Avoiding Hyperextension+yank on legs on drive..?

[Muffdiever]

Hi everyone. Im new to rowing, and recently just bought a concept2 model d. I've learned the form as it comes pretty natural to me from all my years of sports and weight training, but the one thing that seems very difficult is racing through the 500M row or even exploding as hard as i can on the drive and keeping my legs from hyperextending. I feel as if when i try and keep them from hyperextending my times suffer.
I rowed only my 2nd 500M at 1:28.1 secs. avg stroke rate of 44 spm. drag factor was around 140, had it set to 5.5 on the damper. Im 6'2" 205lbs. Im not sure if a higher damper setting will help with hyperextending, or should i lower my my spm....i do not know what would be best for a 500m row....My knees are hurting after just a few rows and i have n prior knee issues, so there is somethingi am doing wrong, plus the combo of rowing many days this week.
I noticed on youtube, there are some people in the 500M row that you can see the force at the end of the drive pulling on their leg from the footstrap, which obviously exterts force on the hips, knees, ankles etc, then i also see people with very good times where this doesnt happen and it seems like at the end of the drive this doesnt happen to them, but yet they still get very good times. Rob Smith is one person on youtube where it looks like his legs are just standing up out of a chair, yet he is pulling amazing times.
So my question is, how do i finish the end of my drive, and/or adjust the drag etc so that i do not hyperextend, or have the footstraps yank on my legs at the end of the drive. Learning this will be essential to longevity on this machine and my health..Please Help!!

[aharmer]

The only way to tell for sure is to post a video of yourself erging. Let the experts here break it down and show you how to improve. I'd post one at your 500 pace as well as one at a slower, training pace. If you are anything like most people, your technique could probably use a lot of improvement. Good luck!

[hjs]

Hi everyone. Im new to rowing, and recently just bought a concept2 model d. I've learned the form as it comes pretty natural to me from all my years of sports and weight training, but the one thing that seems very difficult is racing through the 500M row or even exploding as hard as i can on the drive and keeping my legs from hyperextending. I feel as if when i try and keep them from hyperextending my times suffer.
I rowed only my 2nd 500M at 1:28.1 secs. avg stroke rate of 44 spm. drag factor was around 140, had it set to 5.5 on the damper. Im 6'2" 205lbs. Im not sure if a higher damper setting will help with hyperextending, or should i lower my my spm....i do not know what would be best for a 500m row....My knees are hurting after just a few rows and i have n prior knee issues, so there is somethingi am doing wrong, plus the combo of rowing many days this week.
I noticed on youtube, there are some people in the 500M row that you can see the force at the end of the drive pulling on their leg from the footstrap, which obviously exterts force on the hips, knees, ankles etc, then i also see people with very good times where this doesnt happen and it seems like at the end of the drive this doesnt happen to them, but yet they still get very good times. Rob Smith is one person on youtube where it looks like his legs are just standing up out of a chair, yet he is pulling amazing times.
So my question is, how do i finish the end of my drive, and/or adjust the drag etc so that i do not hyperextend, or have the footstraps yank on my legs at the end of the drive. Learning this will be essential to longevity on this machine and my health..Please Help!!

If someone pulls hard on the straps, the force doesn,t go into the chain but is used to pull yourself up the slide, this is very common in gyms. If this happens you have to finish the stroke before doing the recovery on the slide.
Rob smith is doing this very well, although remember he is also very well trained and although he doesn,t seem to be very big, don,t be fooled he is and has a low bodyfat % also.

technique vid:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?gl=NL&hl=nl&v=eqVmMd7FdAA

[Muffdiever]

Thx. What do you mean by pull on the straps, I assume you mean the yanking on my legs on talking about. This yank is happening at the end of the drive when I am finishing my stroke, not when I am in recovery sliding back towards the flywheel. It is fristrating, and I would to be able to sprint through a 500M without this happening.

[ranger]

Learn to row strapless, building up from low rates to high.

Then, when you master that, put the straps back on and try the 500m again.

ranger

[Byron Drachman]

As already mentioned, if you post a video you'll get some good suggestions.

In the meantime, here is my suggestion: Make sure your knees stay down and your feet keep pressing against the footboard all the way to the finish. If you take a perfect stroke then as you finish the drive with the arm pull, you end up transferring all your momentum to moving the flywheel and there is no pressure against the top of your feet from the straps when you finish the drive. Try to keep your arms straight and relaxed as long as possible, i.e. postpone the arm pull as long as you can. If you start pulling with your arms too soon, then it is hard to get a good arm pull at the finish.

A standard exercise is to row without the straps. If you fall backwards without straps at the finish then you're not doing it right yet. Rowing strapless helps you get it right.

[Muffdiever]

Thanks for the info. Hopefully my webcam can take a good video bc I do not have a vid camera. So you are saying going straless, at the end of the drive your feet shouldn't come off the pressboard? Could this be due to damper setting also bc maybe I have to much power for that setting?

[hjs]

Thx. What do you mean by pull on the straps, I assume you mean the yanking on my legs on talking about. This yank is happening at the end of the drive when I am finishing my stroke, not when I am in recovery sliding back towards the flywheel. It is fristrating, and I would to be able to sprint through a 500M without this happening.

Yes I understood that, If you pull the straps at the end of the stroke your body has still speed, if you finish the stroke this speed is gone and went into the chain, so you start the recovery to soon, finish the stroke 100%, arms last to completely. Learning to row strapless will be very handy for you.

BTW on sprinting you always have some pulling on the straps, the rate is simply to high to not do that.

[hjs]

Thanks for the info. Hopefully my webcam can take a good video bc I do not have a vid camera. So you are saying going straless, at the end of the drive your feet shouldn't come off the pressboard? Could this be due to damper setting also bc maybe I have to much power for that setting?

Damper setting doesn,t matter. Power has nothing to do with the setting. It's 100% technique

[Muffdiever]

Thx. What do you mean by pull on the straps, I assume you mean the yanking on my legs on talking about. This yank is happening at the end of the drive when I am finishing my stroke, not when I am in recovery sliding back towards the flywheel. It is fristrating, and I would to be able to sprint through a 500M without this happening.

Yes I understood that, If you pull the straps at the end of the stroke your body has still speed, if you finish the stroke this speed is gone and went into the chain, so you start the recovery to soon, finish the stroke 100%, arms last to completely. Learning to row strapless will be very handy for you.

BTW on sprinting you always have some pulling on the straps, the rate is simply to high to not do that.

Thanks for the tips guys. I rowed strapless this afternoon. Rowed the 2000M after warming up and getting used to the feel, in 7:24. Drag was 140. My only and best 2000M previously was 7:19 on a damper setting of 10 in the gym, dont know what the drag was on that rower. I could not get over 29 spm strapless. Is this normal? On avg i was about 24/25. I also could not pull a pace under 1:46/500 with the straps off....I dont know if this is good or bad or if my 500M pace will get better without straps or I will need to be strapped in to go better. My knees did not bang while going strapless and I only had trouble keeping my feet down when i tried getting my spm over 28/29. Your advice from here on out is much appreciated. thx

[bloomp]

Just as someone earlier said, you can't rate over 30 without strapping in. Gotta be able to pull yourself up to reduce the recovery that much.

Work on lower rates, longer pieces instead of just worrying about rating up as high as you can. Much more rewarding this way.

[Muffdiever]

thx. But how can i train so that my slower stroke per min does not affect my 500M pace? So basically, what type of workouts should i do to increase my power?

[bloomp]

thx. But how can i train so that my slower stroke per min does not affect my 500M pace? So basically, what type of workouts should i do to increase my power?

Well you won't be able to pull the same pace at a lower rating. More strokes/minute at the same wattage means faster 500m splits. It sounds like you're not training - just doing short pieces. If you're gonna do intervals, you need to do 8x500m, 4x1000m, etc. Those would be at your 2k pace (1:49-1:50). But you should also consider doing 10k+ pieces at 18-24spm, at 2k+15s (2:05-2:08). You won't burn out from doing that, you won't injure as easily, and you will have much better fitness gains.

[hjs]

thx. But how can i train so that my slower stroke per min does not affect my 500M pace? So basically, what type of workouts should i do to increase my power?

I don,t know what your goal is, if you only want to improve your 500 meter time, you should do lot's of base strenghtwork. And you can do power work on the erg. Short intervals on low rating and high power. Thsi is tough on the back. For instance 10 x 250 meter 90 seconds rest, rate 24, 2k pace. Or something like that.

[hjs]

Thx. What do you mean by pull on the straps, I assume you mean the yanking on my legs on talking about. This yank is happening at the end of the drive when I am finishing my stroke, not when I am in recovery sliding back towards the flywheel. It is fristrating, and I would to be able to sprint through a 500M without this happening.

Yes I understood that, If you pull the straps at the end of the stroke your body has still speed, if you finish the stroke this speed is gone and went into the chain, so you start the recovery to soon, finish the stroke 100%, arms last to completely. Learning to row strapless will be very handy for you.

BTW on sprinting you always have some pulling on the straps, the rate is simply to high to not do that.

Thanks for the tips guys. I rowed strapless this afternoon. Rowed the 2000M after warming up and getting used to the feel, in 7:24. Drag was 140. My only and best 2000M previously was 7:19 on a damper setting of 10 in the gym, dont know what the drag was on that rower. I could not get over 29 spm strapless. Is this normal? On avg i was about 24/25. I also could not pull a pace under 1:46/500 with the straps off....I dont know if this is good or bad or if my 500M pace will get better without straps or I will need to be strapped in to go better. My knees did not bang while going strapless and I only had trouble keeping my feet down when i tried getting my spm over 28/29. Your advice from here on out is much appreciated. thx

This is exactly what should happen, well done, rowing strapless can,t be done on higher rates. It used as a tool to get a better stroke, try to keep your feet planted, if you do this you finish your stroke well. Don,t race al your workouts though.