The Two Types of Training

General discussion on Training. How to get better on your erg, how to use your erg to get better at another sport, or anything else about improving your abilities.
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BrianStaff
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Re: The Two Types of Training

Post by BrianStaff » March 8th, 2010, 1:21 pm

ranger wrote: At this point, all the important work is already done.

So there is no reason to have any goals at all.
Of course there is a reason to have a goal...you blithering idiot.

For a supposed academic, you have zero logic in you at all - you also tell lots of lies too.

Do you not understand that starting at a totally unrealistic fast pace causes "fly & die" and DNF`s?

Your fastest recorded pace this year was 6:41

You slowest recorded pace was 7:11

There's a difference there of 30 seconds - just over 7 seconds per 500m

There's that 7 seconds per 500 AGAIN
M 65 / 6'3" / 234lbs as of Feb 14, 2008...now 212
Started Rowing: 2/22/2008
Vancouver Rowing Club - Life Member(Rugby Section)
PB: 500m 1:44.0 2K 7:57.1 5K 20:58.7 30' 6866m

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BrianStaff
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Re: The Two Types of Training

Post by BrianStaff » March 8th, 2010, 1:24 pm

ranger wrote: I have taken my goals out of my profile.

From now on, I will just list results.
Well that means you will never again update your profile, because there will be NO results
M 65 / 6'3" / 234lbs as of Feb 14, 2008...now 212
Started Rowing: 2/22/2008
Vancouver Rowing Club - Life Member(Rugby Section)
PB: 500m 1:44.0 2K 7:57.1 5K 20:58.7 30' 6866m

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Citroen
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Re: The Two Types of Training

Post by Citroen » March 8th, 2010, 1:43 pm

If the blithering idiot has completed his training we can lock this thread. He can start a new one "The two types of racing."

Type 1: Mike vB who turns up, weighs in, sits on the rower (or in his boat) for some time less than seven minutes rowing it down from 2000 to zero, stands on the top step of the podium and graciously accepts the hammer or other gongs.

Type 2: Ranger who may not turn up, may not make weight, may not sit on the rower (as at BIRC), rows until his legs fill with lactate, puts the handle down and buggers off home to blather on the forum for another 10,000 posts. The days when he wins anything are simply the result of Mike vB and/or Roy not being there to race against him.

With a bunch of folks who can't resist replying to his blatherings we should be able to stretch that thread out to another hundred pages.

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Re: The Two Types of Training

Post by ranger » March 8th, 2010, 2:51 pm

Citroen wrote:If the blithering idiot has completed his training we can lock this thread. He can start a new one "The two types of racing."

Type 1: Mike vB who turns up, weighs in, sits on the rower (or in his boat) for some time less than seven minutes rowing it down from 2000 to zero, stands on the top step of the podium and graciously accepts the hammer or other gongs.

Type 2: Ranger who may not turn up, may not make weight, may not sit on the rower (as at BIRC), rows until his legs fill with lactate, puts the handle down and buggers off home to blather on the forum for another 10,000 posts. The days when he wins anything are simply the result of Mike vB and/or Roy not being there to race against him.

With a bunch of folks who can't resist replying to his blatherings we should be able to stretch that thread out to another hundred pages.
??

6:28 is on the way, Dougie.

But that's not a goal for racing.

That's just a goal for training.

That's just one interval in an AT training session: 4 x 2K.

And the indoor training season is not over until the end of April.

:D :D

ranger
Rich Cureton M 72 5'11" 165 lbs. 2K pbs: 6:27.5 (hwt), 6:28 (lwt)

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Re: The Two Types of Training

Post by ranger » March 8th, 2010, 2:52 pm

BrianStaff wrote:
ranger wrote: I have taken my goals out of my profile.

From now on, I will just list results.
Well that means you will never again update your profile, because there will be NO results
There already is one result.

The best 55s lwt 2K of the year by six seconds.

Of course, this doesn't need to stand.

Mike VB could train hard and try to beat it.

But he'd better hurry up.

It will soon be sub-6:30.

Before the end of April, he'll also have a long list of other distance times to contend with.

ranger
Rich Cureton M 72 5'11" 165 lbs. 2K pbs: 6:27.5 (hwt), 6:28 (lwt)

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Re: The Two Types of Training

Post by Nosmo » March 8th, 2010, 2:56 pm

The quiz is still on Ranger:

you wrote: "pace = rate x SPI"
For 10 points, rewrite the equation so it is true.

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Re: The Two Types of Training

Post by ranger » March 8th, 2010, 2:59 pm

DUThomas wrote:49 years of training, goals not even approached, and a grand DNF finale. Nice.
What are you referring to?

I don't have any goals.

Just results.

:D :D

So far, the best 2K in my age and weight division by six seconds.

Nice!

ranger
Rich Cureton M 72 5'11" 165 lbs. 2K pbs: 6:27.5 (hwt), 6:28 (lwt)

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Re: The Two Types of Training

Post by ranger » March 8th, 2010, 3:00 pm

Nosmo wrote:The quiz is still on Ranger:

you wrote: "pace = rate x SPI"
For 10 points, rewrite the equation so it is true.
I am no longer interested in theoretical rigamarole.

It no longer has any bearing on what I am doing.

The important parts of my training are done.

Now, I am just racing.

So I am only interested in results.

I am just trying my best to row fast, given my training.

ranger
Last edited by ranger on March 8th, 2010, 3:08 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Rich Cureton M 72 5'11" 165 lbs. 2K pbs: 6:27.5 (hwt), 6:28 (lwt)

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Re: The Two Types of Training

Post by ranger » March 8th, 2010, 3:05 pm

Brian Staff wrote:Do you not understand that starting at a totally unrealistic fast pace causes "fly & die" and DNF`s?
Sure.

But I am not trained yet to row a 2K.

When you are fully trained to row a 2K, you know exactly what pace to row.

Your sharpening workouts tell you.

I have just completed my UT rowing.

So I know what pace to row for 30min, 10K, 60min, HM, and FM.

But that's about it.

I will be racing these distance events soon.

Sure.

I am only about half trained, and therefore am racing 2Ks _waaay_ off my full potential.

But given this, it is interesting that I have already done a flat-paced 6:41 this year.

That's as fast and well paced as anyone my age and weight has ever done.

Not bad.

A good baseline to work with.

ranger
Rich Cureton M 72 5'11" 165 lbs. 2K pbs: 6:27.5 (hwt), 6:28 (lwt)

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Re: The Two Types of Training

Post by lancs » March 8th, 2010, 3:09 pm

Can you give us any details of your latest DNF?

I'm impressed with your persistence at still calling a row you've failed at several times now an 'AT' row!!

I'm sorry you've failed with your targets for yet another season..

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hjs
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Re: The Two Types of Training

Post by hjs » March 8th, 2010, 3:11 pm

ranger wrote:
hjs wrote:Your results in the 55s age bracket are over.
No, not at all.

My results in the 55s lwts are over January 25th, 2011, when I turn 60.

Given where I am in my training, I will now be racing all year!

ranger
You can only row wr's in a race................ the races are over for this season, so you won,t race anymore.

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Re: The Two Types of Training

Post by hjs » March 8th, 2010, 3:13 pm

ranger wrote: I have taken my goals out of my profile.

From now on, I will just list results.
ahhhhh, finally some sense :lol:,

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Re: The Two Types of Training

Post by ranger » March 8th, 2010, 3:14 pm

lancs wrote:Can you give us any details of your latest DNF?

I'm impressed with your persistence at still calling a row you've failed at several times now an 'AT' row!!

I'm sorry you've failed with your targets for yet another season..
I don't have any targets.

I just have results.

So how can there be failure?

I am just trying to row as fast as I can, given my training.

I am now prepared to row distance trials, as long as the distance is pretty long--FM, HM, 60min, 10K, 30min.

I will race these distances soon.

I look forward to the results, whatever they might be.

I'll list these results in my signature, as I produce them.

ranger
Rich Cureton M 72 5'11" 165 lbs. 2K pbs: 6:27.5 (hwt), 6:28 (lwt)

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Re: The Two Types of Training

Post by ranger » March 8th, 2010, 3:16 pm

hjs wrote:
ranger wrote: I have taken my goals out of my profile.

From now on, I will just list results.
ahhhhh, finally some sense :lol:,
Sense?

No.

Just a different point in my rowing.

Goals are guides for training.

I am now racing, not training.

I am just trying my best to row fast.

ranger
Rich Cureton M 72 5'11" 165 lbs. 2K pbs: 6:27.5 (hwt), 6:28 (lwt)

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Re: The Two Types of Training

Post by NavigationHazard » March 8th, 2010, 3:16 pm

ranger wrote:The 2K is _severely_ anaerobic.
ranger
No it isn't. See de Campos Mello et al., Energy systems contributions in 2,000 m race simulation: a comparison among rowing ergometers and water, Eur J Appl Physiol (2009) 107:615–619.

This study investigated the energy system contributions of rowers in three different conditions: rowing on an ergometer without and with the slide and rowing in the water. For this purpose, eight rowers were submitted to 2,000 m race simulations in each of the situations defined above. The fractions of the aerobic (W AER), anaerobic alactic (W PCR) and anaerobic lactic (W [La−]) systems were calculated based on the oxygen uptake, the fast component of excess post-exercise oxygen uptake and changes in net blood lactate, respectively. In the water, the metabolic work was significantly higher [(851 (82) kJ] than during both ergometer [674 (60) kJ] and ergometer with slide [663 (65) kJ] (P ≤ 0.05). The time in the water [515 (11) s] was higher (P < 0.001) than in the ergometers with [398 (10) s] and without the slide [402 (15) s], resulting in no difference when relative energy expenditure was considered: in the water [99 (9) kJ min−1], ergometer without the slide [99.6 (9) kJ min−1] and ergometer with the slide [100.2 (9.6) kJ min−1]. The respective contributions of the W AER, W PCR and W [La−] systems were water = 87 (2), 7 (2) and 6 (2)%, ergometer = 84 (2), 7 (2) and 9 (2)%, and ergometer with the slide = 84 (2), 7 (2) and 9 (1)%. , HR and lactate were not different among conditions. These results seem to indicate that the ergometer braking system simulates conditions of a bigger and faster boat and not a single scull. Probably, a 2,500 m test should be used to properly simulate in the water single-scull race.

That's 84% aerobic on an erg, 7% anaerobic alactic and 9% anaerobic lactic.
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