6:28 2K

hjs · Post by **hjs** » October 14th, 2009, 2:59 am

ranger wrote:
hjs wrote:you will do the pieces just like you did the former seasons, but you are to chicken to tell the results.
This is all in your head, Henry.

I haven't done any standard sharpening workouts since 2003, so on these matters, there has been nothing to report.

ranger

Hmmm didn,t you put some of those not done sessions not on youtube ?

Come on man, last season you did so many 2k 's, those alone where more sharpening then most do, and indeed it gave the that 12 seconds, even more, your best was 6.41, you started out just below 7.00
So that 12 seconds rule of yours is soft, it's more

ranger · Post by **ranger** » October 14th, 2009, 4:24 am

hjs wrote:Come on man, last season you did so many 2k 's, those alone where more sharpening then most do

"Most"?

Who are they?

Sure, "most" don't do much at all.

No foundational training.

Short distance rowing.

A bit of sharpening.

No cross-training.

"Most" 60s lwts pull 7:16, if they are good, not 6:16.

Last year, 7:15 would have pull you in the 90th percentile.

The average was 8:13

The best was 6:52

RANKING RESULTS 2009

Indoor Rower | Individual and Race Results | 2000m | Men's | Lightweight | Ages 60-69 | 2009 Season
Average Time: 8:13.3
PERCENTILES
90th 75th 50th 25th
7:14.9 7:30.8 7:56.2 8:28.0

1 Brian Bailey 62 Cheltenham GBR 6:51.8 RACE
2 Robert Lakin 60 USA 7:00.6 RACE
3 Gregory Brock 61 santa cruz ca USA 7:02.2 RACE
4 Leif Pedersen 63 DNK 7:02.3 RACE
5 Leif Pedersen 63 DEN 7:02.6 RACE
6 Michael Brownjohn 60 Upminster Essex GBR 7:05.2 IND
7 Henry Baker 61 Santa Barbara CA USA 7:05.4 RowPro
8 Rick Bayko 61 Newburyport MA USA 7:06.7 RACE
9 Alain Mangin 60 FRA 7:09.1 RACE
10 Bob Lakin 60 Wichita KS USA 7:09.4 IND
11 Timothy Foley 60 Coopersburg PA USA 7:10.5 IND
12 Jeffrey Watling 62 GBR 7:11.8 RACE
13 John Exley 61 GBR 7:12.9 RACE
14 George Meredith 60 Gravesend Kent GBR 7:13.5 IND
15 Gerald Lawson 61 Winona MN USA 7:14.3 RACE
16 David Aldridge 60 Maidenhead GBR 7:14.9 RACE
16 Greg Reddan 62 AUS 7:14.9 RACE
18 George Meredith 60 GBR 7:15.1 RACE
18 Jean christophe SABROUX 60 FRA 7:15.1 RACE
20 Hugh Conway 60 St. Pats TOW Club Co. Armagh IRL 7:15.8 IND_V
21 Peter Francis 60 Denver CO USA 7:16.4 RACE
22 Georges Gainard 62 Espelette Pyrénées-Atlantiques FRA 7:19.8 RACE

ranger

hjs · Post by **hjs** » October 14th, 2009, 5:28 am

ranger wrote:
hjs wrote:Come on man, last season you did so many 2k 's, those alone where more sharpening then most do
"Most"?
Who are they?
Sure, "most" don't do much at all.

ranger

Who ? 90% plus of the forum, also you competition, you know those guys that do show up at mayer races and pick up the prizes

I myself did only 1 2 k last season

Yes I know I am leazy, slow , cripple etc

Still 30 seconds faster than your av 2k last year.

ranger · Post by **ranger** » October 14th, 2009, 7:36 am

hjs wrote:
ranger wrote:
hjs wrote:Come on man, last season you did so many 2k 's, those alone where more sharpening then most do
"Most"?
Who are they?
Sure, "most" don't do much at all.

ranger
Who ? 90% plus of the forum, also you competition, you know those guys that do show up at mayer races and pick up the prizes

I myself did only 1 2 k last season Yes I know I am leazy, slow , cripple etc

Still 30 seconds faster than your av 2k last year.

Congrats on your 2K last year.

I haven't prepared to race for six years, although I am now.

For the last six years, I have been training myself to reach my full potential, whatever that might be.

As I have been mentioning, I think that my full potential is 6:16.

My major weakness back in 2003 was techique, so I have tried to overcome that weakness by learning to row well, both OTW and off.

It took a while, but my work on technique is done.

I am back to racing (distance trials, sharpening, etc.).

It will be interesting to see how much time I gain over my competition from my improved technique.

I can't gain any time in a 2K by being in better physical condition than I was in 2003.

At best, physically, I can only be the same (with a couple of seconds lost to a decline in aerobic capacity with age).

My lwt 6:28 when I was just a couple months shy of 53 years old is just about equal in achievement to 6:25 at 50, the 50s lwt WR.

If I pull 6:16 when I am 60, as I think I will, I will break the 60s lwt WR of 6:42 by 26 seconds, the 50s lwt WR by 9 seconds, and the 40s lwt WR by two seconds.

If I pull 6:16 at 60, since I was 50, I will have gotten better by about a second a year, while my competition will have slowed down by 1.7 seconds a year.

Net gain:

26 seconds, almost seven seconds per 500m.

There's that seven seconds per 500m again!

ranger

hjs · Post by **hjs** » October 14th, 2009, 7:55 am

ranger wrote:
hjs wrote:
ranger wrote: "Most"?
Who are they?
Sure, "most" don't do much at all.

ranger
Who ? 90% plus of the forum, also you competition, you know those guys that do show up at mayer races and pick up the prizes

I myself did only 1 2 k last season Yes I know I am leazy, slow , cripple etc

Still 30 seconds faster than your av 2k last year.

Congrats on your 2Ks last year.

Congrat's ? why, there was nothing speciale or good about that 2k.

What was good though was my judgement of your 2k time, I predected almost spot on what you would do, that's what deserves a congrat's

Plus a 1000 $

ranger · Post by **ranger** » October 14th, 2009, 8:00 am

hjs wrote:What was good though was my judgement of your 2k time, I predected almost spot on what you would do, that's what deserves a congrat's
Plus a 1000 $

Yes, I am sure you'll be happy to settle our bets when the time comes, and that time is coming very soon.

$2000 will come in handy for the Christmas Holidays.

A little vacation on the beach, under the warm sun?

ranger

snowleopard · Post by **snowleopard** » October 14th, 2009, 8:15 am

ranger wrote:"Most" 60s lwts pull 7:16, if they are good, not 6:16.

No 60 year old lwt is ever going to pull 6:16.

You might break the 60+ lwt world record, which is really what this is all about. In the last few years you haven't been competitive at < 60 so you have chosen not to compete. You are just waiting for an opportunity to put yourself back in the limelight in the 60+ group.

It's hilarious that someone would put so much effort into breaking an indoor rowing age group world record.

hjs · Post by **hjs** » October 14th, 2009, 10:13 am

ranger wrote:
hjs wrote:What was good though was my judgement of your 2k time, I predected almost spot on what you would do, that's what deserves a congrat's
Plus a 1000 $
Yes, I am sure you'll be happy to settle our bets when the time comes, and that time is coming very soon.

$2000 will come in handy for the Christmas Holidays.

A little vacation on the beach, under the warm sun?

ranger

I don,t need your money for that, although you do ow me

ranger · Post by **ranger** » October 14th, 2009, 2:40 pm

snowleopard wrote:It's hilarious that someone would put so much effort into breaking an indoor rowing age group world record

Break an indoor rowing age group record?

Been there, done that.

Over and over and over.

No need to do it again.

My goal now is to pull a lwt 6:16 at 60.

Different matter entirely.

A lwt 6:16 at 60 is the equivalent of a sub-6:00 hwt 2K at 60.

Interesting project!

A lwt 6:16 on the erg meets the qualifying standard for the US National Team.

ranger

snowleopard · Post by **snowleopard** » October 14th, 2009, 3:14 pm

ranger wrote:My goal now is to pull a lwt 6:16 at 60.

Different matter entirely.

What was your last lwt 2K score?

What progression is there in your training that facilitates a move from your last lwt 2K score to a 6:16?

And if that really is your goal, why do you spend an inordinate amount of time analyzing the ranking results of your peers?

ranger wrote:A lwt 6:16 on the erg meets the qualifying standard for the US National Team.

And that should tell you all you need to know

thepiesky

ranger · Post by **ranger** » October 14th, 2009, 5:19 pm

snowleopard wrote:What progression is there in your training that facilitates a move from your last lwt 2K score to a 6:16?

I have reported this progression continuously and exhaustively.

My major weakness was technique.

My fitness was great.

But I rowed like shit.

The goal was to learn to row effectively and efficiently.

That work is now done.

I can now row well (13 SPI) at 10 MPS.

Fait accompli.

So we'll now see what happens as a result of this in my racing.

I am now training to race.

ranger

ranger · Post by **ranger** » October 14th, 2009, 5:27 pm

hjs wrote:No 60 year old lwt is ever going to pull 6:16.

Why?

It has now been determined that the minimal decline with age in rowing is .3 seconds a year over 2K.

That means that, at some point, a 60-year-old lwt will row 6:10.

My aim is much more modest.

6:16.

I pulled a lwt 6:28 when I was just shy of 53, even though I was a total novice who didn't know how to row.

In rowing, I don't think that 4 seconds per 500m is too much to expect as an improvement from good technique.

We'll soon see.

Rowing is significantly technical.

It is not just a big heave-ho.

After you are in tip top physical condition, rowing is all about effectiveness and efficiency--technique.

So that's what I have been working on.

That work is now done.

So I am again training to race.

ranger

JohnBove · Post by **JohnBove** » October 14th, 2009, 6:28 pm

ranger wrote:I am now training to race.

ranger

How about you put this in your tag line and date it, so that five years from now ... oh right, I forgot. Then you wouldn't be able to keep lying about your training.

chgoss · Post by **chgoss** » October 14th, 2009, 7:08 pm

JohnBove wrote:
ranger wrote:I am now training to race.

ranger
How about you put this in your tag line and date it, so that five years from now ... oh right, I forgot. Then you wouldn't be able to keep lying about your training.

Dont forget, Ranger isnt saying he's currently sharpening.. He's in stage #2, and has repeatedly stated that he will not proceed to step #3 until he does one of:
1) a 6:28 in home trial
2) 17,307 meters in 60 minutes (1:44 pace).
3) 10k in under 34 minutes (1:42 pace)

Posted: Oct 9, 2009 2:09 pm

ranger wrote:

chgoss wrote:Never mind, I found it.. you are in stage #2 below..

Code: Select all

Ranger's stages of training 
(1) Row effectively/foundational rowing (at low rates, middle distances, and high stroking power). Don't race your training!
(2) Row efficiently/hard distance rowing/pre-sharpening (at low stroking powers, long distances, and up to 30 spm). Don't race your training!
(3) Sharpening (at high rates, middling stroking powers, and short distances, 2 month's at most). Now it's time to race your training!. Get out the clock and bust it to the max!
(4) Race (at middling rates, middling stroking powers, and middling distances).

Notes: 
- "Dont race your training" means: dont record the time it took to complete a distance, regardless of the rate or pace of that session, as the very act of recording the time/distace transforms a stage 1 or 2 session, into a stage 3 "sharpening" session.
- A person can only start #3 when they are within 12 seconds of their target race goal.

Yes.

ranger

kini62 · Post by **kini62** » October 14th, 2009, 7:09 pm

ranger wrote:
So I am again training to race.

ranger

I've only been reading this thread for a couple of weeks, but.....

RACE ALREADY! GET IT OVER WITH!

Are you really going to train for another 2 years, since you're 58 and are not planning to "race" until you're 60?

Plop your butt down on your erg and race a 2k. Upload the time so we can see where you're at in your training.

I'm very interested to see how close you are to your goals.
Gene