The Two Types of Training

[Rocket Roy]

Mike he will never race you on the water, ever. he wuld be totally and utterly defeated, just like everytime I race him on the erg.

[whp4]

Mike,

a lot of those events you mentioned involved boats and oars. What were you thinking? That's not rowing! Rowing is what ranger does in his basement, or occasionally at some high school gymnasium, when not too many people are watching. Try not to make this mistake again, okay?

[kini62]

No you won't. You never have

Not true.

My best ranked piece for 60min is 16.7K.

I am now working on the technical skills I need to improve on that.

ranger

And just where is this "ranked" piece? I looked as far back as the online records show and it's not there. Seems to be nothing more than the imaginary wolf, as usual.

Gene

[Bob S.]

No you won't. You never have

Not true.

My best ranked piece for 60min is 16.7K.

I am now working on the technical skills I need to improve on that.

ranger

And just where is this "ranked" piece? I looked as far back as the online records show and it's not there. Seems to be nothing more than the imaginary wolf, as usual.

Gene

In the interest of accuracy, you might check out 2003. It was 8 meters short of the quoted distance, but that is not significant when rounding it off to the nearest tenth of a kilometer. I didn't check any of the later years. The page shows only 2005-2010, but the scroll down goes to 2002, another year for which there is a ranking of well over 16 km.

Bob S.

[whp4]

That "16.7k" was also done as a heavyweight, though no doubt there will be claims that it wasn't.

[ranger]

Mike he will never race you on the water, ever. he wuld be totally and utterly defeated, just like everytime I race him on the erg.

You can race on the erg whenever you want, Roy.

So why not?

Show us what you can do.

Your pb is pretty out of date.

You can race OTW whenever you want, too.

Nothing mysterious about racing.

You just time yourself.

Any sort of sprint interval workout is really a mini-race, no?

It's not hard to tell how fast you are going, anyway.

You don't even need a clock.

You just check your wake and the roar of the wind in your ears.



Yep, the one time we raced head-to-head, almost five years ago now, you pulled, what, 6:45?

Nice win.

Congrats.

ranger

[ranger]

That "16.7k" was also done as a heavyweight, though no doubt there will be claims that it wasn't.

Yes, I was a heavyweight at the time, but not by much.

That year, I raced 2K as a lightweight seven times, including all of the major championships internationally.

6:36, 6:33, 6:30 (WIRC), 6:32. 6:29, 6:28 (BIRC), 6:32 (EIRC)

Pretty consistent racing, I would say.



Three of these 2Ks were WR rows.

Two were just .4 seconds off the old WR.

One was 1.4 seconds off the old WR.

The 6:36 was a first race of the winter, a month before WIRC, when I was just getting into my winter sharpening.

I rowed six seconds better a month later at WIRC, when I was fully sharpened.

ranger

[ranger]

When I am doing distance rowing, I like to eliminate the roll up onto my toes at the catch and therefore the first two beats of the drive, when I push off the balls of my feet and roll back to my heels.

The drive of this stroke, then, is shorter and sharper, lifting the ratio to over 4-to-1 (13/3).

The rhythm of the stroke cycle is still the same.

I still do the stroke cycle right on a beat, duple time, in a four-beat measure, 16 pulses to a measure.

Just the gestures on the last two pulses of the recovery and the first two pulses of the drive are elided.

I rest at the catch for four more pulses than I normally do when I am using my full stroke.

These elisions shorten the drive time by 40%, from 5/16 to 3/16 of the stroke cycle.

Given the shortening, this distance stroke is weaker than my full stroke by about 2 SPI, but because the big push with my legs, with heels set, plus the explosive swing of my back and finish with my arms, is still there, I can still get plenty of power for distance rowing.

1:43 @ 29 spm (10 MPS, 11 SPI) comes along just fine.

I don't know, but using this stroke, I think I am going to do 1:43 @ 29 spm for a HM.

This stroke is _very_ efficient.

Back in 2003, 1:43 was my 5K pace.

HM is done at 5K + 6.

So, if I can pull this off, it would be an improvement of six seconds per 500m over a HM vis-a-vis my former self in 2003, when I didn't know how to row.

I have given up rowing at max drag.

This is also helping my quickness and efficiency.

I am now rowing at 145 df.

ranger

[ranger]

BTW, if I maintain the 11 SPI drive of this shortened distance stroke, with heels set, but do the stroke in double time, at 56 spm rather than 28 spm, with only eight rather than 16 pulses to the stroke cycle, with the legs on the downbeat rather than buried in the measure on the third pulse, I am in something close to a 5/3, 1.7-to-1, golden-section ratio, pulling 605 watts, 1:23.5 pace.

1.1 seconds per stroke, .7 seconds on the recovery, .4 seconds on the drive.

Pretty nice stroke for 500m, no?

Danish lightweight racing stroke?

ranger

[ranger]

Well, I guess this makes you far superior to me

Well, so far this year, that's what the _facts_ are, if you are interested in the facts, rather than just blowing a lot of hot air.

RANKING RESULTS 2010
Indoor Rower | Individual and Race Results | 2000m | Men's | Lightweight | Custom Age Range (55–59) | Current 2010 Season

You are number 1 of 101
View your Ranking

1 Rich Cureton 59 Ann Arbor MI USA 6:41.4 RACE
2 Michael van Beuren 57 Hartland VT USA 6:47.6 IND_V

This is certainly to be expected, though.

I have lowered an erg WR by four seconds.

On the erg, you have never come much closer than two seconds per 500m of a WR.

This might have be be considered, too:

I think I might be _much_ better over 2K by the end of April, hopefully well under the 55s lwt WR, perhaps under the 50s lwt WR, too.

I pulled the 6:41 at Cleveland with no substantial sharpening, heck, without even finishing my distance rowing, including distance trials,

Over the next six weeks, I will be working hard to try to get more fully trained.

Will you be better over 2K by the end of April?

ranger

[mrfit]

Ranger's ranking distance trials countdown:
48 days

[whp4]

Let's not forget your most recent effort, which clearly shows the trajectory of your "improvement":

You pulled the 2k in Detroit without even finishing

[ranger]

Let's not forget your most recent effort, which clearly shows the trajectory of your "improvement":

You pulled the 2k in Detroit without even finishing

I think I will be quite a bit better at normal drag, with distance trials, and sharpened.

6:41 at max drag, no distance trials, unsharpened.

Distance trials will tell the story, even before sharpening.

1:43 for a HM predicts a 6:08 2K, etc.

The 60s lwt WR for a HM is 1:54.



ranger

[hjs]

Let's not forget your most recent effort, which clearly shows the trajectory of your "improvement":

You pulled the 2k in Detroit without even finishing

I think I will be quite a bit better at normal drag, with distance trials, and sharpened.

6:41 at max drag, no distance trials, unsharpened.

Distance trials will tell the story, even before sharpening.

1:43 for a HM predicts a 6:08 2K, etc.

ranger

I would admit that work on basic fitness, cross-training, foundational rowing, and technique are hard to evaluate realistically because of how far they are removed from racing, but--happily--I am no longer in that place at all.

I am doing distance rowing and sharpening.

I no longer do foundational rowing.

I am at weight; so cross-training is now dispensable.l

I now row well (13 SPI). I no longer have to work on technique and stroking power.

Heck, I have even done six months or so of distance rowing, slowly building the rate up to 10 MPS and 29 spm, 30 spm, or even 31 spm--1:43 @ 28 spm (11 SPI); 1:40 @ 30 spm (11.7 SPI), 1:37 @ 31 spm (12.4 SPI)-- so that the cadences are smooth and relaxed.

So the only thing remaining is the reality-testing.

So, it is getting to be time to test reality, no?

Wish me luck!

ranger

[ranger]

Yes.

I no longer do foundational rowing.

I am now getting ready for distance trials.

These distance trials will be my first reality testing, because I will be fully trained to race them.

My 2K races this year didn't test any reality.

Sure, I pulled WR pace for my age and weight, but I wasn't fully trained to race them.

ranger