6:28 2K

ranger · Post by **ranger** » December 3rd, 2009, 7:53 am

snowleopard wrote: So knock out a PB then

Just the intention.

Stay tuned:

St. Louis/Pittsburgh/Indianapolis (1/30-31)
Cincinnati/Toronto (2/6-7)
Boston (2/14)
Chicago/St. Catharines (2/27-28)

I should be able to pb after my distance rowing, with a hard AT 2K.

Then I will sharpen and bring my 2K time down from there, as I bring my anaerobic capacities up to speed.

ranger

hjs · Post by **hjs** » December 3rd, 2009, 1:20 pm

ranger wrote:
snowleopard wrote: So knock out a PB then
Just the intention.

Stay tuned:

St. Louis/Pittsburgh/Indianapolis (1/30-31)
Cincinnati/Toronto (2/6-7)
Boston (2/14)
Chicago/St. Catharines (2/27-28)

I should be able to pb after my distance rowing, with a hard AT 2K.

Then I will sharpen and bring my 2K time down from there.

ranger

just like 2009/08/07/06/05 and 04 not one PB though

ranger · Post by **ranger** » December 3rd, 2009, 1:25 pm

hjs wrote:not one PB

Again, false.

Over the last couple of years, I pb'd in all of my low-rate trials. For instance, I did 500r30 @ 1:30 and 1Kr24 @ 1:38.

I also pulled a 2K at 12 SPI and 31 spm (6:29.7).

That reflects the foundational, low-rate training I have been doing.

I didn't attempt any other trials, so (of course) I didn't pb in any other way.

When I am done with distance rowing this December, I will do distance trials, including a 2K.

During sharpening in January and February, I will do 500m and 1K trials.

ranger

ranger · Post by **ranger** » December 3rd, 2009, 1:28 pm

This morning before work: 90min erg, 90min bike (24 MPH).

I'll try to get in a 60min erg, 60min bike, after work, if I have the energy.

My training goal each day for this holiday season is 150min erg, 150min bike.

"Ultramarathon"

ranger

paul s · Post by **paul s** » December 3rd, 2009, 1:49 pm

This may apply to our friend Ranger.

"A healthy male adult bore consumes each year one and a half times his own weight in other people's patience." John Updike.

Paul S

Byron Drachman · Post by **Byron Drachman** » December 3rd, 2009, 2:15 pm

Ranger wrote: You row a 2K at your max HR.

hjs · Post by **hjs** » December 3rd, 2009, 2:53 pm

ranger wrote:
hjs wrote:not one PB
Again, false.

Over the last couple of years, I pb'd in all of my low-rate trials. For instance, I did 500r30 @ 1:30 and 1Kr24 @ 1:38.

ranger

Those are weak Pb 's compared to your 2k pbs, around the same time you did race 2k's and we know the outcome of those.

ranger · Post by **ranger** » December 3rd, 2009, 2:58 pm

hjs wrote:Those are weak Pb 's compared to your 2k pbs

No, they're not.

No 50s lwt can do any of them.

One or two 40s lwts _might_ be able to do them.

Some 30s lwts can do them, but not many.

Next year, I will be 60.

The 6:29.7 2K at 31 spm is only two seconds from my heavyweight pb--and at a much lower rate.

I did this 2K without any hard distance training or sharpening, just on the basis of foundational, low-rate work.

No one 55 or over and my size (e.g., who has successfully pulled 20 2Ks as a lightweight) has ever come anywhere near rowing sub-6:30.

ranger

bloomp · Post by **bloomp** » December 3rd, 2009, 3:04 pm

I'm still in disbelief he thinks that you do a 2k at a HR of 190. Maybe your HR will be 190 for the last 30 seconds of it, but you must be stupid or completely unaware of human physiology to think you average 190BPM for a 2k.

hjs · Post by **hjs** » December 3rd, 2009, 3:05 pm

ranger wrote:
hjs wrote:Those are weak Pb 's compared to your 2k pbs
No, they're not.

No 50s lwt can do any of them.

One or two 40s lwts _might_ be able to do them.

Some 30s lwts can do them, but not many.

ranger

But strangely enough those same lightweights did kick your ass, in that same season you rowed those pieces. hahahahaha

With a little bit a training it's quite easy to power true a short session. Look at last years 2k r24.

I also rowed a 3.10 1k r24, with no low rate training and on low drag. Easy as pie

ranger · Post by **ranger** » December 3rd, 2009, 3:05 pm

bloomp wrote:I'm still in disbelief he thinks that you do a 2k at a HR of 190. Maybe your HR will be 190 for the last 30 seconds of it, but you must be stupid or completely unaware of human physiology to think you average 190BPM for a 2k.

30 seconds?

Or two-three minutes?

True, the _average_ won't be 190 bpm--but that isn't the point.

When I do a 2K fully trained, I suspect that I am close to 190 bpm for the last 800m.

ranger

bloomp · Post by **bloomp** » December 3rd, 2009, 3:07 pm

yes but you don't do the damn 2k at 190 BPM, so don't talk about shit you clearly have no idea about. those were your words exactly.

ranger · Post by **ranger** » December 3rd, 2009, 3:11 pm

bloomp wrote:yes but you don't do the damn 2k at 190 BPM, so don't talk about shit you clearly have no idea about. those were your words exactly.

I don't know.

If you rowed a FM and your HR was flat at 160 bpm for the last hour, I would say that you are rowing the FM at 160 bpm, pretty much.

You wouldn't?

Who gives a crap about _average_ HR?

Sure, your heart has to get up to speed, and it takes a while for it to do that, but that's obvious, and not of much relevance to anything.

If you have to sustain a certain HR, steady state, for nearly half of a piece, the _real_ question is: what speed does it get up to?

What HR do you have to row at, stready state, for half the forkin' thing?

ranger

ranger · Post by **ranger** » December 3rd, 2009, 3:20 pm

hjs wrote:But strangely enough

No, not strange at all.

Training for short-term gains can indeed give you short-term gains.

And training for long-term gains can give you long-term gains.

Duh.

I get about a dozen seconds over 2K from hard distance rowing and about another dozen seconds from hard sharpening.

So do most people, I think.

But neither of these improves my foundational rowing--or theirs.

You get better by overcoming your weaknesses, not by racing, over and over, emphasizing your strengths and ignoring your weaknesses.

My weaknesses were foundational.

I have argued that, in this, most other veteran lightweights are similar.

Veteran heavyweights are usually just bad at everything.

ranger

P.S. Rocket Roy is on track to pull 6:46 this year. It will be interesting to see what happens. Unless he does something about his foundational rowing, his 2K will continue to fall off by two seconds per year. I am on track to row 6:16, 30 seconds faster. Back in 2003, our times were about 10 seconds apart. I pulled 6:28; Roy pulled 6:38.

snowleopard · Post by **snowleopard** » December 3rd, 2009, 5:38 pm

bloomp wrote:I'm still in disbelief he thinks that you do a 2k at a HR of 190. Maybe your HR will be 190 for the last 30 seconds of it, but you must be stupid or completely unaware of human physiology to think you average 190BPM for a 2k.

ranger's HR won't be at 190 for any of it. His max is nothing like 190.

I seem to recall at some point that this was excuse #327: "I could not get my HR above 180 therefore I was not ready to race."