · Post by **[old] mpukita** » September 27th, 2005, 5:52 am

Frank: I'm glad to pitch in to admin some races, but am still a rookie at this (Row Pro) and may need a little hand holding. Thanks, as before, for working on this. It sounds well thought out, and a great expansion of the last series. Now we need to attract as many racers (participants) as possible. Ron and I will prod as many of the OSU virtual team to join as we can. Thanks again! -- Mark

[old] mpukita · Post by **[old] mpukita** » September 27th, 2005, 5:55 am

Also gives me ample impetus to drop the remaining 4 pounds to qualify as a lightweight!

[old] JaapR · Post by **[old] JaapR** » September 27th, 2005, 1:20 pm

Wonder if the 2k straight race at the Dutch indoor rowing championships on December 10 apply to the validity rules. Here are my 2006 PB's: 1000: 3:04.7 2000: 6:18.0 (2005) 5000: 16:46.2 6000: 20:34.5 10000: 35:05.9 I'm in the HW, male category, age 41 (all fall) Roland, if you like to join the fall races we can setup the races at 8:00 or 9:00 GMT. In another thread Phil also wrote he can do the early ones. Maybe Andreas can also join these Morning races? Jaap

[old] bmoore · Post by **[old] bmoore** » September 27th, 2005, 1:39 pm

I assume PBs need to be updated until the race is run. For example, the 2k isn't for at least 8 weeks, and I'll may do one before. (Although I might just wait too!) PBs are below. I'll be happy to be race master when needed, but it will generally be at 8AM Boston Time. (The time change will occur during this series). I'll need a quick primer on handicapping, especially if there is some percentage applied instead of the full time. For now, I'll still run a 5k this Saturday at 8AM. If it's a part of the series, great. If not, then I'll have a smaller handicap the following weekend. Also, my 1k PB was a split from a 4x1k workout, which is faster than my one attempt at a straight time a few months ago. Any thoughts on which time to use? I'll continue to run the 4x1k and will probably set PBs each time until I finally run the race in this series. Michael, I'll probably hit PBs each week with this series, only because it's my rookie season, and every time I row sets a new standard. I'm looking forward to straight up races where I don't need the charitable wake of Frank and Sir Pirate. I hope to catch them someday soon...

[old] hennmart · Post by **[old] hennmart** » September 27th, 2005, 1:41 pm

My PB's. Hennie

[old] Andreas · Post by **[old] Andreas** » September 27th, 2005, 3:34 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(JaapR @ Sep 27 2005, 12:20 PM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'> Maybe Andreas can also join these Morning races? Jaap </td></tr></table> Morning sessions are fine with me.From 6-10GMT

[old] FrankJ · Post by **[old] FrankJ** » September 27th, 2005, 6:08 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(michaelb @ Sep 27 2005, 02:17 AM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>Looks great, sign me up. Thanks for doing this Frank. I still can't figure out how people can row for PBs for 10 weeks straight, but it seems to me that there is no real penalty if I loaf a bit on the handicaps (I bet other people will be back there in the "pack"). I haven't been rowing that much, so I don't know if I will even be faster than I was in the summer series. But Bill and I are going to have to go head to head in some of the straight up races and that is going to hurt a lot (I think he is now faster than me; but I am losing weight and may be a 40s lightweight by the end). 2006 PBs: 5k 18:40 6k 22:42 10k 38:30 How does the Nonathlon "predict" times for other distances? Do you figure out what percent of the standard they are for one distance, and apply that to all the others? I haven't done a 2k or 1k since 2003/2004, so I would be interested to see what predicts. My PBs for the those distances are 3:24 for the 1k and 7:11 for the 2k. Does the Nonathlon contain an adjustment for individual weights, or just the overall weight classes, light and heavy? I thought it was based on individual ages too. How were you thinking we split into "fields" for the straight races, or were you going to not do that? I would still prefer if we did some informal splitting up at least, so that instead of a lot of variations in the times of the races, we had some planned for Sat and/or Sun am that were targeted to a specific pace (but under these rules, anyone else could still sign up). To avoid chaos in scheduling, it might help to have that planned out in advance as to who is going to be race master for which general "class" or target. </td></tr></table> Michael, If you can do 10 PBs in a row you probably were being a little too conservative on your earlier PBs. What I try to do is use the race as my hard workout out of the week. What better way to simulate race conditions than an actual race. Part of the reason I think I will like the handicap then straight race format is that it really takes the pressure off of the handicap race. Kind of a hard week easy week racing schedule. I really haven't put it to a test yet but take a new rower that has a Nonathlon score of 850 for a 5K. No PBs at any other contested distance. The answer is to plug times into the other distances to find the ones that generate an 850. Not perfect but a good place to start. The Nonathlon only does the overall weight classes and for now I'm not interested in trying to adjust for individual weights. Maybe when C2 come out with a PM4 that has a scale attachment. I really don't have a good answer on how to split the field. With the handicap race first I figure we can wait and see who we have entered before trying to split things up. There is also the issue as Roland points out of rowers in different time zones. I would assume race masters would be mastering races of similar class rowers if that works out but then how many 60+ rowers want to race me? Frank

[old] FrankJ · Post by **[old] FrankJ** » September 27th, 2005, 6:20 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(mpukita @ Sep 27 2005, 09:52 AM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>Frank: I'm glad to pitch in to admin some races, but am still a rookie at this (Row Pro) and may need a little hand holding. Thanks, as before, for working on this. It sounds well thought out, and a great expansion of the last series. Now we need to attract as many racers (participants) as possible. Ron and I will prod as many of the OSU virtual team to join as we can. Thanks again! -- Mark </td></tr></table> Mark, I'm happy to have all of the volunteer help that I can get rookie or not. There are still some technical issues out there such as e-row racers causing the race to 'Proceed to start' when they check in. So far I've only had one per race and bypassed the problem by having them check in last. It can be frustrating though. My personal opinion is that being race master especially when there are problems costs me some speed during the race. A significant part or racing is the mental effort needed to push your body to the limit. Frank

[old] FrankJ · Post by **[old] FrankJ** » September 27th, 2005, 6:23 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(JaapR @ Sep 27 2005, 05:20 PM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>Wonder if the 2k straight race at the Dutch indoor rowing championships on December 10 apply to the validity rules. ........ Jaap </td></tr></table> Jaap, No problem including your Dutch indoor champioship scores. In fact any formal races would be OK. Frank