6:28 2K

[ranger]

I have now stabilized my target rates for the various distance rows:

FM 26 spm
HM 27 spm
60min 28 spm
10K 29 spm
30min 30spm
6K 31 spm
5K 32 spm

I will race my 2Ks at 36 spm, as I did back in 2002-2003.

ranger

[hjs]

Simply stating facts

Yes, these are indeed the facts:

When I am fully trained, I row my 2Ks with perfectly flat splits.

Back in 2002-2003, I was fully trained.

For my next public race, I will again be fully trained.

ranger

Yes you will be fully trained, just like the seasons before, you just will be slower again. Father time................

[ranger]

Father time

Father time does not undermine technique.

Just the opposite.

Novices row like shit.

Time cures these ills.

BTW, the most important technical details for me now are (1) to be patient at the catch, waiting until I am at full slide, with my chest fully forward against my thighs, so that I get a both full leg drive and a full back swing, (2) to have my toes pointed and therefore my legs finishing before the handle is past my feet, and (3) to keep my pull low, level, and complete at the finish.

These things are all _very_ easy to track and keep in order.

So, holding my technique steady is no longer a mental strain.

I just need to make sure that, on my drives, I am getting good beginnings, middles, and ends.

Result?

1:44 @ 27 spm (11.5 SPI)

ranger

[ranger]

you just will be slower

Better to be exact about these things.

For older rowers, the minimal decline in a 2K score due to loss of aerobic capacity is .3 seconds per year.

So, minimally, my decline over the last six years due to loss of aerobic capacity will be about 2 seconds over 2K.

What will my gain be from learning to row well, rather than continuing to rowl like shit, as I did as a novice back in 2002-2003?

My guess is 3-4 seconds per 500m in a 2K, about 14 seconds.

Net gain: 12 seconds over 2K.

3 seconds per 500m.

ranger

[hjs]

you just will be slower

Better to be exact about these things.


ranger

ok last season you rowed between 7.00 and 6.41 on av 6.52

This season that will be av 6.54 arso



Ps you net gain from 2003 up until 2009 was minus 13 seconds hahaha math that will always be above you

[ranger]

you just will be slower

Better to be exact about these things.


ranger

ok last season you rowed between 7.00 and 6.41 on av 6.52

This season that will be av 6.54 arso

No in several ways.

First, no, last year, I didn't prepare to race; so there is no way to compare what I did last year, when I wasn't fully trained, to what I did in 2002-2003, when I was fully trained.

Last year, I was just doing low rate foundational training; I did no hard distance rowing or sharpening.

Second, no, my better races last year were not randomly distributed; my 2K times came down steadily as the weeks of racing went.

6:48, 6:43, 6:41

This just shows the effect on my 2K of doing some hard aerobic and anaerbic work, even if it was only during my races on the weekends.

ranger

[ranger]

Well, so goes the talk.

We disagree.

We'll find out who is right long before I start racing 2Ks.

In fact, my first distance trial will tell the story:

HM @ 27 spm

A HM is done at 2K + 11

My HM pb is 1:49.

ranger

[hjs]

Well, so goes the talk.

We disagree.


ranger

I don,t think we disagree.
I look at facts, you write down your dreams. That's the difference.

[ranger]

Well, so goes the talk.

We disagree.


ranger

I don,t think we disagree.
I look at facts, you write down your dreams. That's the difference.

I understand your point of view, given your commitment and beliefs, but it is certainly not a fact that applies generally, to everyone.

For you, learning is a dream.

For others, it is a reality.

ranger

[chgoss]

Well, so goes the talk.

We disagree.

We'll find out who is right long before I start racing 2Ks.

In fact, my first distance trial will tell the story:

HM @ 27 spm

A HM is done at 2K + 11

My HM pb is 1:49.

ranger

It's not clear from the post above, what you anticipate your time for the HM will be, so I thought it would be useful to provide this information:

You must be within 12 seconds of your 2k goal before you start sharpening (which this trial is intended to show), so 6:18 + 12 sec = 6:30 2k which is 1:37.5/500m

1:37.5 + 11sec = 1:48.5 (A HM is done at 2K + 11)
21,097m at 1:48.5 = 1:16.18

so, to demonstrate that you are within 12 seconds of your target 6:18 2k, and are therefor ready for sharpening, you need to row a 1:16.18 HM.

took me 3 edits to get the math right...

[hjs]

Well, so goes the talk.

We disagree.


ranger

I don,t think we disagree.
I look at facts, you write down your dreams. That's the difference.

I understand your point of view, given your commitment and beliefs, but it is certainly not a fact that applies generally, to everyone.

For you, learning is a dream.

For others, it is a reality.

ranger

I certainly believe in learning, but I also believe that learning results in progress, not in a linear way, but in steps you should improve, not matter what you are learning. So if this progress is there it has nothing to do with dreaming, it is very real.
So looking at your post you again got it wrong

[ranger]

Well, so goes the talk.

We disagree.

We'll find out who is right long before I start racing 2Ks.

In fact, my first distance trial will tell the story:

HM @ 27 spm

A HM is done at 2K + 11

My HM pb is 1:49.

ranger

It's not clear from the post above, what you anticipate your time for the HM will be, so I thought it would be useful to provide this information:

You must be within 12 seconds of your 2k goal before you start sharpening (which this trial is intended to show), so 6:18 + 12 sec = 6:30 2k which is 1:37.5/500m

1:37.5 + 11sec = 1:48.5 (A HM is done at 2K + 11)
21,097m at 1:48.5 = 1:16.18

so, to demonstrate that you are within 12 seconds of your target 6:18 2k, and are therefor ready for sharpening, you need to row a 1:16.18 HM.

took me 3 edits to get the math right...

I am training.

You are doing random calculations.

Distance rowing is done _before_ sharpening.

At the end of your disetance rowing, you don't do your best 2K.

You are a dozen seconds short.

You will be a dozen seconds better after you have done hard sharpening.

Nonetheless, your distance trials still must predict your best 2K, after you are completely trainied.

I will need to do a HM at 1:45, not 1:49, in my distance rowing, if I want to be able to do a 2K at 1:34.

ranger

[ranger]

I also believe that learning results in progress

To test progress you need to have identical conditions.

When I am again fully trained, those conditions will be met and the progress (or lack thereof) can be measured.

Testing progress is not as important as making progress.

If you just train to race, that is, to test your progress, you only work on your strengths, not your weaknesses.

But you only get better if you work on your weaknesses, in fact, for people like me, if you work _exclusively_ on your weaknesses.

So it goes.

ranger

[hjs]

I also believe that learning results in progress

To test progress you need to have identical conditions.


ranger

No you don,t

For an aerobic sport like running, cycling, swimming, rowing progress is very easy to see, you will be faster overall. No matter what moment of the season you are in. You simply are worse in every aspect of your training compared to 2003, that is nothing strange about that. It's simply you age.

[chgoss]

Well, so goes the talk.

We disagree.

We'll find out who is right long before I start racing 2Ks.

In fact, my first distance trial will tell the story:

HM @ 27 spm

A HM is done at 2K + 11

My HM pb is 1:49.

ranger

It's not clear from the post above, what you anticipate your time for the HM will be, so I thought it would be useful to provide this information:

You must be within 12 seconds of your 2k goal before you start sharpening (which this trial is intended to show), so 6:18 + 12 sec = 6:30 2k which is 1:37.5/500m

1:37.5 + 11sec = 1:48.5 (A HM is done at 2K + 11)
21,097m at 1:48.5 = 1:16.18

so, to demonstrate that you are within 12 seconds of your target 6:18 2k, and are therefor ready for sharpening, you need to row a 1:16.18 HM.

took me 3 edits to get the math right...

I am training.

You are doing random calculations.

Distance rowing is done _before_ sharpening.

At the end of your disetance rowing, you don't do your best 2K.

You are a dozen seconds short.

You will be a dozen seconds better after you have done hard sharpening.

Nonetheless, your distance trials still must predict your best 2K, after you are completely trainied.

I will need to do a HM at 1:45, not 1:49, in my distance rowing, if I want to be able to do a 2K at 1:34.

ranger

Think my math is correct..

Your target is a 6:18 2k, which is a pace of 1:34.5
If you row a 6:30 2k (1:37.5), you would be within 12 seconds of your goal.

Instead of rowing a 6:30 2k, you could also row a "predictor HM" at the 6:30 2k+11. IOW you're saying that a 6:30 2k is equivalent to a HM at 1:48.5.