6:28 2K

[ranger]

For me personally, this distance rowing is pretty much all the same.

It's like going on a 20-mile run, which I have done hundreds of times.

I just start out easy, until I am warmed up, listening to my body, slowly pushing the pace, as I feel able, until I am at my anaerobic threshold.

Then I hold it there and relax.

Steady state.

In this rowing, it is important to keep the rate high, well beyond the limits of low rate rowing, and the pressure low, well under your natural stroking power, the stroking power you use in a 2K.

I like to start at 27 spm and work up to 32spm.

With a light stroke, I pull 11 SPI.

My goal for this rowing is a continuous 30K, perhaps even a continuous FM.

So my goal for training is to do this kind of rowing for two hours a day, in various formats.

I am doing this every day, along with 1-2 hours of cross-training on my bike.

The norm, I think, is to spend as much time in cross-training as you spend in rowing.

So if you row for one hour, cross-train for one hour.

If you row for two hours, cross-train for two hours.

27 spm @ 11 SPI is 1:45 pace.

32 spm @ 11 SPI is 1:40 pace.

No 55s lwt has even done better than 1:50 for 60min.

No 60s lwt has ever done better than 1:52 for 60min.

I am now 14 months away from turning 60.

I will be 60 for WIRC 2011.

ranger

[hjs]

As I read through this a lot of this thread, I have learned some, but still have a few questions:
Do you have a link to a place where someone could read up on this method of training, and it's principals?

absolutely, here ya go, enjoy!

Ranger's stages of training
(1) Row effectively/foundational rowing (at low rates, middle distances, and high stroking power). Don't race your training!
(2) Row efficiently/hard distance rowing/pre-sharpening (at low stroking powers, long distances, and up to 30 spm). Don't race your training!
(3) Sharpening (at high rates, middling stroking powers, and short distances, 2 month's at most). Now it's time to race your training!. Get out the clock and bust it to the max!
(4) Race (at middling rates, middling stroking powers, and middling distances).

Notes:
- "Dont race your training" means: dont record the time it took to complete a distance, regardless of the rate or pace of that session, as the very act of recording the time/distace transforms a stage 1 or 2 session, into a stage 3 "sharpening" session.
- A person can only start #3 when they are within 12 seconds of their target race goal.



Rangers belief system:
1) Focus on indicidual strokes only:
- the best way to train is to focus on individual strokes. This is done by looking at the force curve, and the SPI (information that is derived from rate/pace for that one particular stroke only).

- Only "good" strokes should be taken in training, a "good" stroke is one pulled with a good force curve, at a certain SPI. Good lightweights pull 13SPI, heavy weights 16SPI.

Here are the SPM/pace combinations allowed for LW (13SPI)
20SPM - 1:50/500m
22SPM - 1:47/500m
24SPM - 1:44/500m
26SPM - 1:41/500m
28SPM - 1:38/500m
30SPM - 1:36/500m

2)On reporting what is done in training:
- Recording the time it takes to cover any distance, at any level of effort, is considered "racing your training", aka "sharpening" and is detremental to your training.

- ranger has "done" something and is free to "report" that thing as "done" in a post on training, when he feels he "can do" that thing. Actually doing the thing (in a quantifiable way) is not neccessary, and may even be detremental as it can interrupt the flow of training.
- a typical ranger training session may involve stretches of rowing at 24SPM - 1:44/500m (which would be 13SPI), with rest periods interspersed, for a total of 10k in perhaps 40 minutes which would be an averge of 2:00/500m. However, since only the "good strokes", i.e. "rowing well" count, Ranger is free to report this session as "10k at 13SPI, which is 24SPM - 1:44/500m, 28 seconds under world record 10k pace!, Nice!, there's that 7 seconds again!"


3) Regarding Weight:
- a person's weight is "at" a certain value, if at some point in the day, that person can weigh him/her self, and it's that value.
- if a person weighs in as a lightweight once during the course of a year, all of his times the remainder of the year qualify as LW times, regardless of what the actual weight was when the piece was done (after all, fat doesnt make you go faster)

Ps Regarding point 3, if any of his direct competition uses this tactic Ranger calls them fat boys, the fact that he himself on average is 15/20 point overweight makes him a F.... hahaha

If you want to be lightweight, life and train like a lightweight, walking around with lot's of dead weight and bulking up en down is not very Healty.
Imagine how bad you need to eat to train hours a day and still gain 15/20 point's of fat

[ranger]

f you want to be lightweight, life and train like a lightweight

Even though the best lightweight ergers don't do this?

Mike C. walks around at 175 lbs.

Tom Kay, as I understand, walked around at 180 lbs.

Both Rocket Roy and I walked around at weights heavier than that.

Etc.

I am at weight now, but for other reasons.

History refutes the point you are making.

I am following your advice this year, but only accidentally, and not for the reasons you cite.

ranger

[snowleopard]

My target for the rest of the fall and winter is two hours on the erg followed by two hours on my bike.

When are you going to sharpen?

No one wins a 2K because of their sharpening.

Really? You claim to gain 12 seconds by sharpening. Without sharpening you would be 12 seconds slower in a 2K. By your reasoning it's impossible to win a 2K without sharpening.

[ranger]

Henry--

Do you have any personal experience with lightweight rowiing?

If so, how much?

ranger

[ranger]

By your reasoning it's impossible to win a 2K without sharpening.

Agreed.

Unless you are over 12 seconds better than your competition, as I have been.

In 2006, I set the 55s lwt BIRC championship record, which still stands, without sharpening.

Yes, I won gold.

I had the best 2K time in my age and weight division last year by three seconds without sharpening, heck, without even doing distance rowing.

In 2006, I pulled 6:29.7 without sharpening.

To pull 6:16, I need to do 4 x 2K @ 1:38.

1:38/6:32 is six seconds under the 55s lwt WR; 10 seconds under the 60s lwt WR.

4 x 2K is done at 2K + 4.

4 x 2K is not really a sharpening session.

The intervals are too long.

8 x 500 and 4 x 1K are sharpening sessions.

My point is not that sharpening isn't necessary to race your best 2K.

My point is that everyone gets about the same benefit from sharpening (a dozen seconds or so over 2K), so if everyone sharpens before they race, no one ever gets an _advantage_ on their competition by sharpening.

In this respect, foundational rowing and distance rowing are entirely different.

ranger

[ranger]

Because of these things, while sharpening is irrelevant and can be delayed as long as necessary, it is impossible to spend too much time or expend too much effort on your distance rowing.

If you row well, have balanced abilities, and give it your all for as long as you continue to improve, your 2K is determined--mechanically, automatically, inevitably--by the quality of your distance rowing.

30K is done at 2K + 13.

So, to do 1:34 for 2K, I need to do 1:47 for 30K.

At 10 MPS, 1:47 is 28 spm.

So that's what I am doing from day to day.

A lot of distance rowing in and around 28 spm (27-32 spm).

My target for this fall and winter is to do two hours of 10 MPS @ 28 spm a day, in various formats, followed by two hours of cross-training on my bike.

ranger

[snowleopard]

Unless you are over 12 seconds better than your competition, as I have been. In 2006, I set the 55s lwt BIRC championship record, which still stands, without sharpening.

What was your winning margin at Euro 2006 when the competition turned up?

without even doing distance rowing.

So you were lying about the thousands of meters that your rowed in training?

My point is

Do you ever have a point? And do you ever get to it?

[ranger]

Unless you are over 12 seconds better than your competition, as I have been. In 2006, I set the 55s lwt BIRC championship record, which still stands, without sharpening.

What was your winning margin at Euro 2006 when the competition turned up?

without even doing distance rowing.

So you were lying about the thousands of meters that your rowed in training?

My point is

Do you ever have a point? And do you ever get to it?

Since 2003, I have been doing foundational rowing, both OTW and on the erg, working on my weaknesses, learning to row effectively/well by improving my technique and stroking power.

Foundational rowing is done at 16-26 spm, with a heavy stroke, for lightweights, in and around 13 SPI.

Foundational rowingi is not distance rowing.

Distance rowing is done at 27-32 spm, with a light stroke, for lightweights, in and around 11 SPI.

I am now doing distance rowing.

When I am done with distance rowing, I will sharpen and race.

I get about a dozen seconds each over 2K from distance rowing and sharpening.

So, when I am done with sharpening and race, I'll pull 6:16 for 2K, not 6:40.

I have made these points repeatedly.

They are crystal clear.

ranger

[hjs]

This thread is about a 6.28 row.

Dangy ,

When will your first race be this season? will you row this as a lightweight and what time are you aiming for in that first warm uo race?

[ranger]

This thread is about a 6.28 row.

Dangy ,

When will your first race be this season? will you row this as a lightweight and what time are you aiming for in that first warm uo race?

I am just doing distance rowing now.

Goals:

FM @ 1:48
30K @ 1:47
20K @ 1:45
60min @ 1:44
10K @ 1:42
30min @ 1:41
6K @ 1:40
5K @ 1:39

After this, with a little sharpening, a 6:16 2K is a lock.

ranger

[hjs]

This thread is about a 6.28 row.

Dangy ,

When will your first race be this season? will you row this as a lightweight and what time are you aiming for in that first warm uo race?

I am just doing distance rowing now.

Goals:

My year's long, never seen from close goals stated in my signature

After this, with a little sharpening, a will whop that fucking 618 from Mike C

ranger

So you saying I will never race again. Coward

[ranger]

No need to sharpen or do a 2K to find out what you are capable of.

If your abilities and training are balanced, as mine are, you can read your 2K score right off of your distance trials: FM, HM, 60min, 10K, 30min, 6K, 5K.

Your 2K is only as good as your 60min row.

So you can never spend too much time on distance rowing.

No one ever improved their 2K by sharpening.

Everyone sharpens the same way, with pretty much the same benefit.

Foundational rowing and distance rowing are something else entirely.

All improvements come from these sources, not from sharpening.

Unless you already row well, you can never spend too much time on your foundational rowing (although once you row well, you don't have to do any foundational rowing at all).

Another good name for foundational rowing is "Learn to Row."

ranger

[hjs]

This thread is about a 6.28 row.

Dangy ,

When will your first race be this season? will you row this as a lightweight and what time are you aiming for in that first warm uo race?

I am just doing distance rowing now.

Goals:

My year's long, never seen from close goals stated in my signature

After this, with a little sharpening, a will whop that fucking 618 from Mike C

ranger

So you are saying I will never race again?

[rjw]

No one ever improved their 2K by sharpening.

Except for you who gains 12 seconds by sharpening!