The Two Types of Training

ranger · Post by **ranger** » February 19th, 2010, 4:10 am

aharmer wrote:Rich, I didn't see the 8x500 screenshot today so just wondering what time you expect to post it tomorrow? I'm honestly excited to see and hope you post it. If I remember correctly you predict 8x500, 3:30r as 2k-2 or 3 right?

So, what's your pb on 60min @ 10 MPS?

And how do you train?

That really tells the story.

The whole trick in rowing is to be effective and efficient.

Your effectiveness is reflected in your stroking power (SPI).

Your efficiency is reflected in the rate you can hold comfortably below your anaerobic threshold and therefore sustain for periods like an hour at steady state.

Combine the two, SPI and spm, at a nice ratio (10 MPS) and you have the best measure of your combined/blended effectiveness and efficiency in comfortable, daily rowing.

The ideal for a lightweight, I think, is to rate 30 spm @ 10 MPS below your anaerobic threshold.

If you can do that, you can row 18K for 60min.

You can do a comfortable 1:40 @ 30 spm (10 MPS, 11.7 SPI) for an hour.

This kind of rowing exhibits exceptional effectiveness and efficiency--simultaneously.

Then, all you need to do is sharpen up, and you are ready to race.

Sharpening is done in pretty much the same way by everyone, and yields pretty much the same benefit, about three seconds per 500 over 2K.

Therefore, what you will eventually do in a 2K is already determined before you sharpen.

It is determined by your UT effectiveness (UT2) and efficiency (UT1).

In sharpening, you don't add to your basic effectiveness (UT2) and efficiency (UT1), you just get used to (1) forcing your HR over your anaerobic threshold (AT), (2) forcing your heart rate up to max briefly (TR), and then (3) forcing your HR up to max and holding it there at max for an extended period (AN), because this is what you need to do in a 2K to race your best.

That is what I am doing now.

ranger

snowleopard · Post by **snowleopard** » February 19th, 2010, 4:20 am

ranger wrote:So, now my 2K is 6:48.

On Wednesday, it will be 6:40--and an American record.

On Friday, it will be 6:32--and a world record.

Fol de rol,
Fol de rol,
Fol de rol.

ranger · Post by **ranger** » February 19th, 2010, 4:36 am

Mike VB and I, when we are rowing well, row the same paces at the same rates with the same heart rates.

But because Mike has lost most of his aerobic capacity with age his maxHR is only 163 bpm.

Mine is 190 bpm.

Therefore, flat out, Mike can only do a 1K at about 1:39.

Even at 1:39, he gets close to his HRmax (163 bpm) at 500m and then can only hold on for another 500m.

Heck, I can't do 1:39 with my HR below 163 bpm, either.

Roiwng 1:39, my HR is at about 175 bpm.

Back in 2002-2003, in my 2Ks, I got to 1K several times at 1:36/3:12, and even so, went on to finish the 2Ks with good times (6:30, etc.), although I could keep a flatter pace in the second K and end up with a better time overall if I went 1:37/3:14 for the first K.

This year, I am hoping to get comfortable getting to 1K at 1:34/3:08 and then being able to go on, holding the pace even, for the second K, nonetheless.

My fitness is the same, but compared to 2002-2003, I have improved my effectiveness (UT2) and efficiency (UT1).

Back in 2002-2003, I was a novice who didn't know how to row (10 SPI).

I now row well (13 SPI).

We'll see for sure soon, but it seems that my improved effectiveness and efficiency has lowered my top-end UT1 pace at 10 MPS by about five seconds per 500m.

range

hjs · Post by **hjs** » February 19th, 2010, 5:14 am

TomR wrote:My stroke is now perfected.

I expect to have sex with Penelope Cruz any day now.

That would be an easy AT session.

Neither hjs nor Byron know how elegant my stroke is.

Mike VB has a weak stroke. Obviously Penelope prefers to sharpen with me.

With my perfect stroke, my heart rate will remain almost flat while Penelope and I do the horizontal 2k.

In principal, hjs will owe me $1000 US.

Sure Tom,

And if I win My next context with stroking contest with Scarlett Johansson and score WR in point's on that I will send you the money

Carl Watts · Post by **Carl Watts** » February 19th, 2010, 5:39 am

Not sure about the rest of you but I'm only looking at this thread for the pictures these days.....

ranger · Post by **ranger** » February 19th, 2010, 5:53 am

Carl Watts wrote:Not sure about the rest of you but I'm only looking at this thread for the pictures these days.....

Yea.

No reason.

Just look for race results and check out the rankings.

You might check the list of WRs, too.

That will fill you in on my doings.

I am racing at public venues every weekend.

And at other times, during the week, I am doing trials at all distances, which I am entering in the 50s lwt rankings.

By the end of the year, I should have the best times in all the races in the 50a age and weight division.

In fact, I should have all of the WRs in the age and weight division.

No need to check here for what I am doing.

ranger

ranger · Post by **ranger** » February 19th, 2010, 5:59 am

I am now getting a beautiful 1:31 @ 38 spm (12.2 SPI).

There is my pace and rate for 500s with 3:30 rest and 1K.

Again, right on my targets.

Gorgeously smooth and relaxed.

I now row well.

38 spm is a perfect rate for 1K, not too low, not too high.

At 38 spm, I can row at my full stroking power--efficiently and consistently.

Back in 2002-2003, I was doing things like 1:36 @ 40 spm (10 SPI).

Yuk.

Nowhere to go with that.

Rate is too high.

Pace is too slow.

Bad rowing.

1:31 is as fast as Mike VB can row flat out for 500m at 46 spm.

In the end, I think I'll do 500m, 1:24 @ 46 spm.

There's that seven seconds per 500m again!

ranger

PaulH · Post by **PaulH** » February 19th, 2010, 6:11 am

Ranger - you often ask people what they do for a specific distance (sometimes for particular stroke rates or other restrictions). For example:

"So, what's your pb on 60min @ 10 MPS?"

Yet you don't post such information yourself. I'm curious why you think the data you request is informative but don't share your own figures.

rjw · Post by **rjw** » February 19th, 2010, 6:30 am

ranger wrote:I am now getting a beautiful 1:31 @ 38 spm (12.2 SPI).

There is my pace and rate for 500s with 3:30 rest and 1K.

Again, right on my targets.

Gorgeously smooth and relaxed.

I now row well.

38 spm is a perfect rate for 1K, not too low, not too high.

At 38 spm, I can row at my full stroking power--efficiently and consistently.

What do you mean by this?

I think you mean that you have seen a pace of 1:31 while at a rate of 38 for 1 or 2 strokes, yet you have yet to see this for much longer let alone 500 repeats or for 1k.

Unfortunately, once again, you provide 2 out of the 3 pieces of information required to understand what you are doing as actual duration of a piece would be helpful. But no worries, you are doing a 2k today and then again on Sunday.

ranger · Post by **ranger** » February 19th, 2010, 6:34 am

PaulH wrote:Ranger - you often ask people what they do for a specific distance (sometimes for particular stroke rates or other restrictions). For example:

"So, what's your pb on 60min @ 10 MPS?"

Yet you don't post such information yourself. I'm curious why you think the data you request is informative but don't share your own figures.

Over the last seven years, I have been transforming my rowing by improving my technique.

I am just finishing this work.

Before I started this labor, I established pbs at all the distances.

My 60min pb is 16.7K/1:48.

Over the next few months, I will establish a whole new set of pbs at all of the distances.

For instance, now, I think I might do 60min at 1:43, perhaps even at 1:42.

My work on technique and stroking power is now complete.

I am now training to race.

You need to be training to race in order to race well, no?

Over the last seven years, I have been training to get better, to overcome my weaknesses, not trainiing to race, to show what I can do, despite my glaring weaknesses.

Why did I do this?

By the end of 2003, I already had three WR rows.

I was winning all of my races, even WIRC, BIRC, and EIRC, by 15 seconds.

I had lowered the 50s lwt WR by four seconds.

There really wasn't anything else interesting to do but to try to get better.

My glaring weakness was technique.

So I bought a 1x and learned to row OTW.

And on the erg, I worked endlessly to improve my technique, rowing 50 million meters at low rates and high stroking powers, concentrating on technique.

That work is now complete.

I am back to racing again.

So, if you can wait a couple of months, I will indeed give you a new set of pbs at all of the distances.

No, I don't neglect these things.

The point of training hard and well is to get fast.

ranger

ranger · Post by **ranger** » February 19th, 2010, 6:53 am

I don't know for sure, but I think that the ultimate culmination of the work I have done on effectiveness and efficiency over the last seven years will be the ability to repeat 2Ks in training (as in 4 x 2K) at 32 spm.

If this is true, the game is won.

When I rate 32 spm, I go 1:37 (12 SPI).

4 x 2K @ 1:37 predicts (at least) a 1:33 2K.

6:12

The importance of this result is multidimensional--distance, rate, pace, etc.

2K is 2K, no?

Repeating 2Ks is the best evidence for what you can do for 2K.

For instance, when you do 500s, you are really cheating various things, no?

You aren't rowing for 6-7 minutes, you are only rowing for a minute and a half.

When you row 60min or a HM, you are really cheating various things, no?

You aren't rowing very fast, relative to 2K pace, and even so, you often aren't rowing very well.

Your stroking is often lighter than you need in order to do a quality 2K.

But when you do 4 x 2K, these things are all faced up to.

You row the entire distance.

You row well.

You do it again and again.

Nice!

Game won.

NavHaz does a lot of 500s.

But I never hear him say that he does 4 x 2K.

Just my point.

He is not facing up to things.

You need to row for 6-7 minutes to do a 2K.

You need to row well.

You need to get used to it.

It needs to be doable, again and again.

I never hear that Mike VB does 4 x 2K, either.

Same thing.

He is not facing up to things.

ranger

ranger · Post by **ranger** » February 19th, 2010, 7:07 am

Before I pulled 6:29 in Baltimore in 2006, I did a nice 6 x 2K workout, with iincrementally increasing rates.

The good time I got at Baltimore, then, is not surprising.

In training, I was facing up to things.

I was rowing well.

I was rowing for 6-7 minutes, again and again.

Nice!

ranger

ranger · Post by **ranger** » February 19th, 2010, 7:07 am

Moral.

Caviston's Level 2 workouts are pretty important.

2-3K.

Again and again.

Push it.

ranger

ranger · Post by **ranger** » February 19th, 2010, 7:38 am

I saw 177 bpm on my heart rate monitor today.

Tomorrow I will see 180 bpm.

Next week, I will see 185 bpm.

ranger

ranger · Post by **ranger** » February 19th, 2010, 7:41 am

I suspect that Mike VB can't do 4 x 2K at much better than 1:47.

That's the issue.

He doesn't want to see that.

He doesn't want to face up to things.

ranger